WAW - Possible MLC I need help, WAWs advice

[LonelyD]

Thanx, both of you. AmyC, you are like a dream come true to me. Anyway, I agree with both of you. I think it is unrealistic of me to force this. I have "compartmentalized" (love that word). I am over the leaving, the memories are mine, but I don't dwell. My detaching is hard as hell. I am doing it I believe. It is seeing her and not communicating or touching her that is tearing me down. I am now backing off my plan and wil do another. My focus now is to go dark, hard. I know karlah you did this for a while and got no response. I know she comes over my house during the week quite frequently. weekends she's with OM, but now I am not sure how that deal is going and I don't really want to ask anybody with my new attitude towards discussions about us. Anyway, I think seeing projects done that I know pissed her off, will open her eyes a bit. Again, these projects need to be done, not because of her. but they were things she had mentioned to quite few people, but not me.

I will go with a short term plan of getting through this long weekend. From there I will plan a goal for the end of the month. As the book indicates, if i can see it written down, it may help me stay the course. Please keep looking in at me. What about how things were handled last night? Should I do more of the same?

[thrillisgone]

Its not for me or anyone else to tell you to throw out the divorce threat. Quite frankly I personally wouldn't talk divorce unless I was emotionally prepared to file for it and follow through with it. That is just me. By your posts it is obvious that you aren't ready to divorce or that you want to divorce.

You're trying to push this along. This is a marathon and not a sprint. Consistency is key. Yet you want to go dark for certain periods only and do her brakes etc?

Be mindful that she has another guy on the side AND she is reading your every move. If this is MLC don't assume that you really understand what is going on in her head or what she is thinking. She doesn't understand what she is feeling. What she feels and does can change on a dime. Trying to react to her every move in the short term is futile and may even damage your goal of reconciliation.

Consistency, firmness and working on yourself. Strength is also important. In one line you talk about not talking to friends and family and then you say "comments from people about conversations shes had over this weekend and Monday show a positive sign........"

You are pushing this and I understand. You're hurting and you love your W and you want reconciliation. However, you can't control her. You can only control you. Drop the rope, let go and carry on with your life. Let your W see this and give her the space and time to look at herself and start to figure things out for herself.

Be strong. We're here for you.

[LonelyD]

People called me about her conversations with them, I guess hoping to give me a postiive feeling. Your last line is what she told the woman she lives with Sunday night.

I have dropped the rope as far as she can see. I am getting into my projects and have less down time with the DR book. It is very hard detaching, I give all of you credit. My dependency on her has gone for the most part. I do everything at home for the house and the kids. I ask her for nothing and expect nothing from her. I want the brake job done so I can move on. Tgone' your words are very good to hear and all of you have the same message to me. A therapist told me that part of my relaitionship problem was our co-dependency. She has told me how to deal with it and I am. I do need downtime and I am taking it Sunday. this day is mine, for me to relax, read the damn paper, watch some football, eat bad, greasy food and unwind. I think I may even have some wine. I am lookng forward to my weekend. don't ask me why, but I am. I know you are shut down with your exW and I understand how you got there, I need to know what things you had done in the beginning that you feel failed. i want to know if I am doing anything remotely the same. I have heard going dark works, and i have even seen it. After a week, she does contact me about nothingness. Hiolidays are coming. I have steeled myself to it and have prepared what and where I am going. Iu need to lok at funds for Xmas. Already talked to the kids about presents, and as I expected, told me if you can't get anything, we want you to know that who you are now is the best thing we could have hoped for. I know my changes are real and I know they have huge impact. I will be able to give them gifts if I have to cut body parts out. LOL...

I have such great kids, family and friends...Now I have all of you as well. My new attitude after AmyC's response and yours, is now, this is where I will come to for advice. I have cut the others off. Started last night with my son. Asked me about being home alone with her. told him I was cool as a cucumber, did my project, didn't peak in windows, thanks for asking. Then we talked about his job, what was on TV, he seemed more relaxed, I'm sure. So I see a huge interaction impact already. I will get all my blinders off in time, I'm sure. Keep looking in on me. i was told the other day by someone who knew me very well years ago. He said he was surprised to have heard about my situation. But he was mostly surprised that I didn't pack up all her stuff and through it in her car. He told me, you had the emotions of a brick wall, you never wore your heart on your sleeve and you were never worried about taking care of yourself or what anybody thoguth about you. But he says he understands, age softens people and time makes us different people. He told me to reach back and be the guy from then, the guy who walks into a room and women look at it, men worry and enjoys himself. You were the man at one time in your life, we all saw it, we all envied your attitude. He told me D, get it back man, get it back right now. i am steeling myself very hard right now. I am very driven right now, but she still turns me to jello. He is right, I was not someone who this would have shatered years ago. I seriously would have respoonded differently, but quite honestly it is what she really fell in love with. I took nothng at face value, I took nothing laying dwon and I sure as hell let nothing get in my way. It was nice talking with him and I am going to his house tonight. I have put so much behind me, I have spent so much time reflecting on my role in this, I have changed my persona, quit doing things that were damaging and doing some 180s, but I think the 180 I need right now is too back and get my attitude back. I an feel the emotion surging in me as I type this. If I am the man I want to be right now, then the attitude rejuvenation is going to make me the best of all. Do you think you had changed a lot of your married time? I spent a lot of time over coffee this morning thinking about his words which is what prompted me to drop the bomb. I understand everyone's point and I need to fight this urge off. But I also know tha tI need to be who I am, who I really am and not some door mat. I am going to see my local pastor i think, one day or night this week. Not that I am a religious person by any stretch, but I need to do this. I think I need to really try everything to get some perspective. I may not attend church, but I might, think probably I will when I close my camp. MY D says she wouldn't mind going with me.

