I can truly see how much you love your wife. I can also see how much she loves you.
I wish YOU could see it from the outside looking in.
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It was kid, kid, kid, kids... kids kids, watch the kids. Are the kids breathing. Are the kids all right. What did you do to her. What are you doing. She can't breathe.
Not everyone can handle motherhood to perfection Phil. Sounds to me like she's trying to catch a break? Run from the shiit thats going on in her mind? Breathe?? Yes, she's a bit on the neurotic side, but you love her. So with this loves comes acceptance of her ways, If she wants to change, she will be the one making that decision.
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I think she is just really tired, exhuasted and can't handle them both. They both can be challenging at times. I think I have a pretty good handle on them now. She doesn't never did.
Forgot one person she can't handle. YOU. Give her a break Phil. Do you see how you downplay her at every chance?? You can handle the kids, she can't, never will. She needs YOU to handle everything. No Phil, she doesn't. She's trying to show you she's capable but you will not let her.
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She went into the house and I followed. She said get out of my house. I just want to take a shower.
4X4 SMACKDOWN!!
She's exhausted she's on mental overload all she wanted was a friggen shower and you couldn't give that to her Phil. You dumped more guilt onto her already full plate. Why? It's not all about you Phil. It really isn't.
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Gee whiz son and I left. Then I called her phone. I really just wanted to talk to daughter but she answered.
No you didn't. You wanted to talk to HER!! You got exactly what you wanted. You needed to unload more guilt onto her Phil. STOP THIS!!
If you want her to stop being angry at you stop giving her reasons to be. You and only you are now the person that is going to destroy this marriage. Not her.
Hell, she's only trying to step back and catch her breath but you will not allow that to happen!! You will not allow her to grow up and take care of her responsibilities.
I will not quote the rest of your post, because to me it's all the same. You easing your conscience by laying more guilt onto her plate.
How I interpret the end of your post is like this.
Wife ends this "push me over the edge" conversation with "I love you too Phil".
Why?
Because she knows it's what she has to say in order to go get her shower, get you off the friggen phone without worrying about how many calls you'll slam her with later and have some peace.
It's more of a defeated "I love you too Phil", than a lightning bolt moment.
Is this what you want? For her to come home outta guilt? Defeat? Without having the chance to find herself and be at peace with her decisions??
Again Phil, and this is just my opinion, your pushing her further and further away everyday you continue with your actions of love towards her.
You are not showing her love, support nor are you positively re-enforcing her.
When you decide to stop acting like the wounded child she will stop trying to defend like a wounded child.
Your actions = her actions.
Your stubborn Phil.
TGIT!!
Jeanette
Change the Policy. Allow PM's Free all of us.
Also some new and improved emoticons would be nice!
Phil, at some point in time in no longer is a good enough excuse to say rookie mistakes........
Stop talking dude. Do you not understand that if you are the one to continue to initiate the talks she will never truly believe that you are listening to her?
Let her talk if she wants to not because you started your crap on her again.
You are getting yourself into a position that you are unlikely to be able to get out of. If you keep pushing R talks and then finally realize that you shouldn't be doing this, how is it going to look when you do finally pull back.
Just be still, what happened to your mantra?
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She went into the house and I followed. She said get out of my house. I just want to take a shower.
Gee whiz son and I left. Then I called her phone. I really just wanted to talk to daughter but she answered. I think I gave it to her again. I'm calm. I never wanted to hurt you. I want to do everything for you and I thought I was. I want you to stop being angry at me and talk to me.
If you really just wanted to talk to your D, when she answered you would have said I just want to talk with D.... Left it at that instead of opening your mouth again.
At some point Phil, you are going to have to become accountable for your actions and simply saying you slipped up won't cut it anymore.
Have you considered the coaching available here? I would highly recommend you do. I would ask for Chuck as I think he may be strong enough to handle you and help you see why you are causing damage by constantly talking rather than controlling the situation.
Thank you Sandi2 for posting this and I hope you don't mind me sharing it with Phil!!
Some good rules for you to follow Phil as your breaking them all.
1. Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or implore! 2. No frequent phone calls to him.......let him be the one to call you. Then don't try to hang on to him through conversation.....say good-bye first. 3. Do not point out good points in marriage or try to get him to read marriage books, etc. 4. Do not follow him around the house like a puppy dog trying to get his time and attention. (Remember, you are drawing him back with this technique.) 5. Do not encourage talk about the future. 6. Do not ask for help from family members. 7. Do not ask for reassurances (That is showing neediness and being clingy.) 8. Do not buy gifts. (Can't buy his love and affection.) 9. Do not schedule dates together. (That is pursuing.) 10.Do not spy on spouse. (Not good for you and will make matters worse.) 11.Do not say "I Love You" (It is being "pushy" and trying to make him say it too......he will despise you for it.) 12.Act as if you are moving on with your life! 13.Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive at all times! 14.Don't sit around waiting on your spouse – get busy, do things, go to church, go out with friends, etc. 15.When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation---then don't, wait for him)then,be scarce or short on words. If he asks what's wrong....just say "nothing". Keep it short and simple. Don't get into an argument! 16.If you are in the habit of asking your spouse his whereabouts, ASK NOTHING!! No matter what time he comes home! 17.You need to make your partner think that you have had an awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you are going to move on with your life, with or without your spouse. 18.Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull back and wait to see if spouse notices and, more important, realize what he will be missing. (But never ask him if he has noticed any changes!!) 19.No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment. Show him someone he would want to be around, somebody that is attractive and fun. 20.All questions about marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while) 21.Never lose your cool! Don't let him trap you into a fight. 22.Don't be overly enthusiastic b/c it will come across as fake. 23.Do not argue about how he feels (it only makes his feelings more negative.) 24.Be patient......very, very patient. Give him space and time. 25.Listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you 26.Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you want to speak out (or scream and yell). 27.Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil) 28.Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly. Read self help books, inspirational books or tapes. 29.Know that if you can do 180's, your smallest CONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say or write. 30.Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are desperate and needy 31.Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse 32.Do not believe any of what you hear and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because he is hurting and scared. 33.Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel. 34.Do not backslide from your hard earned changes.
Change the Policy. Allow PM's Free all of us.
Also some new and improved emoticons would be nice!
I know I am doing everyting wrong. I even told her that. I just can't help it.
Even when I dropped off my son after all that. She said thanks for doing my laundry. I handed her her half basket full of clothes. I said no problem.
Then she said my house isn't a dump. I said dear I was just trying to prove a point that you have accepted things about this place that you would have never have lived with in our house. You would have badgered me forever until I did something about it or replaced. And something does really stink, it smells like you have 1000 air fresherners in there. I said this isn't your house. Your home is up there, (pointing to the hill) and that is where you belong. You need to come home, your home. Then I kissed her on the cheek and left. I said stop shutting me out of your life. I love you, always did. She said ok.
You see folks it just ticks me off. I did say something about her place. The front door is in poor shape. The wood is all wringled. The bathroom sink has a crack in it and a chip. I would have heard about this everyday I lived there if that were the case to replace it. So I told her that the place was a dump. The downstairs apartment isn't finished but she has access to it for laundry. There is a washer and dryer there, but she says it leaks. When I first went there my nephew was there and said that downstairs is a dump. I could just imagine going through there myself and nitpicking things that would have been to her standard and she would have let me known about it.
You see its about her getting used to it. The noise. The things that are not so perfect about a house. Etc... Why couldn't she get used to it in our home. No she had to make a mountain out of a molehill about everything. Then she decided that those things didn't make her happy.
I kept thinking of the stories she would tell me about how her mother handled situations. How she would terrorize them when they were little kids. Maybe these are the things she is running from. Maybe she is acting out on those actions. This is how she is handling life right now, and I will not let her brethe. It is because I can not breathe.
Yep, I know I'm screwing everything up. I know I'm making things worse. I think its just funny though how everything I said to her on the phone the only thing she can respond back was, my place isn't a dump.
Frustrated, confused. .... You betcha... Acting like an idiot. yep.... Breaking all the rules....
