So, we'll keep working on this! It seems that time is something you have! (Which is one reason I think you may have a chance.)
I'd like to teach math, say algebra and above, but there's no way I could make enough money at this point doing that! I think it would be fun. Maybe someday, when I don't have the responsibilities I have now!
Your creativity is there! I think you are just learning skills that will enable you to express it in new, and more exciting ways!
Great to hear the story of how you two first connected. It sounds like he was crazy in love with you to begin with, which is VERY promising. (I can see how you pursued him in the begining, which maybe wasnt so good though - what do you think?)
Now I remember about your B's love languages, they are the trickiest given its long distance hey?
What's in your 3 page apology letter? I dont think you should apologise for anything, but it might be interesting to turn an apology around into something to admire him for??
I agree that if you want to tell him that he made a good decision it has to come from the heart. In my sitch it really came from my heart, because I could see how much he had struggled and how he must have felt like he had no choice, so I was glad that he did actually did make a decision instead of staying with me and being miserable. I also knew that he was getting a lot of slack from friends and family about his decision to leave etc, and so it helped that I seemed to be the only one who understood, and that it eased his guilt slightly. But I dont know if thats quite the same as your situation.
Do you know what he is struggling with in his life, so that you could admire the way he is dealing with it? Especially if it can be a 180 that you are respecting his decision (when previously you would have critised)?? I think showing that you respect him is pretty important... Even respecting his decision to leave.
You know T, he could really have wished that he didnt leave you, but couldnt face up to talking about it with you, especially as you never had that final conversation. Is it possible that he needs closure? You could have a closure conversation where you drop into it that you would be open to trying again if you ever ended up living in the same city (or something, which gives you an exit)...
These is a list from his needs / her needs: The First Thing She Can't Do Without - Affection The First Thing He Can't Do Without - Sexual Fulfillment She Needs Him To Talk To Her - Conversation He Needs Her To Be His Playmate - Recreational Companionship She Needs Him To Trust Him Totally - Honesty and Open-ness He Needs A Good-looking Wife - An Attractive Spouse She Needs Enough Money To Live Comfortably - Financial Support He Needs Peace And Quiet - Domestic Support She Needs Him To Be A Good Father - Family Commitment He Needs Her To Be Proud Of Him - Admiration
It was good for me to re-read them and see the ones I need to work on. I guess admiration was what H needed from me... and its possibly the only one you can do long distance. Does anything else jump out at you?
You could try seducing him in a way to show him that you are still interested in a relationship? Definitely next time you need to touch him more in a flirtatious way. Even if he doesnt respond it seems like that might be a 180 for you?
The other thing that works for me is when H gets to rescue me (thinking mobile phones, and home rennovation stuff, cars, insurance stuff), particularly if another man has let me down. Is there something going on that would B could fight for on your behalf? Something he could fix for you long distance? Some advice that only he can give, that would make him feel manly and like he is providing for you? Of course you dont ask for help you just drop it into conversation about how much trouble you are having and how its making you upset....
Hey T....sorry if I upset you at all, or if what I said was a bit challenging. I guess, like me, you have to just trying to keep on keeping on, moving forwards with your life and trying to work on acceptance that you too arent together anymore. Maybe he will have a change of heart, my ex too, who knows. I think what happened to Essie spurs us on though, hey ?
Life is funny though.. I was in love and living with a guy for 3 years, he had an A and walked out...that ended I guess (we lost touch a year later) as he M somone else I recently found out..and when that ended, what did he do? He tried to find me! He phoned a mutual friend to ask after me and contacted me on FB.. 9 years after we split up. So you never know
Of course I had well and truly moved on, so naturally I ignored his FB message!....
Me:40! H:37 Together: 12yrs IDLY & left 11/07 ADs 03/08 OW 8/08 Reconciled 05/09 now married! my thread
WOW, thank you SO MUCH for all of your very thought-provoking questions!!!!! When I started this thread I thought I only had two options... reach out more or wait more. Now there are so many more ideas !!!! I feel at a total loss to answer some of these questions, but that's GOOD, that means we're in new territory, something unexplored!
I haven't heard back from him yet, which is OK. But I realized every other time I called he would call me back the same day. So... I hope this is in the "he felt close enough that he had to withdraw" category...? I really took it for granted before when he would call me back so promptly.
