WAW#9 Feelings

[Purple]

yeah purple you do that... post to me what you want to say to your H. This will be great....

Is that sarcastic or do you really mean it? I can't tell over the 'net.

[CMNM]

Then she says ok, I gotta go and hangs up.

So then I call back and kids answer. Why, Phil? Why?? She said she had to go. There was no need for you to call right back. I know that you will say that you just wanted to talk to the kids... I said good I just wanted to tell you guys good night. I took to both kids.

Then I ask to talk to her. ..and if it was true that you only wanted to say goodnight to the kids...WHY did you get her back on the phone again??? She gets on the phone. I ask her if she is alright. She says yes. I said ok, I just wanted to talk to you for a little bit. She said it's 10:30 and I don't want to talk now. Why aren't you hearing her??? I said ok, well I just had something funny to tell you, and you say you want to be my friend but you don't even talk to me. Ugh. This is so unappealing. Would you want to be friends with someone who would not let you have some breathing space?

I know you want to talk to her. I want to talk to my H, too, when he is not around. But, I have to respect his space. The talks that I force just never go well. Either do yours. You started your post by saying, "it could have been disasterous," and Phil, I am beginning to see that you have 2 outcomes: disaster or just O.K. The "O.K." seems to be considered a success for you. The people posting to you know that there is better, and honestly, we just want that for you.

PURPLE>>>>> SHE DOESN'T WANT TO TALK TO ME ABOUT ANYTHING!

She avoids talking to me because she doesn't want to change her mind yet.

Phil...she doesn't want to talk to you! You know this, but you keep on forcing it anyway. That is why your interactions with her are drying up. It is not because of something Ian told you to try that didn't work- this is your own doing. I really wish you could sit down and look at this for what it truly is.

I am posting to you because I have done the same stupid things, so please do not think that I enjoy watching you spin like this. I am trying to spare you the same pain I have put myself through.
I see that Ian is doing the same. Please listen Phil! You have people who truly want to help you.

I know you are getting buried in an avalanche of advice, so I will stop here. The good thing is, it seems that all of us are telling you essentially the same thing. Who will you believe, Phil? Who here can say the magic words that will not get you defensive? Instead of pushing your own agenda, please try to address the comments and questions thrown your way. I think it will go a long way in helping you to understand why we are saying the things we are.

You can do this, Phil. A lot of people are pulling for you.

Pam

[upside_downer]

Hey Phil. I wanted to ask you about something I've noticed in your train of thought that is similar to mine:

It seems as though things in your world are black and white. Yes or No, right or wrong. There isn't much squeeze room. I like it when things are clearly defined, and therefor, manage them that way. It makes my life a lot easier to know, one way or another what we are dealing with.

Like me, does it drive you crazy when people answer a yes or no with "maybe?"

I don't mean to hijack, either, but Brandnewday....you seem like you've been through hell. 2.5 years of S? I'm struggling with 1.5 months!!!! Could you pop over to my thread and help me? I can't seem to make progress because I keep falling flat on my face!

[LostPhil]

upside down there is no grey... There is no spoon.

Can't accept maybe.... Hate maybe. That be fuzzy logic.


Pam, I think I'm done...pull the handle, blow out the candle. There is no reaching her. Her mind is gone, and I really believe there was a motive behind the I lost my keys story. Would I have been able to pull that story when whe were together. Nothing adds up. Nothing makes sense. She is just getting more distant.

I ruined her life...

How much space does a person need... Really I think it would have been better if I never found this site.

You are all driving me nuts...

After church today I was thinking I should have stopped and saw her at the ice cream shop. But no I didn't do it. They was no one in line. There was no one there. Just popped in ordered a coke and see if the boss lady needed any repairs done.

Some things in me thinks I should put a damn tent in her yard and stay there all night.

The explorer key... I'm convinced she thinks I was going to steal it. So what a$$hole friend gave her that dumb idea.

This is not normal behavior. She is not normal. I think it is time for me to cut my losses and land the plane.

[CMNM]

Phil, I can understand how this is all driving you nuts. Take a break and regroup. In time you will see that finding this board was a good thing.

I think you are speaking out of anger. Because the Phil I have read about doesn't believe in divorce. Or acting on feelings. The Phil I have read about believes in fighting for his family.

Rest, Pray, Give it to God. I hope you will know that there are many people who will be here for you if you do want to continue. Phil, you think very quickly... as do I. I think your brain needs a rest.

If you think your wife's mind is gone and there is no reaching her...use time away from posting to go read BND's old threads. Yeah, her H's mind was gone, too...

Hugs, Phil. I think you sure could use one or two.

Take Care,
Pam

Psst...By the way, I think in black and white, too. That is one of the things my H most dislikes about me...

[LostPhil]

Pam,

No my head was racing before, it was racing for 8 months, but it finally quit the other day. My stomach feels good. My body feels good. I have a clearer mind. Maybe now its time to begin with a beginners mind.

Tell her I'm done fighting for the family. File the divorce paperwork. Give her what she wants. Take the deal. No alimony, no child support, no future indemity to other profits. Sell the house, before I loose everything.

She said to me about a hundred times that I was going to loose everything. So lets prove her right.

If you love me you will give me a no fault no contest divorce.

Let me stalk her and kill her, because that is what she thinks I was going to do.

Now her diabolocal mind was thinking I'm so smart I'm going to steal her car. Can I have the key back since you found yours. Why. In case I need it. Well can I have a Jeep key. Take the Jeep key.

