Trixi aka "The Pitbull who can't let go"

[Trixi]

Happy Thanksgiving!!
I just got done making the fruit salad and cheesecake for the 'dinner' at my mom's. I'll go there from about 1-5pm and then come home and go out to dinner with H and the kids at 6pm.

Nik, I have been chewing on what you wrote about; feeling like you don't have much in common with your H and the biggie

I got so used to living day to day and week to week I forgot how to really look to the longer term future is kinda what it feels like.

That seems like a very profound statement. For me, I think that when H said that our current situation keeps him interested, this might be part of it. The "drama" of the unknown. I know that every day, in some way, I feel like I am fighting for my marriage. Even if 'fighting' means going dark. And now, it's been going on for so long, would it feel "boring" to just have a normal relationship without the constant worry that the other shoe is about to fall?

I have been reading a book called Learned Optimism and the author is discussing how prevelent depression is; like never before. His theory is that we have become a society the exalts the "self" so much that our lives are empty. There are so many choices (anyone look at the bread aisle lately?) that a person becomes hedonistic and is only concerned in exalting themSELVES. And making themSELVES happy. "A life committed to nothing larger than itself is a meager life indeed." I can't paraphrase the whole chapter here. The whole book is very fascinating-even dogs can be (essentially) optimistic or pessimistic based on what they learn regarding being able to "control" their lives.

ANYway, I have wondered myself, how I would feel if I wasn't in a 'code red' 'DEFCON 1' situation. How would it feel to not have a life that is all about watching for babysteps, praying that the WAS open their eyes, wondering what will happen. I guess, in a way, trying to save a marriage is like a very big 'project'.

So, w/regard to your sitch- are there any charities you both care about? Is there any sort of side business you ever considered doing? Rescuing animals? Mentoring children? Are you guys religious at all? Can you spearhead a charity drive with your group of friends? For instance, organize a gathering and collect food or blankets or whatever to donate.
I'm just tossing some stuff out there. I certainly don't know the answer.

I used to post on 'another site' that had all sorts of "rules"- you must spend 15 hours of Undivided Attention/wk with the spouse; you must not do ANYthing without the ENTHUSIASTIC agreement of the spouse; you must be Radically Honest w/spouse always-even if it might hurt their feelings; no Independent Behavior (ie, no going out to bars, etc w/out spouse)...anyway, I was re-reading my old posts from 1 year ago (to the date). OMG, he was saying the same stuff back then. I am always surprised at myself when I look back over old threads and see the same thing over and over.

I let myself get "tricked" into thinking we are making babysteps, when in reality, we are just babystepping in a circle.

I wish I had the income to know I could support myself; that would take away some of the fear. (Not all, but some.) If we get divorced and I have to do COBRA, that will increase my expenses a good $400/mo. Even if I get my own catastrophic insurance that is around $175/mo. It all starts to add up.

I need to find the strength to SOMEthing. Of course, I am afraid that if I give up, it will be the moment before he would have changed his mind.

[Trixi]

Nik, I read further in the Learned Optimism book and he had some suggestions on things to do and I thought I would pass them on. (Credit to Martin Seligman, author of the book.)Below are shortened versions of his suggestions. Maybe you and your H could do them?
*Put aside 5% of last years income to give away to charity. But don't give it to an organization that does the work for you. Actually do the work yourself and interview prospective recipients.
*give up some pleasurable activity that you do once a week. Instead use that time (equivalent of one evening) to dedicate
your time to helping the well-being of others or the community at large. Helping AIDS patients, cleaning up community park, fund raising for you alma mater.
*When asked by a homeless person asks for money, talk to him. Judge as well as you can that he will use the money for non-destructive purposes. If you think he will, give it to him. Give no less than $5. Do this 3 hours per week.
*When you read about particular herioc or despicable acts, write letters: fan letters or mend your way letters. Spend 3 hours per week doing this; do it with as much care as you would writing a report for work.

Anyway, those were his ideas.

----
Thanksgiving went pretty well for me. Again (like on D's 21st bday), it was really great having the 4 of us (kids and us) together for a meal. SS and I had a very good argument/discussion afterwards. My H and D played Wii while SS and I talked. Tears from both of us. Then SS, H and I talked. So I was glad that we were all able to be sure to be on the same page.

No big revelations; no changes in status. But it was a nice time.

I'll be curious to hear how everyone else's Thanksgiving went.
I got an offer on one of my listings- I need positive thoughts that it will come together!

[Trixi]

ANYone?
WWYD?
At Thanksgiving dinner the other night, SS mentioned H having a FB account. So, I did check and in fact, he does.

