H deep in A & MLC, need support 4 roller coaster!

[Dawn of Hope]

Thanks for checking on me!

MWG, thanks for all your advice--it really does help!!

Glam, thanks very much for praying for me. I think encouragement is a good word for me. I will keep it in mind as I go about my business. Thanks also for your advice about all the other stuff. I really wasn't planning on changing the locks or anything, but I did think about it for a while because I was just so hurt and fed up with him and his MLC nonsense.

I really need to figure out how to keep my mouth shut about what he is doing when I talk to other people. It's like I have this verbal diarrhea (yuk!) whenever someone expresses interest in the sitch...and sometimes even when they don't. I think that will be much less of a problem once I figure out the forgiveness thing.

I definitely want to go see "Fireproof" next week. I was just looking up when and where I can see it--I can't go this weekend because I will be out of town (in a small town, too, so even if I were to have time I probably would have to drive quite a distance to see it) for my every-other-month workshop.

Okay, that's about all the excitement for today. I have a fair amount of stuff to do before I leave for my workshop at oh-dark-thirty on Friday morning. Catch you all later!

Peace,
Dawn

P.S. How was that for an attempt at being succinct?

[Dawn of Hope]

So, I have been posting to other people's threads here and there and ignoring my own, but I think I need to get a few things out so I don't hijack so much (sorry about that, folks!). I have been trying to keep my posts a bit shorter so not so off-putting, but this one lost on that count!

I went out of town for my bimonthly class last weekend. It was a good trip--weather good, drive good, class enjoyable, got to listen to a couple of good books on tape during the drive, which is always fun. Hoosiermama, I probably went right by you, as my route took me through Indianapolis! I thought of you as I was passing through!

Then I got back and have been pretty busy with work coming in (not complaining about that! I can use the money!). The downside of that has been that I haven't been sleeping as much as I'd like, or in times that are good for me, so I'm tired, which of course doesn't help my work! The other problem is that I didn't make time to refill my ADs, so Monday was my last dose, and I kept thinking, "I really need to get to the pharmacy, because I'm like a time bomb if I don't get back on my meds fast." I know that if I go two days without my ADs, I start to notice problems with my emotions, and it gets worse *very* fast. I finally got my meds refilled tonight, but this was three days without, and I was starting to fall apart. Feeling hopeless, crying for the first time in probably a month, and so on. I got back on my meds tonight, and I am feeling better already, although it will take a few days to get me back up to speed.

I am so glad I have ADs, because if I didn't, there is no doubt in my mind that I would either be still going through the same sheer he** that I was between the bomb and when the ADs kicked in 3 months later--or (and I think this is more likely) I would be dead by now. I am still not convinced that my life is more of a benefit to the world than a drain on it, but I am willing to give it the benefit of the doubt for the time being, and haven't had any immediate plans for suicide in about eight months. This is a definite improvement.

H is being totally distant and minimally polite. He stopped kissing me goodbye in the mornings about a month ago, so that means he doesn't touch me at all, even though we still sleep in the same bed (it's a queen size, and we usually share it with one of the cats, so that is quite a trick--he is a master at the art of "clinging to the edge of the mattress" by now). He really doesn't express any interest in me or my life--it's becoming rare for him to ask me even the most minimal questions about it, like "how was your day?"--and doesn't let me into his (although obviously I avoid asking). About the only thing we've had a conversation of more than two minutes about lately is politics, interestingly enough (it is not a particularly controversial topic between us, as we have similar views there). In a few weeks it will be a full year since the bomb, although I knew something was really wrong a month before that. I never thought back then that we would be here in this horrible, cold place a year later. I hoped that it would have blown over by then and we could go on with our lives (as more or less happened with the first bomb, although it took time and work to get past it).

