For me, "dropping the rope" means to reinforce the hope of reconciling by detaching. LBS's like you and I have no control over our WAS's and what they will or won't do (e.g. emailing on Thurs. or every 10 days). To obsess over such futility is not only nonsensical and unproductive, it's downright self-destructive.
The only tools we have to save our M are time and patience. I, for one, don't view being "patient" as sitting around the home grinning and bearing the dreadful silence permeating throughout the abode. No no no! I refused to be a victim. I chose to fight instead.
In order to be "patient" and withstand the pain of loneliness and despair, I had to be in the frame of mind that if D was inevitable, then I'm absolutely fine with it. Is this giving up? Is this letting go of hope for reconciliation? Well, it sure smells like it, but I assure you it's not. Basically, I see it as a means of relieving myself of all the pressures that come with D. By doing so, you stop obsessing over your WAS and start concentrating on your own happiness. That's where GAL'ing and socializing helps mend a broken heart. You may think that it takes a long time for someone to break your heart. I think that it takes but a brief moment for a heartbreak to happen...it's the healing that takes so gosh darn long!
But guess what? We're undeniably human, and extraordinary emotional events like this gets processed and filtered through the heart before it reaches the brain. I don't expect you to be a social butterfly overnight, but you have to give yourself the opportunity to at least try. My first meetup/group event felt really forced and disingenuous, but that was all in my head. Over the months, I met some great people that will undoubtedly be lifelong friends. They provided me a fresh start and myriads of new invigorating perspectives. If my W wants to come back to our M, I will share all my PMA and experiences I've cached away. If not, then more loot for this love pirate!
Time for you to draw your own "treasure map", Beth
- Me = 32 y/o - WAW = 32 y/o - M = 2.5 yrs, T = 12.5 yrs - No kids - Bomb, WAW moved out, D filed = 8/15/08
Beth, I do the same thing everytime I head home. I think W will tell me she wants back in the M. I am getting better at stopping that one in its tracks. In fact everytime that comes up I switch it to why am I putting up with this crap. One of these days I will be able to detach.
Does that mean letting go of the hope for reconciliation or is it just a synonym for detaching?
Warning: Amatuer arm-chair Buddhism follows
So, just for the sake of challenging conversation, what would be wrong with giving up hope? I'm not saying don't try anymore and start dating again. But just giving up hope.
One of the Buddhist slogans is indeed: 'Abandon all hope for results'. It's related to the ongoing discussion we've been having about being in the present. In a nutshell, hope is fundamentally a future-oriented thought. It is a distraction to staying in the present.
Here is a few paragraphs from Pema Chodron on the topic: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- One of the most powerful teachings of the Buddhist tradition is that as long as you are wishing for things to change, they never will. As long as you're wanting yourself to get better, you won't. As long as you have an orientation toward the future, you can never just relax into what you already have or already are.
One of the deepest habitual patterns that we have is to feel that now is not good enough. We think back to the past a lot, which maybe was better than now, or perhaps worse. We also think ahead quite a bit to the future - which we may fear - always holding out hope that it might be a little bit better than now. Even if now is going really well -there's a deep tendency always to think about how it's going to be later. We don't quite give ourselves full credit for who we are in the present.
Nowadays, people go to a lot of different places trying to find what they're looking for. There are 12 -step programs; someone told me that there is now a 24-step program; someday there will probably be a 108-step program. There are a lot of support groups and different therapies. Many people feel wounded and are looking for something to heal them. To me it seems that at the root of healing, at the root of feeling like a fully adult person, is the premise that you're not going to try to make anything go away, that what you have is worth appreciating. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So, yes, when I dropped the rope I did give up hope for reconcilliation. I still kept working at DBing. I still kept up my PMA and GAL. I still give 100% when wife was\is around to be attractive. I'm still going to Retrouvaille next weekend. So I didn't <stop> anything. I just gave up hope and stayed in the present. I think Pema would say that by giving up hope, I actually <gained>.
It's all about how you think about 'giving up hope'.
My thread, Carpe Diem #4 Orig Thread: Carpe Diem #1
You have both blown me away. There is way too much here for a quick reply. I now have a lot of thinking to do. This, in itself is a good distraction, so thank you both for that, too.
