Where are we?

[sandi2]

Hi Jay, found your thread and thought I would rspond to a couple of things said and wanted to ask you to clearify something also. But first, this one thing your wife said about finding a man on line that was more depressed that she was and how he had helped her more than anyone else? How crazy is that? One depressed person helping another.....I don't get it. Do you think that was just an excuse she was giving you for her talking to this man on line in order to continue her EA with him?

I think this was an OEA and I my gut told me a trip to an out of town conference she was thinking about attending was really a chance to meet him. I have no proof and have not ever asked.

Has she ever gone out of town to a conference before? Does she have the type of job that sends people to conferences out of town? I can tell you what to look for if she is having an online EA. If you walk into the computer room and she suddenly clicks off the page she was on and finds another one or if she acts jumpy or looks guilty. If she gets defensive if you ask her any quesions about the computer or who she has been talking to or how long or any quesions at all, she will be defensive about it out of guilt feelings. Also, it is addictive and she will spend more and more time on the computer instead of spending with her friends, family, or doing the things she used to do....instead the computer becomes her life. She will get more secretive and if you have a computer in a seperate room or if she has a lap top.....then she is probably doing things you would be very unhappy to know about. Just b/c she doesn't seem to be interested in having sex with you does not mean she doesn't care about getting the attention and amiration of other men. I had an entire list on "my friends" list who were all men. I talked to them and my H would come into the room and never know the difference. But as time went on and I became more daring in the things that I did, then I became more secretive about it. The first thing my H noticed was that when I was going to get online, I would always make sure my hair and make-up looked good b/c I was using the webcam and wanted to look good for my "fan club". He went a long time before he finally confronted me about the issue. He should have said something a lot sooner than what he did.

Since you wife has said that she does not want to ML......then do nothing to make her feel that you are pursuing her. For an example, just telling her that you love her is putting pressure on her b/c she knows that you want to hear her say it back to you and she doesn't want to say it.....so just don't go that route for now.

The fact that she says she wants to be roommates is actually a good thing even though I'm sure you don't see anything good about it. That is a lot better than her saying she wants a S or a D. Living under the same roof and being room mates is difficult but if you can keep a postivie POV then you can see this as your chance to really show her how much you have improved yourself and actually cause her to fall in love with you again. But first, you need to think back about what you were like when she fell in love with you the first time. We all change over the years and tend to get lazy in certain areas of our person grooming habits or we get slack in our personality traits.....things like that that can begin to rub against the grain over the years until finally, it has really rubbed down into the raw nerves and suddenly the one S does not find the other S looking very attractive. When emotional needs are not met......that is one of the first things that, I believe, causes a S to turn to another person.

If you do feel that your wife is or has taken the EA to the next level, then how do you feel about that? Are you still willing to work harder than you ever have before? Will you take a good long hard look in the mirror and see what changes you need to make about yourself? And, will you do this with the determination that it will be for you (not her) and that it will be to make you the best man you can be and that it will be for the rest of your life and not to just reel her back into your arms?

You may have seen this list I have passed around to several people, but if you will follow it, I believe it is a wonderful short version of the DB guide (or a "quick list") to look over every day. I am going to post it to you and hope that you will look it over and make goals for yourself and make them "detailed" and how you are going to get them accomplished. Make notes about what you need to improve in your personal appearance, clothes, habits, personality, etc. Talk to us about it and let's share this thing to gether and work together to try to bust this divorce before it even gets that far.

I hope and pray that she did not go away with him to have a PA, but if she did, realize that it isn't always a "good" thing for them. They are often disappointed in the results b/c most of the attraction for the other person (especially online) is all in the imagination anyway. When they finally meet face to face, it is often not the desired effects they had hoped for. Anyway, here is that list of things you can be working on while the two of you are room mates.

1.Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or implore! This turns the spouse completely off!
2. No frequent phone calls to spouse.......let him/her be the one to call you. Then don't try to hang on to your spouse through conversation.....instead, you say good-bye first.
3. Do not point out good points in marriage or try to get him/her to read marriage books, etc.
4. Do not follow your spouse around the house like a puppy dog trying to get his/her time and attention.
5. Do not encourage talk about the future.
6. Do not ask for help from family members.
7. Do not ask for reassurances (That is showing neediness and
being clingy.)
8. Do not buy gifts. (Can't buy his/her love and affection.)
9. Do not schedule dates together. (That is pursuing.)
10.Do not spy on spouse. (Not good for you and will make
matters worse.)
11.Do not say "I Love You" (It is being "pushy" and trying to
make your spouse say it too......he/she will despise you for it.)
12.Act "as if" you are moving on with your life!
13.Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive at all times!
14.Don't sit around waiting on your spouse – get busy, think of things to do. Go to church, go out with friends, etc.
15.When at home with your spouse, (if you usually start the
conversation---then don't, wait for him/her) then, be scarce or
short on words, but don't sound rude. If your spouse asks what's wrong....just say "nothing". Keep it short and simple. Don't get into an argument! Stay polite and don’ t act like you are pouting. Use poise and class.
16.If you are in the habit of asking your spouse his/her
whereabouts, ASK NOTHING!! No matter what time he/she comes home!
17.You need to make your partner think that you have had an
awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you are going to
move on with your life, with or without your spouse.
18.Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull back and wait
to see if spouse notices and, more important, realize what he/she will be missing. (But never ask him/her if he/she has noticed any changes!!)
19.No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse
happiness and contentment. Show your spouse someone he/she would want to be around, somebody that is attractive and fun.
20.All questions about marriage should be put on hold, until
your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while)
21.Never lose your cool! Don't let your spouse trap you into a fight.
22.Don't be overly enthusiastic, don't over-kill, b/c it will come across as fake.
23.Do not argue about how your spouse feels about something (it only makes his/her feelings more negative.)
24.Be patient......very, very patient. Give your spouse space and time.
25.Listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you. Look them in the eyes when they talk to you.
26.Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you want to
speak out (or scream and yell).
27.Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all
the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil)
28.Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly. Read self
help books, inspirational books or listen to tapes.
29.Know that if you can do 180's, your smallest CONSISTENT
actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say
or write.
30.Do not be openly show that you are "desperate" or "needy" even when you are hurting more than ever and truly feel desperate and needy.
31.Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse
32.Do not believe any of what you hear and less than 50% of what
you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because
he/she is hurting and scared.
33.Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel.
34.Do not ask your spouse if he/she has noticed your changes. Those changes are for you and for the rest of your life...with or without your spouse.
35. Do not backslide from your hard earned changes.

Good luck on these goals. Take care.

Sandi