I'd concentrate your sexual frustration helping your wife find a new job. It sounds really, really serious.
I'd find a counselor if I were you and go by yourself. You don't even have to ask your wife to go with you. You going by yourself will be statement enough.
I think you will be pleasantly surprised at how it will help you and your marriage. There are just WAY too many people on these boards who have gone and benefited from the experience. You do need to keep an open mind, however. Counselors do not listen to you for a few weeks, then hand you a list that says, "if you fix this, this and this, your problems are solved." It doesn't work that way. You'll see what I mean WHEN you go. It takes some really hard work, some serious introspection, and a belief that you can come out on the other side.
You and I once talked briefly about your wife's reluctance to talk about sex... we even hit upon the religion thing. Does she not talk about it at all? Does she think its something perverse that must be endured? Does she seem to experience pleasure from sex, but feel guilty for experiencing pleasure? Is she comfortable with her nudeness?
You get my drift. Do you want to revisit that conversation? Maybe there is something there?
Okay, I'll give some thought to the counselor thing. I actually don't doubt that it would be beneficial. My main concerns are finding time to go and the potential cost. I have no idea if my insurance covers such things - guess I should check that.
Now to revisit the conversation that you mentioned...
Quote: You and I once talked briefly about your wife's reluctance to talk about sex... we even hit upon the religion thing. Does she not talk about it at all?
She very seldom talks about sex - although I don't consider that too surpising since it seems that she wants to avoid it. But when we did have a good sexual relationship, she never talked about it, and she rarely communicated what turns her on, what feels good, etc. It was as if she felt that if she had to tell me it ruined the effect. This left me trying to read her mind, which of course didn't work. I don't think my wife realizes how different every woman is with regard to their sexual tastes.
Quote: Does she think its something perverse that must be endured?
No, I don't think she sees sex as perverse. Granted, she won't open up and talk about it, but then she has difficulty opening up and talking about anything personal. I think she actually wants to have a good sexual relationship with me but has simply lost all desire, doesn't know how to go about getting it back, and doesn't want to go to any effort to find out how she could get it back.
Quote: Does she seem to experience pleasure from sex, but feel guilty for experiencing pleasure?
She definitely experiences pleasure from sex, and I don't think that she feels guilty at all when she does. In fact, I'm fairly certain that she would always prefer to reach orgasm, although for some reason she's not very open to achieving it by any means other than through intercourse. I mentioned before that she claims to have never masturbated, and I think that she probably has some guilt issue with that. But she's also not very interested in me using my fingers, tongue, etc. Sometimes she's go for the fingers, but she pushes for intercourse pretty quickly once aroused.
Quote: Is she comfortable with her nudeness?
She hasn't been since since having kids, but she's been unhappy with her weight since then too. Maybe her success with this diet will help. Prior to the kids, and marriage for that matter, she nearly insisted on sleeping naked. We'd often lay around naked holding each other while watching tv. Now she barely gets undressed to shower.
lol My H is delighted and says he wants three now. That would be lovely but oh so very tiring!
Sooner, thanks. I don't think my H sees any glow though. He only hears the complaints. Poor thing. What he has to put up with for the next few months.
As with regards your W's change in being comfortable in the nude, I think it affects a lot of women. I am that way too. These days, I feel really uncomfortable being in the nude and try every possible way to hide from Hs eyes. Really silly huh? Even previously, I never felt that comfortable as your W in that I never walked around openly although I would sometimes "reward" H with the occassional peek when he thinks I don't know. Seems more mysterious and exciting that way. Hmm I really am interested to find out how men feel about this issue. Would you be turned off looking at a slightly overweight W when you're not in the mood for some loving? (I know when one is in the mood than it doesn't matter that much as you're wearing horny goggles - as someone once put it but what if you're not in the mood, would it be a turn off? Would you start comparing? Just curious.
Hey luvhubby. I was anxious to get on here and see how my last post turned out as I didn't have time to proofread it before hitting "Continue". Not too bad I suppose - I only noticed one glaring error. Of course with my tendency to ramble I'd have probably gone into even more detail if given the chance. I just thought I'd give you my answer to one of your questions.
Quote: Would you be turned off looking at a slightly overweight W when you're not in the mood for some loving? (I know when one is in the mood than it doesn't matter that much as you're wearing horny goggles - as someone once put it but what if you're not in the mood, would it be a turn off? Would you start comparing? Just curious.
Personally I don't think I'd ever be turned off looking at my wife naked, even if she was overweight. I'd actually feel good knowing that she was that comfortable around me. Now if it were someone besides my wife (assuming that some form of illicit fooling around wasn't involved - which I only mention because you're right that perceptions change when you're about to get busy) yeah, I'd probably be a bit turned off by an unattractive figure. But keep in mind that unattractive is in the eye of the beholder. For instance, I personally don't get very turned on by really skinny women - I like a little meat on a woman. And there are some women who would probably be considered a fair amount overweight, yet are shapely and have a somewhat sexy look about them that drives me crazy. My wife, right now after losing 18 pounds, looks outstanding to me. But I think that she still compares her body to the skinny, athletic build that she had in her late teens and early twenties. I prefer the way that she looks now, but I'd bet that she hopes to slim down quite a bit more before she's done dieting. I just hope that the boobs she developed during pregnancy don't go away before I've had a chance to touch them! Okay, maybe that's a slight exaggeration.
Guess I'd better go to bed before I get myself into trouble here. Good night!
