For the Guy with Kids and a WW Twenty Two

[InLikeFlynn]

Get her one of those digital frames that will display all the "Family" photos and it keeps rotating thru each photo. Its acts a a reminder of what she is giving up.

Also if you decide not to give her a gift or you find out ahead of time that she isn't giving you on...or basically acting too wayward, then use it yourself at home!! Just a thought!!

As far as letting her visit on X-Mas day....I could go both ways. But I would just as a last family time for the kids and Family dart for her.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

I watched a rerun of "King of Queens" last night. That and "Everyone Loves Raymond" are two of my favs. I think everyone can see similarities on those shows in their own lives. I know I do.

That, and I'm built like Kevin James.

H4H, my wife reminds me sooooooo much of Raymond's wife Debra on that show!!! She looks like her, acts like her, the whole shootin' match.

Puppy

[hopeful4her]

Identical to Debra AND (if I'm not mistaken) a bodybuilder?

No wonder you have your hands full.

Get this. We have the same exact bed as Raymond and Debra and we also have the same chairs in our dining room that they have in their kitchen.

[hopeful4her]

Just shot off the email.

"Hi.

I get off at 1 on Wednesday, so I wanted to get the kids when I get out. Not sure whats going on with you, S14 and Ex, so let me know what you and he decide. I'll take whatever time I can get with Miguel, even if its just a little while.

Not sure yet if my parents are coming over to the house or if we are going over to their's. Might know for sure tomorrow. I do know that I want to go to Christmas service at 6 at church. You are always welcome to join us.

On Christmas day, if you can pick up the girls, your welcome to come over as early as you want. I just wanted to let them get their gifts from 'Santa', and have some breakfast.

Let me know your thoughts or what you had in mind.

BTW, did you ever get the Krispy Kreme coupon I left for you? Just curious.

R "


I just realized, I said I was going to "get off"...

[hopeful4her]

She responded,

Hello,



That would be fine for you to pick the girls up after 1 on Wednesday, I don't get off until 3pm that day. S14 nor Ex have said anything about the Christmas break nor what day he preferred so I decided that I would also get S14 on Christmas day. I will be picking all of them up that Morning, so that we can have Christmas together. You are welcomed to come over if you'd like. I will be there early, to pick them up. Yes, I did receive the coupon. I have not had a chance to use it, I told the girls we can go this weekend for donuts and hot cocoa.

Thanks



GBG

Hmmmm.

[hopeful4her]

Ok, she called me on the way home last night. Sucked me into an almost two hour conversation.

Started out with her asking if I had time to talk and was I ABLE to talk. She wanted to get my thoughts on something. Turns out, she had just had a talk with S14 and she wanted to discuss that and her conversation with her ex last night.

It went from me listening to her to her lumping me in with her ex in trying to 'get' her so "bring it on", to an R talk, to divorce talk, to all kinds of crap.

I gave her many truths. She is not hiding OM anymore, so she says, but I know that isn't completely true. About S14 telling her that he is moving in with his dad in Febuary and its his decision. S14 telling her that gets too depressed and cries too much. Her telling him that she has moved on.

At this point, I wasn't sure WHO she was talking about. I assumed it was me.

Her saying she is happy, me telling her that I know her and that I know she ISN'T happy. Her asking me how I know. I told her that I know her and that she knows me and that I'm not happy. I remind her that I know that she hates how well I know her.

She says that she guesses she'll just be alone the rest of her life. I ask why she says that, and she says "Well Ex couldn't make me happy, you couldn't make me happy and who knows if OM is going to."

I tell her that she needs to find her own happiness. She asks me how I know what is going to make her happy. I tell her that I DON'T know. How can ANYONE know if SHE doesn't know herself. I tell her that I know she isn't happy with our situation, she is not happy with how things happened and that she is NOT happy with herself.

She tells me that we would be divorced if she had the money. I ask her why doesn't OM pay for it and she says that it isn't his issue and why should he pay? I tell her that it is what they both want.

We talk more. She listens. She asks me "What if Tom makes me happy? Can you accept that?"

I tell her that I have no say. She says that I need to stop saying bad things about him to the girls. I tell her "I can't even stand to say his name, so what makes you think I want to talk about him to my girls?"

She say that he doesn't say bad things about me. "Whats there to say?" I ask.

She says that she asked D11 if she is okay with her and I not being together and that she said yes. I tell her that D11 is going to SAY that, but that the kids will never be okay, and that she can try to hide from it, but it will be something they will have to deal with the rest of their lives. They should have not been taught that it ok to do what she has/is doing while she is still married.