What I could have said that would have been disastorous was because its my damn explorer. Why should she be entilted to it. We came into this marriage with nothing you can leave with nothing. That was the rule from the beginning. We built this empire. Ok how does the future look for her. She will work at an ice cream shop. She couldn't swallow some pride or something. I loose the house. I loose everything. Does that give our kids a good future.

She needs to realise I'm not her enemy.

Even tonight after the conversation, I did text her. Thanks for treating me like dirt. She text back. I'm not.

Then I text: Did you ever tell me good job for doing the house. Going to work everyday?

Then I text: Thank you for being a good mother.

Then I text: Kids say your prayers and be good for mommy.

Then I text: Good night family, I love you. and wife I love you.

She text back. Good night.

S P A C E ! you can go to space! Space, feelings... bullcrap. Selfish behavior. Going against God. Going against his Church.

CCC 2386 It can happen that one of the spouses is the innocent victim of a divorce decreed by civil law; this spouse therefore has not contravened the moral law. There is a considerable difference between a spouse who has sincerely tried to be faithful to the sacrament of marriae and is unjustly abandoned, and one who through his own grave fault destroys a conically valid marriage.

Was I unjustly abandoned? In my opinion I was...

[CMNM]

With all due respect, beginning with a beginner's mind does not mean giving up!

Phil, another important thing I have learned is to never say something that I don't mean.

You don't want a divorce. So don't tell her that you are going to file. Heck, don't file!

Just don't say anything. If you are truly done fighting for your family, you wouldn't have to say a word. Actions are everything. When you feel the need to proclaim "I am done fighting," well, that's when you are doing it for a reaction.

You're hurt, and rightfully so. Don't react from that place. If you are truly ok with a divorce, then you would truly be ok with no contact. Try that one first for awhile.

I don't think that you are her enemy, and I doubt she thinks so either. But I wonder if she thinks that she is yours. I mean, if someone was thanking me for treating him like dirt, well, I wouldn't feel any love there.

Be still, Phil. Just "be" for a bit. The answers will come to you.

More Hugs. I think you need 'em!
Get a good night's sleep.
Hope to see you here tomorrow, perhaps feeling a bit differently. 'Night Phil

[craig54]

phil, stop pushing her. stop texting her. stop feeling sorry for yourself, get up and get to work.you have had more advice than anyone i have seen on this site in 9 months. listen. start doing . your wife has no idea what she wants, just like mine. you are filling in her blanks for her. stop it. let her fill them in. let her start any correspondance. be friendly, stay away from r talks.give her space. she needs time to figure this out. stop hounding her. she will never be able to deal with this if she has no space. stop sabotaging your own efforts. this takes time and patience, do you have the moxey to do this? talk is cheap, actions speak louder than words.sometimes doing nothing is fighting. stop fretting about what she is or is not doing. i know it is hard, i fall into the same trap. keep focused on the goal. it is a marathon. you must pace yourself.

[*KS*Chick*]

Phil -

I have a couple of questions for you. Earlier on your threads, bi-polar was mentioned and you said you were. I am not sure if you were being serious or sarcastic. If you're serious, are you on medication for that? You are all over the place, and you're digging your own grave with this marriage.

Another question - why did you choose the DB board? I mean you hate all of the advice you're given and you already know everything so what exactly do you need the board for? Why do you think you came here originally?

I'm sure you will either ignore this or blow up - whichever works best for you but here goes. It's no wonder she wanted a separation. You don't seem to be too pleasant of a guy to put up with. I see you still put it all on her. You ask what about the vows SHE made? Well Phil, what about the vows YOU made? Love, honor and cherish? It seems like it's still a pissing contest. This can't be handled like kindergarten. You have to make a decision. You have to decide if you want your marriage or you don't.

You seem to be against the whole self reflection thing, taking umbrage when people say you need to change your actions, or work on you. You act as if you have nothing that needs to be changed. Arrogance is NOT an attractive trait......sorry to tell you. And from many of the posts in this thread (and others) you seem to take a holier than thou attitude with her, reminding her of her faults, or things that piss you off. Again - it's no wonder.

If I had a choice of being alone, or getting my nose rubbed in everything I did.....I'd choose alone.

And I agree with those telling you to stop talking. She doesn't want to hear how you love her right now. Words - are dead. Your actions need to show her. Your words are empty when your actions don't match those words.

I hope that you really read this, and don't blow over it or turn it all back on me. I do pray for you Phil - to have your eyes opened. I hope you can save your marriage.

[upside_downer]

Phil-

One of the hardest things I've had to accept is that there IS grey. When I was lucky enough to have my W in C with me, our C focused on the way I refused to see anything but yes or no. When asked about whether my W wanted to continue the M, she said maybe.

That would put any of us B&W thinkers into a tailspin, but you know what? They were right....whether we WANT there to be or not, there IS grey, there IS color, and there IS maybe.

It seems your wife sort of fits into that "maybe" a little bit, and you are doing exactly what I did.....forcing her into a "no" because that is the only thing we understand and see.

So....MAYBE you can make this work. That doesn't mean everything goes back to "normal" and life is peachy again. That means MAYBE by doing things differently, you will be able to see something other than yes, and no, black and white. You know that what you had before is gone. And you also know that right now, you have the chance to build something better. I know you can do it.

That choice is up to you, bro.