I will reserve comment for a later time, after I have properly considered your very thoughtful replies to my question.
The ways we will grow and to think they may never know...pity for them.
Techguy and Cotoffguard said it perfectly. At first, we GAL to distract but it doesn't really do anything to make us happy. Or we think. Then we start to realize we are feeling happy and that makes it easier to start accepting that what will be will be and life is not as bad as we once thought. We may even find some very nice surprises along the way.
I'm not saying change your religion, but my family is Catholic and my cousin recently (last few years) became a Buddhist. I will tell you that he is happier and more directed now than I have ever seen him in his life. The wisdom that can be applied to life from there is just amazing. So regardless of your religious views, it is worth learning about and seeing what you can take from it.
If you focus on the past, you ruin the future. You can only live for today.
Webster's defines hope as "the feeling that what is desired is possible."
Under Buddhist theory, if I understand it properly, this is still forward looking. It would have to be - one only desires that which one does not have. If one does not have something now, it can only be had in the future, if at all.
I look at this a little differently. I desire what I have right now - right now I have a connection to my H that we built over many years. I think this is in keeping with the Buddhist approach.
Where I get into trouble, is desiring that which I do not have right now and that which I cannot control (as Cotoffguard pointed out)- that is, H to want to accept that connection and let me back into his heart.
The reason I am looking so hard for a reason not to give up hope is because I believe in the self-fulfilling prophesy. That what we live and feel is what we put out there and make happen. So if I believe reconciliation is possible, I will take tiny daily steps to make that happen. But if I stop hoping for it, stop believing it is possible, my daily steps will move me, ever so slowly away from that goal.
Thank you both for giving me so much to think about. It really helps me to focus my mind and my energy toward what and who I want to be today.
I have been wrestling with this one for a couple of weeks and would love some input please.
Pretty positive H is depressed (as you all know by now). I have been applying LRT/no initiating contact since 10.21.08 with some positive results. DB wisdom says keep doing what's been working (though now have gone two weeks w/o a word from H, so I start to wonder if LRT is still working). DB coach suggested I might see a retreat from H after a positive meeting as it will freak him out to realize he might still have feelings for me. Not sure that happened, but who knows.
Books on handling people w/ depression advise reaching out to the person to offer plans/activities - the idea being that the depressed person, as his depression spirals downward will withdraw more and more, making him less and less likely to reach out. Problem is, the books do not really address my sitch, a spouse who has left his wife and is depressed. Not sure how much of the advice will help.
Have tried the gut check and it comes up blank. I am currently following the "when unsure of what to do, do nothing approach."
Beth Thought I would chime in over here. I wanted to give you a depressed persons side of things. I have had depression every since I was in grade school, and most recently diagnosed with bi-polar. As a depressed person I would not listen to anybody that wanted me to get help. I knew I had issues but didn't want to face them. "I can deal with this on my won","what is a psych doctor going to tell me I don't already know". When I was married to my first W I hit bottom., tried to overdose, luckly what I took was very hard to overdose on. Slept for three days straight though. That was the first time I got help, started med, no therapy. This helped me for a while. Not sure that I followed up on the med therapy like I should of to adjust dose. At that time I should have gone after counciling. My whole issue now is due to my bi-polar and depression, and not facing it head on when I knew I had a problem. My anger came out in the manic phase, like when I told MIL that I wanted to harm her, and when depressed would spend money and start fights with W. Now everybody is different when it comes to their depression. This is just how I was. Since the day W and I sep I have gotten the help I needed, meds, therapy, support group and even hypnotherapy. It took me to hit rock bottom, realize what I was loosing, to man up and get help. I still have a long way to go. I need to be trustworthy fro my W to trust me and feel safe with me. This seems to be her biggest issue when she says she doesn't know if she can love me again. I hope that your H will soon hit that point and see that you are a wonderful part of his life and woth getting help for. It will take him bottoming out to start the jounery upward. Something he must see himself. Just support him in loving ways, tough love. It never helped me to enable me with nice love, it took tough love to get me to start the change. thank you for your support. Happy Sat. lets all go out and do something for ourselves tonight.:) Byron