I love my H, but it is the tenacious action kind of love now, the agape love, rather than the warm fuzzy feelings. Feelings-wise, I'm just either numb or angry. I know I could get those good feelings back, but I think he would have to at least start acting like a human being to me again. I am sure that the numbness is partly the effect of the ADs and is there to protect me from the emotional pain that is its alternative. My H has said to me in the past that he would rather feel negative emotions than feel nothing. Well, I think he got his wish, but I'm pretty much the opposite. The negative stuff is more than I can deal with at full power, so between the two choices, I would rather be numb. Numb is definitely a giant leap in the right direction for me, after almost 30 years of suicidal depression. It really is a relief not to get quite so jerked around by my emotions any more, although the outward circumstances are by far the worst I've ever faced. I credit ADs with my detachment and my calm that allows me to DB, GAL, work without curling up in a corner in a fetal position, sobbing. ADs don't make me giddy or even really happy, but they take off enough of the misery and panic that I can function pretty much like a normal person, even with my alien H and horrible M sitch. I guess some people can do it naturally, but for me it apparently takes drugs. I fought that conclusion for a long time, but I accept it now, although I am always on the lookout for an effective treatment that is better for my health and well-being.

I do sometimes wish H would just drop the other shoe and move out already, because it causes so much tension for him to be here under the circumstances, but he hasn't so much as mentioned the possibility of moving out for months and months (no other R talk either). There are advantages to him still living here, but sometimes they don't seem too significant as long as he's still completely gone in la-la land. I'm just so very exhausted by his fence-sitting and his coldness. I can't let myself think about what we had together; it hurts too much, so I change my thoughts. He isn't that person any more.

I am still standing because I believe it is the right thing to do, and because I believe that God bound us together in a lifelong covenant and wants us to stick together despite anything and everything, and because I have a little bit of hope that someday he will return from the aliens with his eyes open and somehow this whole nightmare will all be worth it. My actions in this regard are not based on my feelings, because I don't want him as he is, and if I had known what would happen, I would not have married him. But I am married to him, so I will myself every day to trust God to do what needs to be done with my H, and I do the best I can to facilitate the process of reconciliation, but it seems very far away, at a bare minimum. I don't believe that God wants us to be unhappy, but I also believe that obedience and faith take precedence, and true happiness follows those. I'm still working the faith and obedience part and waiting, hopefully patiently, for the happiness part. I don't believe I've had all I will get in the way of happiness, although sometimes it feels that way.

I am kind of tired and frustrated with my sitch, as we all get sometimes, because it seems like the only changes I have seen in H and the way he interacts with me have been for the worse, even though I am doing what I think is pretty well with DBing. I do often wonder, "I think I'm DBing really fairly well; why am I getting nothing but a worse relationship as time goes by? I am following DB Coach's advice pretty well; what the heck am I doing wrong? Why am I not getting any positive results?" I would welcome advice. I think I am too close to it to judge well. I can say that I am still struggling with the whole forgiveness thing.

In other news (finally!), I am pleased to report that I have been contacted by a major wedding magazine to do some work for them, which if all goes well, will appear in one of their near-future issues with credit to me!! This happened last year but they ended up not using my stuff, after I'd spent several days working on it and never got a dime. I hope my work will actually get published this time.

Okay, I'm getting pretty sleepy but still have work to do. Still trying to catch up on everyone's threads after my weekend hiatus!

Peace,
Dawn

[AliSuddenly]

Hi Dawn,

First of all, I want to tell you thanks for all your help on my thread. You have been hugely influential in helping me cope and navigate my life this past year and understand where my ex may have been 'coming from'. What you said above, "I am still not convinced that my life is more of a benefit to the world than a drain on it, but I am willing to give it the benefit of the doubt for the time being"... I have to disagree! You have been a huge benefit to me, you have given me understanding, peace of mind, clarity and real compassion at times when I really needed it. Maybe you dont voice these thoughts in RL, maybe this is a place you feel safe to be honest, but I want you to know, without a shadow of doubt, that you may well 'just' be a stranger in cyber space, but you have touched me. You have really helped me at times and been a real positive force and thats no small thing. I am just a person in cyber space too, so if I feel this way, I can only imagine that your friends, family, colleagues etc feel that even stronger.

