You are so right I just had a big backslide moment!!! I have been fighting with myself trying not to bring up the PA with W she just kept saying things like I don't keep stuff from you etc. It was driving me nuts. We Just had a conversation in which she brought it up " you think I am with OM" calmly and I got sucked in the conversation was calm she denied but didn't get upset defending herself ( which one would do if she was being truthful)anyway I guess I thought I would feel better but it only made me feel worse (Lesson Learned) I caught myself and left.
So I guess that your words are wise Don't look back look forward.
Jeff
ME 44 W 32 M 5 T 6
no kids
June 08 I don't want to be married it's not you it's me
I'm not sure on how to approach this. The one thing I am quite sure of however, is that I have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Recently my wife has made more statements about being confused. I have heard the following:" I'm so confused."-"I want things to work,I just don't know??"-"I sometimes feel like we have past a certain point, grown apart."-"I feel like if I come back you will never let me live this down.""You will hang this over my head." I have stated I understand your feeling that way,but I really don't agree with you about forgiveness, the past is the past.
I dropped my kiddies off at daycare Friday morning. Our daycare providers are absolutely wonderful. They are very spiritual and involved in church. They are involved in a group for married couples and teach bible study. Their group played a huge part in bringing the movie Fireproof to our town. They took my wife and I to see the movie and after that she put the D on hold for awhile.
After a couple of backslides by me she started to pick things back up as far as the D is concerned. Since I have pretty much been dark. We haven't had but a few conversations, I have been very up beat and positive and they have went well. I let her do the contacting and I only answer a few calls. I am pleasant but short. She has stated to me that she feels I am avoiding her.
Our day care providers have been very supportive, but not pushy, they let us know they are here if we need them, and have told us that we are in their prayers. She pulled me aside one day and told me she feels my wife is fighting a spiritual battle and has surrounded herself with the wrong people and distanced herself from the right ones. She is not aware of DBing or MLC, but does see the problems in a way.
She asked my wife the other day if she would be interested in having a Bible study with me there as well. My wife said "Yes I would be, but right now "Trapt" is not really speaking with me." She then informed me of this and I was a bit shocked. When we first started having trouble my wife's sister asked us to attend church several times and my wife would always refuse. I later asked her why she didn't want to and she said "they just make you feel guilty." Now she seems a bit intrested.
Things have been a bit odd lately. My wife and I seem to be cycling back and forth more frequently, its been hot and cold. I will accept most of the blame for this due to lack of patience.
I have seen many changes in her. It's been very slow, she seems to be a lot more comfortable when she comes around.(She used to be very flighty) She makes conversation and has a lot of eye contact. She acts more relaxed and the only time she has any anger or frustration now, is if she is pressured.(she used to be angry all the time).
I have no idea what to do with this, on one hand yes, it would be helpful IF my wife was doing this for the right reasons and not just trying to keep me as the safety net. I'll never know for sure. A part of me wants to do this, but I'm very cautious and don't want to pressure her. She has Agreed. I said I would get back with them on this. Again I have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Does anyone have any advice on this. I don't know what to do. Part of me says yes, another part of me says stay dark.
It's all very tricky Trapt, and I don't think there is a single3 best answer. Best approach is to watch very closely and be thoughtful about what you do.
If I were you I would continue. I wouldn't want the wife to think I was avoiding her, explicitly, but I would want her to think I was busy with other things and that she would need to starty stepping up to get me back. Her saying to a third party "Trapt" is not really speaking with me." is not enough. That is not her stepping up and taking positive action. That is her bemoaning her situation. If she wants you there, she should ask you. She should have to take some specific direct positive action to get you to respond. If she says "you are avoiding me" that is a complaint. I would want her to say "I would like you to spend more time with me." That is positive action.
I'm rooting for her. and for you. Certainly you don't want to discourage her. But giving yourself to her, too easily, is not right for you. or her. or your marriage.
Did you ever watch those nature shows? Watch the lions or big cats as the mothers teach the little ones to hunt. They don't "give" them anything. The little ones have to work for it. If the mother just gave food to the young cats, the young ones would never learn to hunt, and would eventually starve.
You wrote: A part of me wants to do this, but I'm very cautious and don't want to pressure her. She has Agreed. I said I would get back with them on this. Again I have NO EXPECTATIONS.
but I missed the part about how you received the invitation. Did the daycare people invite you?
If it were me, and I wanted to do bible study, I would go.
On the other hand, if I wanted to show my wife that I had my own life, if I was trying to show her that I had my own thing and that she was in danger of losing me, I might not go. I might go to a bible study elsewhere. I might remain distant, not so available.
If you are thinking, this bible study is a chance to reconcile, rethink. It seems that it is someone else making the effort, making the invitation, not your wife.