Quote; --------------------------------------- I really am interested to find out how men feel about this issue. Would you be turned off looking at a slightly overweight W when you're not in the mood for some loving? ---------------------------------------
When are you ladies going to learn. It's the curves that count, not the weight. Realistically, if you weigh in at twice what your normal weight would be, then it is probably something of an issue. But 20 or 30 pounds? I don't know any man (in a relationship) that would even notice. I am sure it is an issue for some men, but I am also sure that it is NOT for most.
Want to knock him for a loop, then BE sexy. Sexy is an attitude and has little to do with how you look naked.
I like naked women - all different sizes and shapes. I like to look, even when I can't touch. Most men are the same in that regard. It would be fine with me if my wife spent most of her time naked (she did when she was pregnant). I could get used to that in a hurry :-)
-NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
Quote: Sexy is an attitude and has little to do with how you look naked.
Couldn't have said it better myself. I think that very few women understand this. You don't have to look like a model or have a perfect body to be sexy.
I personally think you have a 'control' issue going on in your house.
The fact that your wife enjoys sex, doesn't seem to have a problem with it when it does happen, etc., but refuses to speak with you about it speaks to me that she is 'controlling.'
This could be a by-product of her rotten job. She can't control the 'caos' and demands the kids bring to the table because she loves them and to feel resentment toward them is something deep down inside no mother can adequately handle, she is unable or unwilling to face the stresses in her life the job is bringing (and I think she has a male boss?)... so that leaves you, bucko. The only thing she 'can' control in her life is frequency of sex. I doubt she is even aware she is doing it. Because if she were, it would be WAY too painful to admit.
Is there any chance that your sex began to falter when the problems starting occuring at work? Was her father or her mother, or both, a 'control freak?'
Sometimes I think wives lose their libdo when children come along is because they create such havoc in our lives. I think if anyone knew what was coming by introducing children into our lives, the world wouldn't be quite as populated as it is. No offense to kids... I love both of mine dearly... but they did turn my world upside down.
That alone can affect the libido. But when you introduce into the mix also a power struggle at work, and she continually feels 'powerless,' I think she will gravitate toward controlling whatever it is she can in her life, consciously or not, just to have a feeling or measure of 'control.' You know? Hence, the diet. She is probably manical in her decision to lose weight, and nothing or nobody is going to stop her from reaching her goal... whatever that goal might be.... she may not even know what her goal is. I'd watch her... losing 18 pounds in three weeks is more than unhealthy. It will affect her period, her thinking, her quality of sleep... all sorts of things. I'd be careful when you 'do' have sex, too. There is a good chance during this time, even if she is on the pill, that she'll get pregnant again.
A woman in crisis is a very, very fickle and dangerous being. SHE IS IN CRISIS. Do you hear that?
I'd get yourself to therapy, pronto. Because if she won't go (and I doubt she will because she does not have the emotional staminia right now to deal with things going 'wrong' in her marriage as well), you can still benefit from the therapy and introduce things that can help her out.
You may be right about the control issue. At least what you said definitely makes a lot of sense. And as you guessed, she does have a male boss. There's actually 3 guys involved - one being her boss who offices in another state and gets fed bogus information by the second guy who is a real jerk that works with my wife and has basically made it known that he's trying to set her up. The third guy also works in her office and is essentially just a brown noser to the jerk, but he's a big part of the problem as well.
To answer a couple of your questions, our sex problems really started during her first pregnancy somewhere on the order of 6 years ago. At the time she was working for the same company but in a completely different role. She has two fairly different bachelor's degrees, one of which is the same degree that I have, and about 3 years ago she switched from one degree field to the other. However, in the previous position she had a boss that gave her grief as well, and those problems began sometime around her first pregnancy. So it is possible that our sex problems are tied to her problems at work.
With regard to her parents, her dad is about as easy-going as they come - probably a lot like me in that sense. However her mom is definitely controlling. I like her very much, but she definitely has her moments when she can be quite overbearing. My wife's brothers often joke about their mom being somewhat "Hitler-like" when they were growing up.
I don't think that my wife is particularly overzealous when it comes to things like her diet, although it is true that for her to do something that takes some effort, like the diet, she definitely has to set her mind to it. But, using the diet as an example, she does occasionally "cheat" by eating things that she shouldn't be eating, and even did so during the first couple of weeks when the diet was really strict. However, I'm not ruling out your theory about her - you could very well be right.
I'll keep the therapy thing in mind although I can't seem to get overly excited about it. I do however agree that it could be helpful.
Thanks for your opinion Corri. I really appreciate it.
I hope I didn't come across too dramatically. When I said that your wife is in crisis, I didn't meant to imply I thought she was ready to jump off a bridge or something. I just meant that she is on emotional overload, and has been for an extended period of time.
When I said she was 'controlling,' I don't think she is doing anything controlling on purpose; rather it tends to be more of a subconscious thing we do when we feel we don't have 'control' over our lives.
Even though your wife may cheat on her diet, and she may not seem 'manical' in losing her weight, diet is one thing that is readily controllable, see? She spends 80% of her waking day at work -- in an environment that causes her an immense amount of stress -- the other 15-18% she probably gives to the kids... and then you might get whatever is left over. She can say 'no' to you because she feels safe in doing so.
It takes some really hard work, some serious introspection, and a belief that you can come out on the other side.
My H is delighted and says he wants three now. That would be lovely but oh so very tiring!