You are an amazing, insightful, thoughtful, caring woman and I have been grateful for your support....

Ok.. on to your H. I totally empathise with what you said about what am I doing wrong, I am DBing well, but getting no results?? I guess I felt the same all along and the reason was, because he was infatuated/obsessed/in love with another woman. And from what I gather, that often means nothing changes, no matter what you do. I remember feeling that I couldnt 'see' my bf (eventhough I still lived with him) during my EA... and at the bomb, when I went back over this old ground, crying, pleading, apologising (and of course he was resolute, made no difference!) but he muttered to himself "like I was a ghost...." - I remember clearly, it was one of the many many comments I have logged in my brain over the past year that seemed odd (I cant believe how stupid I have been!). Anyway, the point being, he was in the grip of ow when he dumped me I now realise and that was him voicing how he felt.. I was a ghost to him. Like I was there, but transparent, he couldnt see me, he was looking right through me.

I dont know if that helps, at all, but in a way, what can you do whilst the PA is raging on? I think, like my ex, your H is being pretty cruel and selfish and self-serving, but that is how they all behave, because they cant see past their noses, or the ow's nose. I dont think you will be near reconciliation until either the A burns out, or he finally makes a decision thats healthy for all three of you, as this current sitch obviously isnt.

Love Al xxxxx

[Dawn of Hope]

Ali,
Wow! Thank you so much for your kind words! That is so sweet of you! Even with the ADs, I still get down sometimes, although in my last post I was trying to recover from being off ADs for a few days, which is significant and definitely has a detrimental effect on my moods. I am doing better now that my medication levels are back in balance. It also helps for you to point out how hard it is to make progress in the R when there is an EA/PA going on. Yeah, I feel kind of stuck in that regard. Although, oddly enough, in the last couple of days I have been getting a tiny bit more interest in my life from H. Not letting it change what I do or think, just an observation.

I had another insight into my sitch tonight, but now I've forgotten it! I'm not feeling entirely well--have a headache, among other things--which may be affecting my ability to think straight. Oh wait, I just remembered! It occurred to me (in one of those blinding flashes of insight) that it can't possibly be just money that is preventing H from moving out. Why? Because he is still sleeping in the same bed with me, even though there are several other places in the house he could sleep if he wanted to. If he were really so gung-ho to get away from me, he would at least move out of the bedroom, I think--and that isn't a money issue! Okay, I feel better now!

I have been trying to catch up on my work, which has been surprisingly heavy--usually things slow down at this time of year, but I'm not complaining; I can use the money! I'm a self-employed freelance artist, so if I don't work, I don't get paid, and I'm doing better financially this year than I have for about seven years! And the wedding magazine really liked my work, AND they are going to pay me for it, so that's very good!

I have also been trying, with no success, to get my sleep schedule under better control. Sigh.

I have discontinued working with my IC for the rest of the year because my insurance benefits for that have run out, and it will be more expensive than I want to deal with. I have been thinking about switching therapists anyway, as I like this one as a person but I don't think she is helping me much. Can anyone advise how to find a SBT therapist?

Okay, trying to improve on the bedtime, so going to bed now (it's only 3 a.m., instead of my usual 6 a.m.).

Peace,
Dawn

[Dawn of Hope]

Well, I think I managed to waste most of my weekend, which is not so good. I still have a pretty bad headache, which has been going on for about three days now. I finally took some ibuprofen for it tonight, but it didn't help much. That is normal for me--pain meds haven't worked for me for a number of years now, but I will still try them if I go for three days without any relief. At least I don't have headaches and such as much as I used to, before I became a vegetarian eleven years ago. I am pretty sure it was all the milk I used to drink that was giving me the headaches that I had daily for years, because they stopped cold when I stopped drinking milk, and I haven't drunk milk since then. Other dairy products don't seem to have that same effect, but sometimes I wonder.