I was a little surprised he hadn't made a "friend request" on me; but also not surprised.

My question is: shall I make a friend request on him? It might be interesting to see if he accepts or declines...

[Sara]

I would make the friend request. Likely he realizes that it would be a bad thing to decline it. Then I would avoid making comments on his wall. Eventually, he will forget that you are one of his friends and he will post about his life there. You will get little peeks into the life he has shut you out of. That is what I do with my children.

[Trixi]

Well, I made the request. Stepson has already approved/verified me. H has not. And he is currently online, so it's not that he hasn't seen his email.
I am tempted to send a quick IM and ask if he is going to approve me. (So he can't claim that he never got the email.)

[AliSuddenly]

Hey Trixi... wow, do you really think that he wouldnt? Maybe it feels like pressure to him?? Perhaps you should IM him and say, forget it!

I think this was an interesting observation you made.. "I let myself get "tricked" into thinking we are making babysteps, when in reality, we are just babystepping in a circle."

but then you say, you are loathe to give up in case that means you miss the moment he might want to return.. from what Kalni and KerryK and others say.. it seems that the WAS often ONLY comes back once the LBS HAS given up! Maybe giving up would be a 180 for you!?

Al xxx

[Trixi]

Hey Ali-
yes, I totally think he wouldn't approve me. The reason being I might actually find out wth he is doing. I don't think he would out and out decline me, but he might just indefinitely not approve me.

Since Thanksgiving I have had no contact with him. Although, I did send a TM on Friday that everyone had forgotten their leftovers and we all forgot to eat the cheesecake I made; no response. Later on, he appeared to be online- we had had a lot to drink the night before so I asked how he was feeling. No response. Turns out he wasn't really online. (He had looked like he was online for pretty much the whole weekend 24/7). And now the friend request. No response.

Now before I get a bunch of 2x4s for 'pressuring' him-- he was more than happy to sleep with me on Thanksgiving. I think I am afforded the "right" to make contact.

Yes, time for me to get some freaking self-respect. At least before, we were going out and doing things. We were spending a lot of time together. He was dropping hints that I was winning him back. Now...well...it's not the same. He asked for more time. But I don't see him doing anything with that time...at least not anything that advances our relationship.

I have been voraciously reading on how to love myself and connect with God. I am sick and tired of feeling this way. I don't know what the future holds, but this isn't what I want. Part of me knows I am worth more than this. But then I fall for his tricks, and I guess I must not actually believe that I am worth more.

[Belle]

Oh Trixi...

My heart is breaking for you...

I don't have a lot of good advice, but I will tell you that God and praying has been such a source of comfort and strength for me. And I've never been a religious person. What are you reading that is helping you love yourself and connect with God?

I'm sorry that I don't have more advice..... Just know that I am thinking of you - I will say some prayers for you!

[Sara]

Trixi,

I think you are right. When you accept being treated poorly, it is a pretty good indicator of low self-esteem. If that is your problem, then only you can fix it.

You need to make some rules about what kind of treatment you will accept from people, and refuse contact with those who don't meet the standard. For example, I have decided that my friends, the people who care about me, will call occasionally and check up on me. Those who don't, aren't my friends. Lo and behold, that shortened the list of people I needed to send Xmas cards to.

I have a rule that I will never be anywhere where I am not wanted. Anyone who even hints that they don't want me around will never see me again. Life's too short to waste it trying to get people who don't like you to like you. Move on to people who do want to be around you.

I have lots of friends. And if I need more, I go out and find some.

[Trixi]

Thanks for the thoughts and prayers

What I am reading is actually rather new-age'y, but is very clear in it's message. I'm reading Stop Being the String Along by Barbara Rose and Dear God, How can I finally love myself? (same author).

Both books are incredibly simple. She is not flowery; gives plain examples. She doesn't dance around the subject- she states things bluntly.

I used to feel like I had a pretty good relationship with God. And I used to feel like I had a pretty good handle on listening to my gut. I have moved away from both and no longer trust myself.

I have gotten myself so turned around with the mixed messages from my H; the confusion of vows vs bailing; not knowing exactly HOW I am going to support myself with the real estate market like it is. I have been so focused and concerned with saving my marriage, I have no idea what my goals are anymore. ie, "where do you see yourself in 1 year, 2 years, 5 years?" Sheesh, I'm not even sure where I see myself in 6 months. Worse than that-- I don't have a clear picture of what it is I WANT. I feel directionless. When I pray, I feel like all I hear back is nothing.
ugh, babbling. sorry.

Are you attending church or anything? When you pray-do you feel like you get answers?