Maybe I should be in piecing part 5?

[hopeful4her]

Sorry H4U, but I'm sure you just finished watching one HELL of a game.

I had to come bye and say "Hook 'Em Horns".

Close game.

[InLikeFlynn]

That was a great 2nd half of football!!! I thought for sure they were going to regret not getting at least a easy FG at the end of the half. But got a stupid pick. Still great game!!

[Hope4us]

Yes, definitely a good game, although the outcome sucked

But the Colt McCoy interview after the game? "No offense to OSU, but I don't think anyone could beat us right now"? Um, were you playing in the same game I just watched?

Back to Puppy's comment. I think you're right Pup. The way things are going, there's going to need to be a push at some point. Hope I'm wrong, but I just think we're stuck right now. Where we're at, W doesn't have to go anywhere. She doesn't have to face anything.

So after thinking about it last night, I've figured out a way to get where I want to go. I'll just keep up the friendship for now. continue having a good time, showing W my changes, etc. At some point the transfer will come up in conversation. She knows it was supposed to happen in January, so she'll be curious. When it comes up, I'll tell her that transfer fell through, but that I'm still going to be pursuing a transfer and if things are still the same between us when the move does happen (which it will at some point), then I will be moving with S16 and she can stay here.

Pretty much the same result as if the transfer did happen.

So now I just see us continuing to get along great, like last night and this morning and there will come a time when I can't take it anymore and the push will happen and then we'll see.

And Sandi, no offense taken. I could tell from your post there was some confusion there. I highly respect your opinions and look forward to your posts, both to me and to others (that is when I have time to read a novel ).

[whatdidido]

Hope,

Why not just sit and talk to her at length about this, without the ultimatum? You guys are at a better place. Maybe wait until the bed comes, give it a week, and then talk. Do you really think if you said that the only way you can heal this relationship is for you two to go to counseling or retrouvaille or whatever that she would say, "No, let's divorce."? In fact, if she is just waiting it out like you fear, this would be a good time to ask her to do some of these things because she doesn't want to leave NOW.

[Hope4us]

Good Point WDID. Give her an opportunity to step up before "the bomb"?

That's a really good idea. Have an R talk even though we're not supposed to and see where we're at. And then if she balks, I can tell her of my plans. Kind of give her the option.

I like it. Really like it. Thank you.

The way I'm seeing it now, my time line is some time around the end of Feb for this talk to happen. We've got a fun night out of town planned for the 17th and then a wedding to go to in mid-Feb, also out of town, so if those aren't a couple things that can stir feelings in her, I don't know what can.

[Hope4us]

Haven't posted in a week so I thought I'd throw out an update.

Things have been really good at home. W and I doing lots of stuff together, having lots of fun. I've noticed her quite a few times looking at me when I'm not looking at her. I've noticed her deep in thought a number of times the last week or so. We've had some great conversations with me doing a lot of validating lately. Last night W said the rest of her month was going to suck at work because of some labor talks going on that she's involved in. I told her I understood it was going to be tough on her and I would be here to support her and do anything to help around the house I could while this was all going on.

On Saturday, I asked W if she wanted to go to the wedding of one of the guys who works for me. We'll spend the night after the wedding. I had thought back to Thanksgiving and Christmas and the parties that go with those holiday's and how W wanted to go but wouldn't commit to going until I specifically asked her if she wanted to go. So I thought I'd formally ask her about the wedding even though we'd discussed it previously. When I did ask, she kind of made this noise like "don't be stupid, of course I want to go".

And then Saturday night, W flips it over to that stupid "Bachelor" show. S16 makes some comment about how stupid it is to think that you go on a couple of fantasy dates and you find your "soulmate" in that short of time. I make some comments about how he's so right, that how can someone be your "soulmate" in such a short time when it's all fantasy crap that brought them together, and W surprisingly agrees.

So this is all good right? Progress right? Then why do I feel so indifferent as to whether we make it or not? I mean, yesterday, as we were getting ready to watch the Steelers kick SD's butt, W went and showered and came downstairs in the new Steelers jersey I'd bought her right after Christmas. And she looked HOT. I told her she looked great in the jersey. And she just kind of gave me the "yeah, whatever" look and grunt. Why would W obviously love comments like that when it was OM giving them to her, but when I compliment her that way it's like she doesn't believe I'm being sincere.

So I just sat there thinking, "what's the point"? I'm not even really angry anymore. Sure, I still have my moments when I get mad at what she's done and her unwillingness to accept any blame in the breakdown of our marriage and her unwillingness to actually try to repair the damage that was done, but I'm just becoming more and more detached from the situation and with that comes indifference as to whether we make it or not.