We wound down the conversation talking about Christmas. I asked her what is was that SHE wanted to do for Christmas.

"Well, I thought it would be nice to spend Christmas together, since the girls still believe in Santa, but I guess.....things have to change."

"Yeah."

I ask her if she wants to come over that house on Christmas day early enough before the kids wake up.

"That up to you."
"I'm ASKING you if you want to come over early, before they wake up."
"Okay."

I ask about S14 and she says she'll let me know, but that she'll more than likely go pick him up from Ex before she comes over. She wants to spend Christmas day with them at her place and that I'm welcome to come over and be there.

"I'm not sure."
"About what? Coming over?
"Yeah, not sure if its the best thing for me."
"Why?"
"Because its better that I don't HIS stuff around your place and..."
"What stuff? Theres not stuff....
"And also all the calls that he makes suddenly while I'm there and you taking his calls in front of me....I don't deserve that."
"Your phone rings all the time, too. Your always checking YOUR phone and I don't say anything."

"Yeah, I get a lot of bill collectors too. I'm not dating anyone."

I can hear D7 talking to her and she is being distracted. We kind of sit on the phone. She says she better let me go and I tell her to let me know what happens with S14. She says she'll call me when she finds out.

At one point, she DID say how her and OM's relationship has changed, and took it as seemingly not for the better. I was telling her how she or we shouldn't look to someone else to make up happy. We should have learned that by now. That I was NOT looking for her to fail.

"Yes you are. Your waiting for me to come back."
"I NEVER wanted you to fail. I'll admit that I do want your relationship with TOM to fail. I do admit that, but not for you to fail. I would never wish that on you. You know me better than that."

We never raised our voices. I did call her on being defensive and that she usually does that when I say something that she doesn't want to hear.

In the end, I asked myself, "Why DID she call me?"

On one side of her mouth she says one thing, and on the other she says something different. Especially when it concerns OM.

I feel like we may still have our connection, but I think that there is just no ATTRACTION to me anymore. At one point, we were talking about what she wants, or to be specific, that she doesn't know what she wants.

She says, "You don't."
I say, "Well then, we're two people that don't know what they want."
"I meant, YOU don't know what I want."
That's when I told her that NO ONE will ever know what she wants until SHE figures out what she wants.

She remains confused.

[kat727]

She remains a mess that she wants you to clean up. Has she never done anything on her own before? She wants you to fight with her so she can feel good. Maybe it is time for you to just say " Damn it C, I am done with the games. Get out out of your lease, stop all contact with OM and get your rear home." If she can't do that then you will file.

Sorry, you will be stuck in this forever. I get the feeling that she never had anyone that disciplined her as a child and now everyone is paying for it!!

kat

[hopeful4her]

Her mother raisd her fairly strictly. She spent her late teens raising her little sister because mom worked as a nurse late hours. She started being rebellious her senior year, her older sister was a 'dancer' and got my wife a job as one when she turned 18. She met Ex there, started dating him, moved in with him and then got pregnant. She finally left him when S14 was about 3 months old. They were together maybe 1 1/2 years.

We got together one drunken night and never looked back. I was living with her within 3 months. At this point, she was 21, but not by very long.

The rest is history.

I have told he

[karen43]

She says that she guesses she'll just be alone the rest of her life. I ask why she says that, and she says "Well Ex couldn't make me happy, you couldn't make me happy and who knows if OM is going to."

I tell her that she needs to find her own happiness.

You're exactly right. She's clearly looking for someone else to make her happy, when she's the only one that can do that for herself. And so if she's not happy, it must be your fault. Eventually it will be Tom's fault. So yeah, I think in the end she might wind up alone and unhappy, realizing she has screwed up a really good thing with you. I really just think all our WAS need major therapy like 3x a week, you know? I think most of our WAS think like that if they think at all. And you got "sucked into" a TWO hour conversation!!! That's your dropping the rope??? Karen

[hopeful4her]

D11 called me today very upset. She and D7 were having an argument. D7 was being stubborn and not listening and D11 had tried to pick he up and hurt her.

I had to talk to both of them. I told D7 to go to her room and calm down and I told D11 to go find something to do. We talked for about 10 minutes. I emailed the wife just so that she knew because they were both really upset.

"I just got off the phone about 15 minutes ago. The girls are fighting.
Give me a call when you can."

Didn't get a call and called the girls about an hour later. They were fine and had apologized to each other. D11 said that mom had called already. She also said to me that "mom said that she was in trouble with you because we were fighting". I told her no, I just emailed her so she would know what was going on.

