I still believe in miracles

[istherehope]

Thanks Sep,

I really did think it was a great night! Sex twice in a night is always good. The 2nd time was really good because at first it was a spontaneous cuddle. I think he realized what he was doing though, and that's why he started it so he could stop cuddling :). In fact when I got online this morning I even saw that H had continued to IM me after I closed the laptop, asking what I was making him for dinner...the whole exchange was so normal like we lived together. His thing with that now is, it's only comfortable to be with me, the in-love feeling isn't there. It's pretty frustrating. There is a physical attraction, a comfort, common interests, a shared life etc. Not sure what else he thinks there should be...

He's online now and hadn't reached out. I decided to send one more brief email, in the hopes that it would smooth things over. I sent this:

"I think I'll just book a hotel for this coming Monday, a cheap one by the airport as I have to fly out early the next morning anyway. I was insensitive here not thinking about how close the dates fell together and how that might be pressuring. I'm sorry."

He just IMd me right after, "sorry if I was mean; I just get really confused about the dates." I said, "I understand, you're cool, well not really but you know what I mean :)." I was trying to be jokey. We went back and forth with some links to sites that he likes etc., and made reference (sorry if this is TMI) to some supposedly very bad oral something that I provided last night. He said I needed to upskill. Anyway glad that was thrown in there as it lightened the mood a bit. I also showed a lot of excitement over the links that he sent me. Hmm he also said we'd talk over the weekend, and he'd give me a call. I'm not sure I actually want that, as it's likely to lead to R talk. I think we're better if we don't go there. At this point I am seriously going to book the hotel tomorrow, and send him the link to the booking reference. If he asks me to stay then, that is 100% his decision.

Anyway, who knows what he's really thinking. I'm not sure that I would WANT to know!!! I am still not sure why I'm so scary to be around. Last night I did everything right, didn't complain when he left the light on late, didn't try to talk while he was going to sleep, said nothing pressuring etc.

OK going to try and get some work done now, after I visit your thread.

ITH

[Separated]

I'm sure HE doesn't even know what he is thinking!!! LoL

And I can guarantee you that you are not scary to be around. It's most likely his own emotions that are scary!! At least he did realize that he was mean and owned up to it.

[istherehope]

Thanks Sep!

I just hope he finishes that Midlife crisis book, and reads the part on relationships. He is so susceptible to every self-help book, and this one actually says that relationships are the greatest opportunity to grow etc. It talks about how people in MLCs tend to blame their partners for everything, when really the problems are being projected in most cases...it's really very positive. I checked where his bookmark was(yes, snooping) and he's about 50 pages away from it still. Fingers crossed he'll read it between now and Thursday.

Also, I booked a hotel and sent him the link. Up to him now whether he wants to tell me to cancel it and save the money.

Yeah it's nice that H noticed he was mean. He does notice about 50% of the time when I am extra nice in response. If I am not completely 100% calm, then he will blame me.

ITH

[optimistwife]

Hi ITH,

I think it is a good idea that you booked the hotel room. I would guess his head is reeling right now, and that he is afraid to be around you too much. This way you are giving him some space.

I am not sure how your husband responds, but you sound very apologetic in your conversations with him a lot of the time. I tend to do this to- This isn't such a good thing for me (makes me sound needy and sorry for everything I'm doing), so just watch yourself. It may be fine for the state your H is in (enlightened and on top of everything

At least he realizes a little bit that he is edgy. I hope that you can find a balance and make this two weeks work!

I know what you mean when you say that you are on trial. Don't you feel like you have one shot at this, and you can screw up anywhere along the way and ruin it? In reality it takes more than a few mistakes, but you do feel like you are living on the edge...

[JCJ]

As he seems to enjoy ML to you still, maybe you could both go to the hotel room - a different setting might do you some good. It would be different? He may not be ready though so you would have to play it by ear, just a idea...

[AliSuddenly]

I'm reading all the time and I think that things are still looking pretty positive! Well done you for shutting your laptop and also, not initiating any R talks.. I thought it was interesting that he continued to IM you when you were a little aloof, or not as responsive. Is that a 180? Does that give him the space to miss you and think?

Although he is holding you at arms length, its brilliant that he is open to self-help books and counselling with Jody. I suppose it could just be a matter of time...you know, its interesting that date on your thread.. "S to be revisited 14th October" - is that still true!?? (thats Tuesday isnt it?)... thats a Full Moon in Aries!!! It will air differences, but its an important date in terms of saying what you do and dont want in an R.. I am trying to read more about it this weekend, but I thought it was interesting if you are planning to have an R talk that night.

Full moons bring things out into the open, illuminate things that needed to be aired, time of culminations and new beginnings. How that works out for you, I dont know, but perhaps you arent still planning to meet that day!?

Ali xxx

[istherehope]

Hi Ali,

Thanks for this :). I actually typed the date wrong. I'll be back on the 16th, a Thursday. So he usually goes out drinking after his tests, and he has one on Thursday. I am actually hoping for this for 2 reasons. First, it's a 180 for me to be cool with him being out til all hours. 2nd, he may actually open up in a good way if he's been drinking, i.e. could be less guarded.

Actually H's involvement with self-help books is wearing a bit thin unless he reads the relationship chapter of the MLC book :). He has started using really annoying quotes like how I may need to find a new path for happiness or "relax everything works out for the best." He is very single-minded and right now he cares only about his fantastic new self...