Anyway, I am tired, headachy, and have too much work piled up. Mini-pity party!

But...I have work, so that means money coming in, and I am otherwise healthy, and today my H actually looked at me in a neutral way, instead of looking as though he hated me, and actually volunteered a little info about his day, which is not the norm! Babysteps...just keep on trying to do the right thing and DB out the wazoo...

I have also been struggling to get in my piano practice. I've been taking lessons with the same teacher for 10 years now, and she is great...she is quite a bit older than I am, and she also knows all about my sitch with H, and has given me a lot of support and advice (not always DB-friendly, but she respects my right to disagree), as she went through some similar experiences in her first M. So she knows why I have had trouble keeping up with things in my life, like practice, and is understanding, but has been encouraging me to get back on track. So I did manage to practice for about an hour total this weekend, which is a lot more than I have been getting in for a while now, so that's good!

I really feel like forgiveness is a key for me in my R with H, and I just can't seem to figure out how to forgive him, especially for things he has no immediate plans to discontinue doing. I have some books on forgiveness that I haven't made time to read yet, but I have done a fair amount of reading on the web (mostly). I just haven't figured out HOW to forgive and let go of those things, although I know all the reasons WHY. I don't need to be told what a good idea it is--I already know that. I just need help with how to get there.

Oh, this is really cool...I am sitting in my home office with the window open, and it's 2:30 a.m., and I just heard an owl hooting softly, three times now! I live in the suburbs, but not terribly far from forests and a river and fields, so occasionally there are some great wildlife sightings! Oh, wow...there are TWO of them! I can hear them overlapping each other, and the second one has a higher-pitched voice. They are apparently having an extensive discussion, because they have been hooting for about 20 minutes now! Wow, I wish I could see them, but just knowing they are there is great!

About five years ago, H and I were walking hand-in-hand through our neighborhood one night and I stopped cold and said softly, "Look!" We were between street lights, but there was enough light to see that just across the street from where we were, there was a big owl sitting on a mailbox. We watched for a couple of minutes, and then he opened his wings and swooped silently into the night. It was one of the more thrilling experiences of my life! More recently, H rescued a tiny bat (no more than 2 inches from nose to tail) from our swimming pool, and he hung out on our patio, suspended from the edge of the skimmer that H had used to fish him out, sleeping until evening, and then evidently headed off to catch some mosquitoes for dinner (we spent a lot of time watching him, going in and out of the house, and he disappeared between checks). He was so ugly that he was cute! And I was unaware that bats clean themselves with their tongues, just like cats do! It was so funny to watch him wash himself with his tiny pink tongue!

So anyway...must get some work done and go to bed. I don't think I will turn on any music...I'd rather listen to the owls!

Peace,
Dawn

[AliSuddenly]

Hey Dawn!
I've been checking on you, wow, you are even more of a night owl than me, with your late nights! I managed to claw back from the 3am's to the 2, and now, back to a respectable 1 am. I feel better for it!

I know you are struggling with forgiveness and letting go of hurt, but I was reading this this morning Priya Kale about this week. Seems like it might be time hey to step towards some healing!?

Also, the last post on my thread, before it locked was a good one too, about this week. Just thought I would give you something else to read, treat it as symobolism if you like.

Glad that H has stopped looking at you with contempt! So you share the house, but you get to bed very late? Does he? Is this something you could do a 180 on, keep the same hours as him?

Hav you noticed any more baby steps latetly, apart from the lack of daggers!?
Ali xxx

[MidwesternGirl]

Dawn

It takes awhile with regard to forgiveness. At first you are in shock, then you want to take matters into your own hands, then you get angry, and so on. I started off like that and I did other things as well but went to my pastors and they asked me which direction i wanted to go and helped me along the way.

Forgiving, patience, loving unconditionally all take time--lots of it and does not happen overnight.

[Dawn of Hope]

Hey, Ali,
Thanks for checking on me! Yep, I seem to be an incurable night owl! I have been fighting that tendency for about 25 years, but it hasn't stuck for any length of time yet!