Did you ever have a moment when you said, "I remember way back when, when I would've (blank) and not done that. Boy am I getting old or what?"

[karlah]

Hi--Sounds like things should turn around pretty quickly with the 180's and the changes you've made. You won't need to go dark since you've completely changed how you interact.

I'm waiting to hear how things turn around. Good luck.

karlah

[thrillisgone]

LD - LOL, we're all getting old and yes I changed alot since my younger days. I'm much softer. Big mistake. It it easy to take things for granted. Having said that, my ExW's journey started a long time ago due to severe hormonal fluctuations and subsequent medical issues. The difference in her attitude was obvious but too subtle for me to read what was happening. She became depressed,withdrawn and unhappy but even that wasn't consistent. She was in and out. It seemed there was little I could say or do that was right. What she needed I couldn't give her because I didn't know what it was. I know now that there were
changes I could have made in my behavior and routine that would have helped. So in essence I was a contributing factor but not the cause of her MLC.

By the time the situation became critical I was caught completely by surprise. Hell, my ExW didn't even understand what was happening to her. She was confused. My W having an affair was so out of character I couldn't believe it. She had constantly railed against this type of behavior. A woman who stated that her home was her sanctuary and that she loved her family and felt safe suddenly told me she hated her house. A week before she left she told me that she didn't want a divorce or even a separation and that "We'll work through this". At that time she was already having the affair. A week after that statement she left in a drunken haze.

So in the beginning of the crisis stage I was fearful, confused, hurt, in denial, and felt all the things that you have felt and are feeling. We had 30 years together and our relationship was the envy of friends and family. Everyone was shocked. My W was angry, lying all the time, hiding and she initially withdrew from friends and family.

So what did I do wrong? I tried to fix a situation in which I was totally powerless and didn't understand. MLC is very complex and above my pay grade and everyone elses. She uttered all the classic phrases and her behavior was textbook. The problem was I didn't have the textbook.It was inconceivable to me that she would throw away 30 years without a day of counseling. It made no sense that she would have an affair with a guy 70 years old. It made no sense that she would walk away from a house we bought for her and that she decorated with her heart. It made no sense that she would throw away her wedding dress, handmade clothing from her grandparents and a whole host of sentimental items from her childhood. All of this made no sense until I stopped trying to make sense out of it. You see, the marriage and the spouse are not the cause of this. We contribute to the problem but we are not the cause.

So I screwed up by chasing her. Expressing my love for her. Letting her know that I cherished our marriage.Forgiving her way too soon for the affair thus mainstreaming her actions. Enlisting family and friends for help.Pushing counseling and accepting all the blame out of hopes she might turn around. Hanging on too long and waiting for some sign of hope.

Once a spouse is in crisis these actions are way too late. Words have little meaning but actions speak loudly. You can fix you but they have to take responsibility for themselves. My ExW intellectually is 45 yrs old but emotionally she is going on 13. It is like going through puberty backwards. Well adjusted people do not routinely make impulsive destructive decisions. Hormones and mid life challenge men and women alike. It takes some unresolved issues to put people into MLC. My ExW has many. Only she can solve that puzzle for herself. You can't apply logic and rational thinking to the irrational and illogic. How much sense does it make for your W to being seeing another man, betraying your wedding vows and then coming to you for a brake job? Think about it. It is absurd. Would you screw somebody over in the worst way and then ask them for a favor? Of course you wouldn't.

Work on yourself for yourself . If it helps bring your W around, great. If it doesn't you'll be a better and wiser man. Also remember that you'll need incredible patience through this. This may resolve quickly or it may be 2 years or 5 years or never. That is what moving on and dropping the rope is all about.

[LonelyD]

Thanks for the feedback. So karlah, you think I don't need to go dark? I don't really communicate with her anyway as she doesn't live at home. Tgone, thanks for your sitch. I have alot of the same but stopped pursing after 4 weeks. I will take all this advice as I need to really get things going. Unfortunately, I need OM out of the way before she will consider. There are signs it may be failing, but who knows. I will have to move forward and watch,

[thrillisgone]

LD- A couple of notes here. Positive signs do not equate to resolution. Do not stop doing what is working. If this true MLC it will take considerable time to resolve and she might cycle through hourly, daily, weekly etc. I would look for sincere remorse for the affair and the willingness to do counseling either solo or couple or both and a real willingness for honest communication. Secondly she must cut off the OM completely and with transparency. You don't want her to come back and then do this again...and again.