In terms of the IMs and being distant, this is something I try on weekends or off business hour times, and it usually works reasonably well. Last night was different too because I was in our house and every question was as if I were living there, things about the pets or what I was cooking. I was aloof because I was frustrated with the sitch so maybe detached more. I was actually actively avoiding talking to him for the first time I can remember.I'm good about not initiating contact these days, sometimes I do send emails on days he doesn't reach out, but only business or holiday-related.

Anyway I am fairly certain I'll get some big contact from him this weekend or before Thursday in any case. After all I have sent several emails that had some emotional elements...

ITH

[istherehope]

Hi JCJ,

While I personally LOVE that idea, I don't think he'd be open to it if I suggested it. He will not talk about the fact that we ML or anything, and even last night, when he first came to bed asked if I was ready to sleep, and only after I said yes did he show interest. I think inviting him to the hotel would look like me trying to date him, which still freaks him out.

I'd love it if he suggested though, but I guess with the timing, me getting there around 11 PM, he's pretty unlikely to do that :(. i do love the idea though. Thanks for it anyway, just don't want to frighten him at this point...

ITH

[istherehope]

Hi OW,

Thanks for visiting my thread. I shall visit yours tomorrow!

Glad you think booking the hotel was a good idea. I hope it shows I proactively do things to give him space.

Great feedback about me being apologetic. I guess as of late I've found that apologizing is the one thing that seems to turn him around when he is saying really cruel things. It's what seems to bring him to his senses, but the point you raise about it making someone seem needy is really interesting. It seems to be OK in IM and email, but in person when I do this he always says it's not about the R anymore.

Still not sure about the 2 weeks. I am going to try for something more natural, like a few days here and a few days there, by my choice but also giving him control if he wants space. Not sure how this will pan out, but I don't like the forced trial period when he already has an agenda in place.

Yeah I totally feel like I am on trial. I mean he even used the word trial for the living situation, so I assume it applies equally to me, or more specifically to the R dynamic, which again is confusing. He wants a perfect R which I imagine includes intimacy and fireworks, but he wants loads of space, which means me leaving him alone. By this token, with me in the house, the R can't pass his test because we won't be able to develop it without me crowding him, which would mean me not listening to what he wants. Unfortunately I think there is going to need to be an R talk where we figure out what he wants from this period together...

In terms of mistakes, I only really made 2 throughout the summer, yet they are what H remembers about the summer, that I was so outspoken. He does not realize that I didn't reach out to him etc. for about 3 months. Pretty frustrating the way history can get rewritten!

H

[istherehope]

So,

Nothing new today. I am in the office for awhile as I am going to Paris tomorrow/Monday to do 11 interviews on an MBA campus...

Yesterday H said he'd call me this weekend, which made me a little nervous. I don't think an R talk is something that I want to have right now, and I assume that's why he wants to call. He knows I think they are inappropriate on IM. He also told me to buy myself something in Paris, which I think means he is feeling guilty.

I think I will just stay dark throughout the weekend and even Monday at this point, if he doesn't reach out. I will be on IM today as I'm at the office, but tomorrow will be traveling, and Monday busy from sunrise to sunset then traveling to Dublin where I presume I'll be staying a hotel. I'll get back to the office on Tuesday, so will be available then. Then, assuming nothing changes, I am going back to Dublin on Thursday. So, my question for everyone...if H does NOT reach out with anything R talkish by Tuesday, should I send an email in advance of simply showing up on Thursday? I've drafted one that is a little bit emotional, but that I think doesn't really ask for anything. I'd love to get opinions though. It is only to be sent in the absence of meaningful contact by H...

I start off saying I enjoyed our time, then go on to validate his feelings about marriage, as I'm not sure if I've done this before. Then I am thanking him for sharing his positive feelings, i.e. reinforcing the positives, and validating his concerns. The last paragraph is meant to highlight the fact that I have changed a lot as a result of this process, and that I am grateful to him for it. He didn't think I was open before, so am trying to highlight this, but not sure if it's a bit much.

Would love any thoughts on this. Could also be that if it doesn't get sent out in email, these could be things said during an R conversation, so I just want to know if they seem appropriate. Thanks!

"Hi,

Just wanted to say I’ve enjoyed our recent time together. Thank you for sharing your space.

I understand that you’re questioning a lot of things in life, including marriage and me. I don’t want to take your hard-earned changes away from you or tell you how to feel, or when to feel it. I appreciate things take time to work out.

I admire that you shared your feelings with me that you would like to see how things go, trial living together, etc. I will do my best to earn your trust and be equally open. You aren’t stringing me along; seeing where things go does not equal a guarantee from either side. We are taking well-informed risks. I understand your concerns about diving into this again. I also don’t want things to go back to the way they were. You were strong enough to back away once, so I know you would do it again if things weren’t better. You have new interests and friends, and I think that’s wonderful. One thing I’ve learned is that the best relationships are made of people who feel free to pursue their own interests.

I am open to anything now, living anywhere and doing anything, having kids, not having kids, etc., regardless of what happens between you and me. I say this so you know that you are not the only one who has changed as a result of this crisis. I think we are both better people for it. I really like the person who you are now, and you gave me this opportunity to grow. Thank you for that.

-ITH"