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What's in your 3 page apology letter? I dont think you should apologise for anything, but it might be interesting to turn an apology around into something to admire him for??
I had to go back and re-read it because it had been probalby 6 months since I had looked at it. I ended up editing it down to half a page. But the main gist is: I'm so sorry for how I treated you when we were together. I didn't want to grow with you sexually because I was afraid if you saw who I really was you wouldn't like it and you would leave. I didn't want to grow and become part of your family or include you in my family. I moved 958 miles away from you without even considering how it might damage our connection. I discouraged some of your dreams because I was afraid to be apart from you. I insisted on doing everything my own way and I didn't cherish you for all that you are. I think I understand why you made the decision you did and (even though it has been extremely painful for me) I am actually grateful for it because this experience has motivated me to get my [censored] together more than anything else could have.
Maybe something like... "I respect the decision you made because it motivated me to get my [censored] together more than anything else could have" as something to respect him for? But that is very much a statement about my own experience instead of him.
Do you know what he is struggling with in his life, so that you could admire the way he is dealing with it? Especially if it can be a 180 that you are respecting his decision (when previously you would have critised)?? I think showing that you respect him is pretty important... Even respecting his decision to leave.
I mean the last time I was really in the loop it seemed like he was struggling with many things... the logistics of his career (constantly traveling to different states to perform), his living situation with a bitchy male roomate, his finances, the future of his quartet??? But I'm not sure what he's struggling with right now? I know he told me a couple months ago he'd decided to stay with his roommate in their shithole apartment and in the past I think I would have encouraged him to move. ???
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You know T, he could really have wished that he didnt leave you, but couldnt face up to talking about it with you, especially as you never had that final conversation. Is it possible that he needs closure? You could have a closure conversation where you drop into it that you would be open to trying again if you ever ended up living in the same city (or something, which gives you an exit)...
This is so interesting! I thought that the way I was acting was making it easier for him to come to me and open up instead of harder..??? Your suggestion that I'd be interested in trying again if we lived in the same city-or-something is also interesting. I get a *feeling* that *maybe* he would be interested in trying again if I 'ended up' in NYC, because he has asked me several times what my plans are. but I could be overanalyzing.
The his needs/her needs list is really helpful. I think when we were both in Boston he was pretty satisfied with everything, but I know since I moved to atlanta he was totally sexually unfulfilled. He also complained to me that he needed more recreational companionship (he said all we did was watch LOST and do specific sexual things he found unfulfilling), about my attractiveness (he said he was sad that he only got to see me wearing yoga pants all the time). Domestic support is harder b/c that has more to do with his roommate than me.
I guess admiration I can do from afar. It's interesting, I was REALLY laying on the admiration at the end of our last lunch, after he started acting weird. So I don't know if it made him feel weirder or if he was already weirded out by the intrinsic weirdness of the situation. ???
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You could try seducing him in a way to show him that you are still interested in a relationship? Definitely next time you need to touch him more in a flirtatious way. Even if he doesnt respond it seems like that might be a 180 for you?
I'm not sure I even know how to do this anymore!!! Seriously I have trained myself not to touch him at all unless initated. Do I need to practice stroking my cleavage? Do I need to stroke... his cleavage? I mean would it be OK if I ... touched his hand or something? It would be a total 180 for me but maybe it would just make him run away??? What are flirtatious ways to touch someone that you're not dating yet? ????? I need HELP!
The other thing that works for me is when H gets to rescue me (thinking mobile phones, and home rennovation stuff, cars, insurance stuff), particularly if another man has let me down. Is there something going on that would B could fight for on your behalf? Something he could fix for you long distance? Some advice that only he can give, that would make him feel manly and like he is providing for you? Of course you dont ask for help you just drop it into conversation about how much trouble you are having and how its making you upset....
I am a little bit at a loss here and I might need some help coming up with something great!!! I think I know what you mean.... when I was in Boston B really wanted to help rescue me from a very negative roommate situation. I have always valued his advice and support in terms of career things, in fact it's one of the things I miss most since the bombs.
It would be totally valid for me to ask for his opinion on the cello I'm thinking about buying (he's helped me shop for instruments before, and was super helpful) or for advice about the schools I'm auditioning for..... but would that be showing him I wasn't independent???
Essie, I'm sorry if I'm slow on the uptake here! I actually printed out your post and highlighted it with pink highlighter so I could digest the info more.
