Hi, I'm new but I couldn't help but want to sent some thoughts to you. I think it is over when you decide it is over - I don't believe relationships ever really end just because of a divorce and when children are involved it is the same. Anyway, I believe that when marriages breakdown it is because the old patterns have run their course. As long as we are alive, it is natural to grow and growth requires changes. When we fight those natural changes things begin to breakdown. The breakdown is just a signal that things need to move in a different direction. Figuring that stuff out is the hard part for most of us which is why we are here talking it out with others on the same journey. We may all have different journey's and lessons to learn but sharing where we are and how we are doing almost always helps the next person out. As relationships grow and change so do we and so does our partner. Sometimes the changes clash and sometimes we are on different routes but the goal/committment is to stay the course the best way we can. That means we will be redefining the meaning of our relationship many times over the course of a lifetime - ask someone who has longevity. Relationships require flexibility within the committment. Doing things differently or at least trying out new ways to react or interact will reveal what will work for this part of the journey and it will probably change again later on. So, one way of looking at changes is see them as temporary in a manner of speaking. Giving up often introduces a period of letting go of the things that are not working and encouraging a new way to imagine doing things. Hope these thoughts are helpful. M