Rebuilding is a lot harder than agreeing to a bible study. Rebuilding will present many challenges to both of you. She has to want to do it. She has to deeply want it. She has to work for it. You will not rebuild because someone invited you to bible study.
At the same time I wouldn't want to be too sour grapes about it. I mean - she wants you to be nearer, she just does not know how to ask.
she said -"I feel like if I come back you will never let me live this down.""You will hang this over my head." I have stated I understand your feeling that way,but I really don't agree with you about forgiveness, the past is the past.
Her feeling is completely understandable. You need to walk the line between encouraging her, and maintaining your own standards. Don't give yourself away too cheaply.
Like I said I am rooting for her. and for you. The point is not to make her path difficult. or to lay guilt on her. The point is to maintain an appropriate value for yourself - she HAS TO REALLY WANT YOU if this is going to work, and that means she is going to have to prove herself to you. She is actually going to have to WORK.
I have to say - the words I wrote to you are really about ME. This is really what I am thinking about my own situation. I want her back. But not unconditionally. There are conditions.
She will have to work to get me. She'll have to demonstrate that she really wants me. And if she doesn't want to work to get me, then she won't get me. As it should be.
SirPrize! You must be on west coast--nobody on east coast or here in midwest is on late at night when I am!
Trapt, No smacking...this time!
So...I am also unclear about who asked you to join Bible study. Was it your W or was it the daycare people? I think if your W invites you herself, indicates she would like you to go, and it is something you would be interested in doing anyway, go ahead. Otherwise, I'm not sure it would be a good idea.
I'm not sure what to suggest about the "he's not talking to me" thing, as I am kind of dealing with that right now myself. When I see my H (we are still living in the same house, BTW), I am friendly, ask about his day, and so on, keeping it very light to avoid "pursuing"...but I periodically hear things like, "Are you ever going to talk to me?" to which my response has been, "Sure, what would you like to talk about?" which just seems to irritate him and he shuts down. <cue "Twilight Zone" music here> So I don't know how much help I can be there.
On the confusion...my H has been telling me how confused he is for a solid year. I think it is all part of MLC. I have a dear friend (female) who is also going through MLC (she started getting wacky two or three years ago), and she is the same way, and WILL NOT accept certain conclusions that conflict with her warped MLC views. I have mostly given up trying to persuade her (or my H, but I'm DBing him big-time) of these things and just hope she (and my H) come(s) back from la-la land sometime this century. Since we're only 8 years into the century...it's gonna be a LOOOOONG trip.
Remember, consistency is key! So...patience x 100000!
Peace, Dawn
Me 45/H 47, no kids Together since 1985; M/1992 Bomb1 (EA-OW1, age 22) 2001 Bomb2 (EA/PA-OW2, age 22) 10/2007, A continues H left 11/24/08 minimal contact, no legal action http://tinyurl.com/DawnHope1
Sir, I feel the same way about her making the effort. The daycare provider asked her about us attending.
Things were going well with my wife and I last month, however it was me making the effort to reach out. She responded well, but I do agree with you. At some point in time she needs to take the initiative.
After a couple of anger spews, I withdrew. I felt like there needed to be some sort of boundary put in place in regards to her treatment of me.
I honestly do believe she would like me to go and doesn't know how to ask. (pride, fear or maybe keeping that safety net??)
I agree 100% with you. She does need to be the one who makes the effort to move closer. I plan on still staying dim. I have not decided what I will do yet. I think I'll wait and see if she brings the topic up or asks me to go.
Things were going well with my wife and I last month, however it was me making the effort to reach out. She responded well, but I do agree with you. At some point in time she needs to take the initiative. See? That's the thing. Your partnership won't be healthy if you are doing all the work. It's got to be equitable. You won't throw obstacles in her way, but you've got to insist that she pick up her end of the load.
So in the end whether you go or not the bible study thing is maybe not the most critical part. It is how you approach it. Being dim over the past month or six weeks has shown her a few things. If you go the the bible study thing, you will have to maintain your distance, even then, until she makes a serious effort.
I will leave the door cracked open, but it's up to her to walk in.
She emailed me this morning. She said she had been missing the kids a lot over the weekend. I told her she is welcome to call or even stop by if that happens again.
I could tell she was trying to feel things out a bit. She mentioned that work was extremely busy. She tends to dive into work when she is stressed and thinking about things. This pattern including her mentioning being busy has been here throughout this ordeal. I paid here a compliment regarding work and told her I understand.
We wrote back and forth briefly about the kids. I also apologized that she felt I was avoiding her. I said that is not the case, I just have a lot going on right now.
She said she would call tonight.
I think I am seeing a pattern, It's like we have been here under these circumstances before. I recognize the way I acted last time and the mistakes I made.(expectations and pressure) now me going dim is totally different.
