Wow, Maxy, that is a long saga. I'm sorry it's so hard.
Stepping back a bit...in my situation, the affair, the sex she had with my friend, the details... those were not the main thing. Sure, at first, that was a focus for me, but after the initial shock, the thing that really hit me was the deception, the dishonesty. When she continued to behave dishonestly, that is the thing I could not tolerate. That is the thing that I refused to accept.
A good marriage is recoverable after an affair, but my philosophy is that it requires total honesty. I don't mean, total disclosure of all details of the affair. I mean, honesty about feelings and ongoing activities. And that honesty is a 2-way street. It's hard for the affair partner to be honest if the left-behind-spouse is accusatory or is big into guilt trips. So honesty requires lots of effort and work and care on both sides.
I see some parallels in my situation and yours, Max. After the discovery, I read a bunch of books, all of which advised zero contact with the affair partner. I asked my wife to do that for me, for our marriage. She agreed. But then she continued to speak with him, email him. She got calling cards so that the phone calls would not show up on the house phone or on her cell phone. She used secret email accounts. She made excuses to me "I needed to talk to someone" as if the OM was the only person on earth she could talk to. She was continuing the contact, if not the sex, while lying to me about it. She was continuing the affair.
I found out that it continued, by hearing from the OM's ex-wife. She told me "I don't want you to be played for a fool." This happened several times. Or in other instances, my own wife would admit to me that she was calling him, seeing him for dates. Over and over again, I asked my wife again to stop, and over and over again she promised that she would, and over and over again that promise was worthless. It's like an addiction, I guess. on my part, too. I had to be loco to keep taking her back. What took me so long to say "enough is enough" ?
I don't really care if they had sex on that date, or what they talked about on the phone. That's not the point. The point is she continued to lie to me. That was intolerable. There's no way to build a relationship like that, on dishonesty.
So... I can see some similarities. Maybe I can see a little of your husband's perspective. In your case you said "no contact with OM since 2005" which is good. I don't know what you mean then, by "totally honest on 4/08". What were you not honest about before?
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In those years I have done everything asked of me by H and MC to be remorseful, sorry , understanding. I did this I thought while lying. Sooooo really I was doing none of the above.
This is the part I don't quite get. "I did this I thought while lying." So you were showing remorse and apoligizing, but yet still lying. Is that right? and if so, Lying about what?
Putting myself in your H's shoes... well no. that's not fair. Actually I am just going to speak from my own shoes...! what would it take for me to take her back? #1, Honesty. And #2, Some real signs of a change of heart.
She would have to accept responsibility for her affair, without blaming me, without minimizing (eg, she once told me, "it just happened.", and also "everything is 100% your fault." (my fault) Look, I accept my share of responsibility and I am willing to work on my part, but there is no way I accept responsibility for her getting and using secret calling cards and having sex with him in our bed. Sorry.).
She would have to commit to going to Retrouvaille with me.
She would have to completely renounce her behavior over the past couple years.
She would have to commit with me to a new marriage with new effort on just us - like date night every week, activities just for us (like tennis or ...?), and couples vacations, no kids.
Fifteen minutes of just-us time every day.
Boundaries with the kids - I want them to stay out of our bedroom, I want the bedroom to be mine and my wife's - just our own peaceful space with no toys and TVs and kids stuff. The kids can have the rest of the house, I just want one room for me and my love.
Those are some ideas. (I have some very specific ideas don't I? Am I being too demanding?)
So if your husband is similar to me - just tired of the deceipt -how would you go about proving to him that you are truly changed now? I don't know. That's a hard thing. It's hard for a guy who is punch drunk to go back into that ring one more time. I've been figuratively punched in the nose so many times by the wife, too many times for me to accept her again without conditions. I still want her back, but not the wife she was - the disconnected, dishonest, refuse-to-accept-responsibility wife she was. I have some minimal requirements now.