I decided to email the wife again.

"Amanda told me that you told her that I made it sound like you were in trouble with me.

Why? I don't think I wrote anything ugly.

I only wanted to you to call me so that I could tell you what was going on. They were both upset and crying and when Amanda tells me she misses me with out me telling her first, I know something's really wrong. (he said with his nice calm voice, not sarcastic)

IF I WRITE IN ALL CAPS, THEN MAYBE I'M MAD.

Thats why I get confused on your emails. You almost always write in caps. You always SOUND mad when you do that.

But then again.....

lol "

I got sidetracked at work and didn't hit send. I get back to my desk and notice a missed call on my cell from the wife and a VM and then hit send.

I listened to her VM.
She was saying that she talked to the girls and they were fine. "They weren't fist fighting or anything." She said that S14 was in trouble because he went to the mall with out permission and left the girls alone. She says that she still hasn't taken a lunch yet. That she was going to go to the apartment to have lunch with the girls, but it was getting late now and that she'll call me later.

I then sent another email to her.

"As usual, we were trying to contact each other at the same time. I was emailing you and you were calling me.
I got your message.
Hellooooo, I know they weren't fist fighting.
Go eat something. Its already 3."


I call the girls back and check on them. While talking to D11, I ask if D7 has eaten yet. She says that no, because she was going to wait for mom to have lunch with. I tell her that it didn't sound like mom was going to have time to go, so give D7 something to eat. Then the wife calls the apartment while we are talking. D11 takes the call and I wait. She says that her mom said that she IS going over for lunch. I said that they talked for a while.

"Yeah, I know. For a while, mom was just sitting on the phone and then said that she was going to go. I think she is on her way."

I tell them goodbye and remind her to call me tonight.

10 minutes later, the wife calls my cell phone. She says that she was freaking out when I emailed her because of what my email said and then she saw that her mom was calling her cell and that she was at the doctors office. She starts to say that she is going to take the girls some cough medicine and that she heard that D7 hadn't eaten yet, so she is taking them some rotisserie chicken. She was going to rush to the apartment and then come right back to work. I told her she shouldn't be doing that. I ask about what is up with S14. She says that he is in trouble because he asked her last night if he could go to the mall for today.

"I heard him ask me, but I pretended to not hear him."
"What do you mean?"
"I didn't answer him. I pretended like I didn't hear him."
"Why. How come you just couldn't just say 'No'?"
"I don't know. I don't know what I was thinking." she sounded exapsperated. "I called him after I talked to the girls and he said that he tried calling me at work. I've told everyone here that if my kids call, they are to interrupt me. I can't have cell phone calls. None of can, so I go to my locker often and check my phone. No calls on it either."

Then she says, "Hold on, my moms calling me back. I'll call you back."

She calls me back another 15 minutes later.

Her mom is going over to the apartment and stay with the girls until she gets off. I ask if she is talking to her mom again. She says that they reconciled last Saturday. That they had talked.
"My mother is like me and I'm like my mother. When were are embarrassed or something, we just push people away or run away."
"Your mother is not like you, you're like your mother. You are like your mom."
She stayed quiet.
"So...your NOT going to the apartment after all?" I ask.
"I'm turning around right now. I won't make it back in time if I went and I can't be late. I'm already on probation. I just overreacted about the girls and freaked out. You were emailing me, my mom was calling me, S14 went to the mall with out my permission."

I tell her that I know the girls are just tired and that I know they were up until nearly one. She says that she knows, she was up too. That D7 fell asleep with her on the sofa. She was acting funny last night. Like upset.

"I kept asking her what was wrong. I asked her if she missed her dad. I asked if it was Tom."
"What?"
"Tom did a favor for me and he came over last night. He brought me some milk. My milk had expired on the 15th and I hadn't noticed it and I gave some to D7."

I tell her that they are not going to tell her the truth. I stayed quiet for a minute.
"They are not going to tell you how they feel."
I paused again.
"I wish that I could take it all away from them." I say.
"What?" I must have broken up.
"I said that I wish that I could take away this mess from them."
"I know. I have taken all the blame. I've told them that it was my decision. Its my fault."

I just stay quiet.

"Look, I'm at work already. I'll call you later. Ok? I'll call you back later."

I just say goodbye.


What world do I live in?
She is wacky, I swear.

And yes karen, I must be just as crazy to keep letting myself back into it. I WAS doing a good job, I thought.

I just don't understand all the conversation all of the sudden. And why does she want to call me back?

"I've fallen, but I CAN get up!"

I'll just reset and start over again.