I read the link you gave me, and about half of it was gibberish to me because I don't really have much to do with astrology , but the rest was interesting. I know what sign I am (Cancer--yep, I'm a disease! ), but that's about it. The rest--it's like, "Huh??"

In answer to your question about H and me and our respective bedtimes, this has been a problem between us for years. Before OW, he was trying to go to bed about midnight (he has to be at work at 7:30 a.m., and I am self-employed and set my own hours), and I couldn't seem to get there much before 2 a.m. or so. Once OW came into the picture (although I didn't let myself realize what was going on for a while), he started spending hours and hours on the phone/online with her (about 40 hours a WEEK, I once determined--and he hadn't even met her in person yet!). He started going to bed later--2 or 3 a.m. I have varied, but in the last six months or so, I've been struggling to get to bed before 6 a.m. (when he gets up for work on weekdays--we have sort of been sleeping in shifts).

A month before the bomb (bomb = when he went out of town to meet her, and I confronted him when he got back), I found her number in his phone and knew something really bad was coming. I was totally terrified about the future of our M, so with this added inspiration, I managed to change a bunch of things he had been complaining about for years--I did about ten 180s at the same time! This was one of them. For several months I made it a point to go to bed when H did, except when I had work I HAD to get done. This continued even after I got the OW confirmation bomb.

H did notice--at one point, he commented, "You changed your whole life around in only two months!" But I finally let it slide because it was just so much work for me, especially since he was no longer touching me at all (up until about the beginning of January, we ALWAYS snuggled a lot in bed--even after the bomb and total lack of intimacy, but then he stopped the cuddling completely), and I didn't think it made any difference to him whether I was there or not--maybe not too little, but too late. I don't really even think he wants me there, but he's still sleeping in the same bed, so it doesn't entirely make sense to me.

I could do the going-to-bed-when-he-does 180 again, but it's never gotten any easier for me, and I'm not sure there's any point to it from his perspective. Sigh. I would be pleased to get opinions on whether it's worth the trouble to try again. I have been trying to go to bed earlier for myself, because I know it is healthier for me (and better for my business), and I feel better when I do, but I haven't been seeing a lot of success with those efforts.

In other news, H is in rehearsals for a community theatre show for the first time in two years (he did A LOT of theatre in the 8 years prior to that--he was rehearsing at least three days a week, six to ten months a year, on top of his full-time job and plethora of other activities!). It opens in two weeks, and there are six performances spread over two consecutive weekends. In years past, I would go to every one of H's performances, unless I had a prior conflict. FYI, this is a little unusual--most spouses only go once or maybe twice, not six or eight times in two weekends. With most shows, I enjoyed going to all of the performances and seeing the nuances between them.

Before, I got a fairly extensive picture of all of the backstage relationships and quirks because H would tell me all about each rehearsal when he got home. This time, I get one-word descriptions since he usually doesn't talk to me any more than he has to. If one of my closest friends weren't also in the production (playing opposite my H, which amuses me--she in her second M, and is in MLC too, and she is *desperately* in love with the director, who is also her voice teacher! ), I would have no idea how the rehearsals were going! Anyway, I am wondering...should I do my usual thing and go to all of the performances? The director knows the basics of what is going on with my H and me (our friend who is in love with him told him about it), but I don't think my H knows that. We know a lot of other people in this theatre group, and I don't think any of the others know about the sitch with H and me, so if I'm not there, they will wonder (they may wonder anyway, because H and I were always very affectionate with each other in public, and now he won't touch me at all, ever). H doesn't seem to want people to know about what's going on--he puts on his wedding ring every day before he goes out the door (as do I--we have never worn them to bed since we got M), and to my knowledge has only talked to a very few people in his life about the sitch.