The OM relationships almost never last. From what I've seen personally and read, the OP is quite often someone who doesn't match up to the LBS in significant ways and is not someone the MLCer really wants anyway. The OP is perceived to be filling an emotional need for the MLCer. That can be something as simple as your spouse feeling attractive to another man. In my case the OM is 70 years old and my ExWs father is 69 and terminally ill. I don't think that is a coincidence.

OMs and OWs are just about never what the MLCer really needs or wants. Lets face it, the OPs are screwing around with married men and women and that says a great deal about them already. None of it good.

Your W is cake eating. If you were to issue an ultimatum of any kind it should be that she stop seeing this guy NOW or face the real possibility of losing her home, family and marriage. You don't have to threaten to divorce her but it must look like you are moving on, letting go and that divorce may be the next step.

[LonelyD]

No, I agree. the positive signs are mostly her looking at me and that the OM mayb on the way out. Again, nothing definitive, but indications from people who know. I have read all I can about MLC, affairs and the like. you are dead on in your assessment and it is also what i believe. In my therapy session, it will be the end of the relationship with OM that she will look the hardest at me. Again, I know she must come forward about the affair and seek some type of counseling so tha tI am not back here once she does come back. that is why my DB'ng is all about me right now and heavy. It is also important that I am doing everything right, right now!!! If my therapist and opther counselors I have spoken with are correct, it will be her impression of me now that will either delay or speed up her willingness to come back. If she can se what I am now, and believe what she sees and hears about me, then I will be in a positive window.

that's why it is so important to me to make sure I am not doing anything wrong. It is also important, even in the DR book, that I look at things such as favors and the like as positive signs to see how i react. Trust me, when the OM thing is over, I have been told that I will know about it. I may even be the first to know about it. You and I seem to have a strong connection becaue of the similarities. I pray for you to find your happiness with someone. I pray mine is with her. I am strongest to bear any burden right now. I don't think I could have 9 weeks ago. Keep in touch with me.

[thrillisgone]

Strong connection? Keep in contact with you? You bet!

You see, I lost my marriage. It was the most important thing in my life.

I want to see you both come out of this with a marriage that is rock solid and better than before. I've seen it done. I've seen it happen. My heart would glow to see you succeed where I failed.

Fight for your marriage. That is something worth fighting for. Just do it right.

[sandi2]

Hi Lonely D,

I had a lot to respond to but as I read through the other posts, I see where most of what I was going to say has been posted already...lol. That's good.

I had you figured as being a man that was used to summing up a situation, figuring the soloution out and then expecting the results to be fixed.....b/c that is just who/what you are. Then sure enough you said it yourself. Your employment is a "fixer" so why wouldn't you be the same in a R? However, I hope you are discovering that you cannot fix a MLCer. No way, no how. And time? Oh sweetie, it takes soooo much time. If this didn't come to a head until August and you didn't sign on the bb until September......it has only begun.

Yes, you are a hard worker. I am too, and acutally find it difficult to know what to do for fun anymore since I can't be the one to entertain others. That was my "fun" before my health got to the place that I couldn't do things like I use to and it is very frustrating not to be able to "release" some of the feelings that get pent up inside. Everyone needs to have some type of enjoyment or just old fashion fun once in a while. It is healthy for them. I see you as being very hard on yourself the way you push yourself to finish projects that you have outlined to be done by a particular date. I hope that you will work at being a bit more flexable and relaxed before you have a heart attack. Yes, I do admire a hard working man very much!! However, there are other things in life that you need to try to make yourself do......as your therapist suggested.

I personally think you handled the wife coming over to b*tch about the cell phone perfectly. I don't know how she could see you as being rude when she was the one on her phone talking the entire time, but that is the logic of a MLCer.

I won't add anymore to what has already been said except that when you were told by several to stop talking to the MIL and that blood is thicker than water.......believe me when I say that is soooo true and you would be very wise to listen to that advice. That is all I can say about that right now. The less you say to friends & relatives about your MR.....the better. They feel caught between the two of you and feel they have to take sides. One will "report" to you what wife said or did, then another will "report" to her what you said or did and that keeps things stirred up in a bad way and makes detaching very difficult. Also, most friends will usually say what they think you want to hear. I think I read where you had decided to stop that. Good decision.

AmyC has been through the mill and back again, so any advice she gives.....please take heed. You have a chance if you will be patient, however, you are already talking divorce and I don't see that as a good thing. You can do dark and not file for divorce, b/c that is not what going dark is all about. Droping the rope is not filing for divorce. It is going on with your life as if she is no longer a part of it. It gets your focus off of her and lets you live instead of being in a constant state of misery. That is what you need to think about for now. Just live your life and not think about divorce. This is way too soon. Read the DR book and come here to talk, vent, and ask questions. You are a smart man, but you can't sum this up in a few days and think you can fix it over night or else you will decide to get divorced. This is Divorce Busting and we are here to try to bust this divorce from happening if possible. Okay?

Take care of yourself......and try to do something for fun.

Sandi