When do the tears go away ?

[still hopeful]

whitney,

Most of what you will receive from others is INSPIRATION, not MOTIVATION. You have plenty of motive to sort out your situation. Many times what I need is to be inspired again; to be infused with energy and re-focused purpose.

Yes, I have been at my reconciliation process 2 years longer than you have, but that does not mean that I have all of the answers in my situation and I certainly don't have them for yours. As my friend, frank_D, pointed out to me long ago, I know me, my wife, our history and our interactions, better than anyone else could possibly know them. You live your sitch. You can't possibly fill anyone else on ALL of the details of what happens between you and your wife. What does all of this mean? It means that you relate your sitch to others to the best of your ability, read others 'take' on your sitch, consider it all, and then apply your best conclusion to which decision is best applied in YOUR situation.

You will learn that some things work for others that don't necessarily work for you. You will also find that sometimes you are cautioned away from something that is appealing to you in YOUR sitch and that does work for you. Others' situations and experiences will apply directly to you. Some will not. Only YOU will know what you believe will fit. Only experience will tell you if your hunch is correct, and sadly we don't find out whether our hunch was correct or incorrect until AFTER the fact. One this that will come with YOUR experience is getting to know yourself, your wife and your sitch better than ever before.

Now, to answer your questions directly:
1. If you want to know what worked for me please re-read my posts slowly. Sadly, a year of intensive posting is missing from my previous thread. One thing I can tell you is that, to the best of my ability, I did not initiate much interaction because XW made a concerted effort to let me know that we would NOT reconcile. So...I didn't pass on activities that she invited me to attend with our children. I didn't pass on her requests for me to take our children on HER time so she could do what she wanted to do. I didn't TRADE time with her for her to recapture time with our children that she chose to pass on for other activities...still don't. I didn't pass on helping her pleas for emotional assistance which were generally brought on by her own poor decision making. THIS is one area where I always stepped up and wish the ALWAYS was 'regularly' instead of ALWAYS. Always gave away my power and facilitated her present lack of knowledge of what it feels like to 'really' be in danger of losing me. It's impossible for her to have that feeling since I have repeatedly shown her that I am ALWAYS there for her.

2. I spend time with my children. We talk a lot. I give them ME. I don't make them share me with other people. This has worked well for me and them. On top of that, giving them ME is inexpensive. XW plans a lot of activities and play dates with children's friends (and with XW's girlfriends). What play dates really are are play dates for XW with XW's friends; the children off entertaining one another and the mom's face to face with each other. XW also very quickly introduced her DHs to our children and incorporated her spending time with her new DH with spending time with her children. Of course, our children felt short changed with this DH arrangement; they had to share mom's attention. The end result of that is that over the 3 years that XW and I have been apart, XW tells me that she 'really misses' her children and wants to come and see them on MY time with them and I ALLOWED THIS! UGH!

This is another area where I faltered in being a man in SHOWING her what the separation/divorce that SHE wanted so badly really looks like, because I have protected her from really experiencing it because of my own fears and reconciliation wants and needs. Boundaries are key. What I am working to change is to establish my boundaries and hold myself and XW to them. I have the option of allowing her inside of my boundaries, but if I do allow that, her behavior must be in keeping with the type of behavior that I allow towards me inside of my boundary. In the past, I didn't even put up 'fence posts' to erect my boundaries that she might run into by chance. Nope, with regards to her, I didn't even get those up. I all other aspects of my life I have very apparent boundaries that I keep to and hold others to. As HER mother once told me very early in our sitch, "You keep allowing her to walk all over you. She can't respect a doormat. Stand up for yourself." Three years into this, I wish I had changed my behavior back then, but since I can't change the past in any situation, I am changing my behavior going forward. Be standing up to my XW my end up being the death knell for my reconciliation wishes, because doing it the way that I have been is only killing it more slowly and painfully, which is worse for everyone involved.

With all of that said, XW has often called me up to participate with her in activities with our children. I do invite her to do 'stuff' with us, but she is the entertainment and activity mom. I usually do participate with her. Unfortunately, I have often chalked up her invitations to me as her simply wanting to connect with me. This is an area where I have perhaps misinterpreted her invitations because they are often preceded by semi-regular venting and verbal attacks on me. I suppose that watching sometimes can mislead me in deciphering XW's reasons for doing what she does.

Yes, I do send her digital photos to enjoy by e-mail.

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Now which actions have I done that I am happy with in my sitch?
A. I am still taking a deep, critical look at myself and making sweeping changes in my previously not so positive outlook on life. In response to finding aspects of myself that are less than admirable, I look for information that I can implement to better myself. I realize that I don't have ALL of the answers.
B. I realize that even though I didn't cause ALL of the problems in my marriage, I did cause a good portion by making poor decisions because of fear brought on by my poor self-image. No excuses, but I didn't know what I didn't know and I didn't know myself well enough to understand that just because I didn't have the answers to make a better me didn't necessarily mean that those answers don't exist. I take responsibility for the damage that I contributed over time the the deterioration of our relationship over time. I also understand that I can't change the past, no matter how much I wish I could.
C. I have learned to stand up to XW's tirades and verbal attacks by staying calm and responding in a rational, even way. This type of response is different than how I chose to REACT before and it makes her madder. Once I respond, I tell her that I think it's time for me to go and I leave.
D. I've begun to be less emotionally invested in XW's self-destructive displays which used to really wreak havoc on my emotional well-being. I don't care any less, I have been gathering the strength to corral my emotions and stay within myself.
E. I have grown stronger in NOT initiating contact with XW. She has responded by initiating contact. Unfortunately, often that contact has come with my gaining more knowledge of XW's activities that I find hurtful.

Things that I have done not-so-well in my sitch:
A. I have reacted strongly and poorly to XW's self-destructive behavior. I have often taken her behavior personally, rather than simply continuing to disengage. I believe that I have unnecessarily prolonged my sitch be failing here.
B. I have intermingled my feeling for my children with my feelings for my XW. Working on changing this.
C. I haven't focused enough on me and my well-being when I am not caring for my children because I have repeatedly chose to divert my focus to my XW and her life. Often, when XW has the children, she will call me and ask for my help with them. I have usually responded by interrupting my time alone to go and help her with the children, but who was I kidding? I wanted to be for her and do for her because I had the misguided hope and expectation of my doing for her bringing us closer to being together again. I am still struggling with even feigning being busy. I am still struggling with staying focused on MY necessary activities.
D. I haven't kept a journal of ALL of XW's shenanigans. I haven't kept an accurate of all of her lies. This journal would simply be convenient to have to refer to XW's questions about her behavior when she is asking for specifics. Since I still haven't started this journal, and I have chosen not to memorize the dates/times/deeds, she simply dismisses what I share with her. Remedy? Starting today, I will journal everything to reply honestly and accurately with evidence to support what I tell her. No value in doing this except that she will be less likely to dismiss what I say about her behavior when it is backed by specific evidence.
E. I still haven't let go. As Phoenixdeux told me:

Letting go doesn't mean it's over...it just means you quit pining away and start to look at her as your EX wife.

I tell you, whitney, being married is tough enough. Working to reconcile one's marriage is even tougher, especially when you re doing ALL of the lifting alone. I am working to let go, even though I am not giving up. I know that either way, I will be fine and my children will be great.

I know this was a lot of writing, but YOU posting and sifting though responses to find which one's ring true with you and yours is critical for YOU to make your decision about YOU. So...post more about you. Keep us all posted about whatever details happen your life alone, with your children and with all of you together.

Have a great day, Greg.

Tom