The other thing is that I'm worried about is the possibility that OW is going to come to the show. I'm sure she will want to see H on stage. I do NOT want to meet her. I don't think H wants me to meet her either--the last time it was discussed, right after the bomb, he said he was afraid I would kill her (and he was probably right to be worried). In fact, the other day I happened to notice someone out walking while I was driving by, who undoubtedly was NOT my H's OW but looked kind of like her, and I had to throttle the urge to stop my car in the middle of the street, jump out, and run over and hit her until she stopped moving!! A probably perfectly innocent and nice college girl, just because she reminded me of OW! Yes, I know I have anger issues. But not anger-MANAGEMENT ones! I am very self-controlled about showing my emotions!

I don't think he would appear in public with her around people he knows, but I'm not entirely sure. I hope not. Regardless, I am not sure what to do. I think I would enjoy seeing all of the performances of the show, but if I ride with H, that means that we will be alone in the car together for an hour a day, for six days. That is probably more time than we have spent both awake and within speaking distance, alone, *cumulatively* for the last six months. I could drive myself separately, and have sometimes when I had demands on my time (as H needs to be there an hour earlier than I would as an audience member), but with the price of gas now, it seems silly to drive an extra car back and forth six hours. I am probably making too much of this, but I have been wondering about it.

Okay, I am going back to work now, and hopefully going to get some sleep!!

Peace,
Dawn

[Dawn of Hope]

Dawn

It takes awhile with regard to forgiveness. At first you are in shock, then you want to take matters into your own hands, then you get angry, and so on. I started off like that and I did other things as well but went to my pastors and they asked me which direction i wanted to go and helped me along the way.

Forgiving, patience, loving unconditionally all take time--lots of it and does not happen overnight.

Hi, MWG,
Thanks for posting to me! I was apparently in the middle of my long rant when you posted.

You are dead on about the stages--that is exactly what happened to me. I am apparently now stuck in the anger phase, and have been for about eight months. I have been meaning to go talk to my pastor about forgiveness (I saw him twice very early on after the bomb, and was still in shock at that point). I think maybe it is time to set up an appointment with him, especially since I have had to discontinue my IC for the rest of this year because of the limitations on my insurance coverage.

I seem to have the patience down pretty well, but I am not getting the hang of the forgiveness, that's for sure. I think that goes hand-in-hand with the unconditional love...although I still love H, but it is the VERB "love," not the noun (the feeling)--it is through an act of will rather than my feelings. Those feelings of love are in storage for now.

Thank you for saying that it takes lots of time...I have been feeling a little deficient for not being able to sweepingly forgive, even after a year. I will keep working on it, looking for different things that may help.

Thanks, MWG, you have so much wisdom and I greatly value your advice.

Peace,
Dawn

[AliSuddenly]

Hey Dawn,

In answer to your question... I could do the going-to-bed-when-he-does 180 again, but it's never gotten any easier for me, and I'm not sure there's any point to it from his perspective. Sigh. I would be pleased to get opinions on whether it's worth the trouble to try again. I have been trying to go to bed earlier for myself, because I know it is healthier for me...

Absolutely !!!! You have to get a hold of this, I thikn its really important for the future of your M, assuming the ow goes one day, that you and your H keep the same hours, so start practicing now! Passing like ships in the night is not going to be healthy for your R at any time and especially not right now. You are making it easy for him to lead a separate life, kind of colluding if you will. Also, I thikn for yourself you should get into a healthier timeframe. You say its to do with work, but if you can get to bed earlier, you can start in teh day earlier (hard with creative things, I know, my brain wakes up after 10 pm too!).

I have always struggled with my body clock and my natural one is probs 2.30am - 11 am ish, but that doesnt suit a working day. I was complaining to someone about this and they said do you know what the cure is? SET YOUR ALARM. So, ok, you cant go to bed till late, but if you set your alarm at a reasonable hour, like 8am, you will wake up and gradually you will need to get to bed earlier, you will reset your body clock.

As for the play, I cant imagine he would 'bring' her, but maybe she will surely be there in a back row or something?? Do you not know what she looks like? DO you have to go to all of the shows?
Ali xxx