I just keep having this overriding feeling that she has an affair and all the fun and excitement that she felt while having it, the affair ends and she doesn't do any kind of work or self reflection as to why it happened or anything that could help ME heal from the betrayal, all the while, good ole H4U sits here working his A** off holding this family together trying to show her what our marriage COULD be like while getting NOTHING in return. And it just makes me feel indifferent.

And that scares me. The opposite of love is not hate, but indifference right? Well, I'm rapidly getting there.

I just read on Snow White's thread her H NOW wants to try to make it work and she's struggling as to whether to give it a try or not. I see myself in that same place. You just get so tired of trying that if/when the WAS figures it out, it's too late. Seen it too many times on this board and a couple times with friends/peers at work, in real life. And I find myself thinking the same things.

Ok, just some random feelings I've been having lately. I leave town for work for a couple nights this afternoon. Going out to dinner/drinks with a couple of really good friends tonight. And I just keep thinking, boy, it'll be good to be away. And I'm thinking I probably won't even call her when I'm away. I don't know. Maybe I will, but not because I feel like I want to, but more because I just should, ya know?

Ok, thanks for listening. I'm sorry I haven't posted on others threads lately, but just felt like I needed a little break. I'll try to catch up and post where I feel I can help.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

H4U,

Congrats on your Steelers kicking Chargers AZZZZ!!!

I had PIT in our office pool, and needed the "W". Great defense always beats great offense in the postseason!

Puppy

[Hope4us]

Thanks Pup! Amazing what Big Ben can do when he gets time to throw! And that was a direct result of Willie P being healthy for the first time all year.

Super Bowl here we come!

[whatdidido]

Hope,

Yes, this is all good. Yes, this is progress. WHy do you feel indifferent? Because you have made yourself this way to deal with the chance she may leave you. You have built up a defense mechanism against pain...a wall, if you will. Just like she had built, but for different reasons.

I can explain that "yeah whatever" grunt she gave you when you complimented her on the shirt she wore. I'm the same way. For YEARS my H didn't compliment me on things, and now he does. It's like...hmmmmm....is he just saying it because he knows I like it, or is it truly what he is thinking? That's what goes through my head. It's also in the way it is said. You said you thought she looked hot. Why not tell her that EXACT thought. It's lots better than, "You look great!" It's sexier, and makes a woman feel sexy. All women are different. That's how I feel about it anyway. Others may like the general "great" comment. My guess is she liked the compliment even though she acted like it didn't matter to her. You have to just keep doing it so she knows you really feel this way. If you stop, she knows you did it just cause she likes it. It shouldn't matter to you how she responds. YOu just think it so you say it. WHo cares how she responds. You didn't do it for any other reason than you were saying your thoughts out loud, right?

The detaching you are doing is unhealthy. You have a wife that wants to stay with you and is trying, and you are still detaching so you don't get hurt. SHe is trying to break down the wall she built, and you are just adding more cement to yours.

You say she isn't doing the work, but do you realize that most of the betrayer's work is emotional...it's all in her head the work she is doing. The work YOU want her to do needs you to ask her for it. If you want her to do something for YOU, then you need to ask her to do it. If it is a deal breaker for you if she doesn't, then you need to tell her that. You just mentioning the things you want her to do, and then telling her that you won't have relationship talks doesn't make sense. YOu tell her one thing and feel another and all this time she is getting farther and farther away from you and she is just doing what she thinks is helping her get through this. You want her to read the books and go to counseling and talk about the affair (which she is trying to forget) and to her, that is not what is going to help. She knows herself. BUT...if it is the only thing that will help YOU...you need to tell her that.

YOu both are struggling as to whether to make it work because it seems as if both of you have one foot out the door (just in case). You either decide to make it work no matter what, or you don't. I know it isn't as easy as that. It's hard. Staying together after infidelity is the hardest thing for both of you to do. There are risks and emotions and all of this "baggage". Wouldn't it be easier to just give up and start fresh? That's what is going through your heads.

So you are going out of town. GOod to be away, huh? Easier than dealing with this crud, isn't it? What if you don't call her? YOu don't think she'd call you? Why is that?

WDID

[Puppy Dog Tails]

YOu both are struggling as to whether to make it work because it seems as if both of you have one foot out the door (just in case). You either decide to make it work no matter what, or you don't.

WDID,

I can definitely see a lot of that dynamic in my own relationship with the fetching Mrs. Puppy. I think there's a lot of truth to that.

But do you really see H4H's wife trying? Because see, I don't, and I don't think H4U does either, and I think the "trying" is really, really, REALLY important to us LBSs, especially us HD ones. I think if we could really KNOW that our FWAWs/AWAWs were trying, and perhaps were just poor at showing it, or maybe they're showing it in their own LL instead of ours, it would really help us.

Puppy