Jeff, thank you for your support and encouragement!
I actually LOVE your apology letter. Do you think he knows any of this? Would it come as a suprise to him? Did you express any of this ever in the history of your R? Can you imagine saying any of this to him? I think its possible to drop something like that into a conversation, and it be much less confrontational than a letter....
My ideas about how you could turn some of it into a positive are (these are examples only, you need to adapt them to your actual sitch)
* B, I never really told you how much I admire your unselfish attitude. You really cared and considered me. I was a complete jerk and moved to Atlanta without even considering how it would make you feel. I meet guys but its such a turn off when they act selfishly, and I really wish they could be more like you.
* B, you really rocked my world sexually. I think about it all the time. I know my girlfriends would be so jealous and wish that they had partners who were so hot and as skillful as you are(ha ha - dont worry I cant actually imagine saying that aloud, but you get my drift!)
You could sympathise with his living situation, but then tell him that he always makes good decisions and you are sure he will this time too...
I think the line about how you would like to try again if you live in the same city is good, cause it is no pressure on him but gives him an opening if he is keen.
I think you need to practise flirting. And you can start right now! Of course you need to touch him on the arm, or bump into him, or lean across him, speak into his ear. All I can say is start practising on anyone! I'm not talking about initiating a kiss, but you can definitely do subtle touching. UNLESS you notice that he freezes up.
I have always had good results with H wanting to fix things and sort things for me. So I think its worth a shot.
You are not trying to be independent. You are being in control of yourself. You dont need him, but if he wants to help then all the better for it. Play the helpless female angle and let him be the man. You can do that and still be in control of yourself!
I would definitely ask for his opinion about the cello and the schools you are auditioning for. He probably doesnt want to fix your emotional crises (he will feel inadequate), but he might want to look after you in other ways. I remember he was concerned about your contact lenses and helpful about that. You've got to think of things that would make him feel protective of you - if you get ripped off, or given bad service. Just tell him the story of what's gone wrong, and how much trouble you are having, dont specifically ask for his help. Its really good to adapt this to whats actually happening for you now (dont make it up), and think of B's strengths, the subjects he is actually an expert about.
Last question is; Have you considered that there is someone else out there who could be even better for you than B is? Someone who would really get you and love you for being the lovely T? Is that a possibility for you?
OK look forward to hearing your thoughts! You are doing great!
Let me start by saying that I also love the letter, with the edit you settled on at the end of it. Essie's suggestions for edits are also great. The sexual one made me LOL because I told my H when we went out for our anniversary the other day I thought he was fantastic at that stuff and he was lucky he was so skilled in the art (that's a patenting joke- made sense to H and I, anyway).
OK, I think Essie's questions are really good and next time I'm going to have to read faster as otherwise I look like I don't have anything to add ( ). I do have stuff to say on the flirting front though!
1. Lock eyes with the person- really look them in the eye give them focussed attention. Hold their gaze for a moment too long then look away (down is good) and then look back up at them and smile (or, if you feel brave, lick the corner of your lips and breathe in deeply).
2. Cleavage stroking is FULL ON flirting- 'take me to bed' speak. Don't do it on strangers!
3. Stroke your hair while you're talking to the person. Do it subtley. Also, try stroking your thigh or tapping a finger gently on your lower lip with your mouth slightly open.
4. Dangle a shoe off your foot. Or sit with legs crossed and stroke one leg against the other ones' calf.
5. (And this is probably the biggest flirtation of all, although it's just charm) when you're talking to someone, really listen. focus all your attention on them and what they're saying. As they're talking, make a triangle with your eyes that rests on their eyes and every now and again on their lips. If you feel very brave, widen the triangle down to the crotch region.
If only any of this stuff would work on H, or anyone else for that matter! The trick is to practise on people- do it whenever you get the chanc, as none of this stuff will automatically mean you end up in bed with someone. it's a case of practising sending the signals in isoltion so that when you and B see each other again you can use them in combination for devastating maximum effect.
Oh, and (this is from the CEO flirtation text book), when you see B next time, if you're sitting next to each other subtley rest your thigh against his. He (if he's anything like me) won't be able to tell what this means, and you'll have the excuse of just spreading out. Hopefully B will then spend hours wondering what it all meant!
(((((Lovely Queen of Beautifully Seductive And Flirtatious Melons)))))
). I do have stuff to say on the flirting front though!