You know it is still open lines of communication for which I had none. I just think man, I know my wife. I know how she is. If I could just reach her.
Jeanette, I know she can't handle the one thing in her life and that is me. I have been giving her space. I have not tried to call her. I do not call her at all. I basically leave her alone. The difficulty is dealing with the kid situation day in and day out.
I think yesterday would have been fine if we just left well enough alone, but my son wanted to be with me. That is one thing she fired back on the phone too. Your son wants to be with you go be with your son. I said I am, and we are watching a movie together, I do spend a lot of time with son.
She has time for everything else in her life so it is not about a damn shower or taking a shower. If she wanted to take a shower then she should have taken one as soon as I left. I waited 15 minutes from the time I left until I called her. You see I could have waited an hour and she would have said the same thing. I still didn't take a shower.
Comes to another story. She punched me all the time. She would punch my friends in the arm and stuff. I said when you friends say something you don't like do you punch them.
Really I can't take it anymore...It's all bullshit, and it is bullshit on top of bullshit.
This morning on the way into work on the bridge. I heard this hideous screetch and than bang. There was three car pile up behind me. I got out anyway and the lady behind me only had some minor scratches on the bumper. The lady was a CCD teacher were I taught CCD at. I told her she was alright. She asked me some questions and I helped her out. Man if I would have been 5 seconds early getting out of the house. I would have been in that accident.
I'm spinning out of control, and I'm sorry. I just find it so difficult to implement db'ing techniques. I also think I am now trapped into this realm of a plethora of advice.
I think I'm on overload. We her. With work, and with school. I'm still fighting for her, and I'm fighting too damn hard.
That's just it Phil, you are making it to complicated.
In AA they have a saying..KISS Keep it simple stupid.
You have to relax and let this be natural instead of so forced. The DB principles are not complicated unless you try and overanalyze every situation.
You have to get in a mode of simply knowing the basics to start with.
1. No R talk- Simple enough 2. Detach- as weird as it sounds, do not personalize her actions. 3. GAL- Stay focused on your kids and you. Do some things that don't involve thoughts of your wife. 4. Validate- When she does choose to speak to you, simply validate and no more.
Start with those four and in time it will become more comfortable for you to work in other DBing techniques. You must master the basics before you go further.
Look at it like this, you wouldnt take intro to spanish and then move to Mexico and expect to be afluent would you?
Phil, you have been getting so much better over the last week or so and even though you may not see it, you are making progress.
Thanks Ian. I have to beat My Mantra in my head. Be still!
Jack, You are right I hate failing, because I don't fail. Even if I do fail I don't see it as failure because I try beyond my best. Constantly raising the bar.
I know you are telling me what worked for you to reach your spouse. I could most likely give the same good advice to others, but fail to implement.
I guess the confusing part is this: When she says she felt like I never loved her. I have to tell her why it isn't so.
Then there are outside influence's and saboteurs. Her sister filled her head up with BS for years. Her friend feeds her head with BS. Now her mother is going around running her mouth. When it is her mother that most likely caused her problems.
You know what really bothers me. Her Aunt and Uncle reached out to me, just to ask how I'm doing. Do you think her mom and dad would do that? Her sister? Her sister tells me to go to therapy, because she goes and it helps her. Said she will not talk to me until I go see a therapist. She acted like a marriage and relationship expert to her sister and she was the one that was dysfunctional. Dad and I were so close. Even when I see him for a little while he acts like nothing is wrong, and goes and eats his piece of pie. That is how he handles everything. Have some pie... have some pie.... I don't want any damn pie.
You know the weird part is I didn't feel down this morning. I feel sick. Sick that this family is so screwed up.
I don't know whether I want to smack you or hug and cry with you at this point. Ok...so I'd rather hug you as I understand your frustrations.
It's so very hard wanting to "fix" all the wrongs that has happened. You can't go back and fix them, you can only go forward and fix yourself.
Outside saboteurs? Ah, yes the loving family members. I don't think I need to remind you blood is thicker than water right?
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I could most likely give the same good advice to others, but fail to implement.
As is with most of us. Even those who have been here a long time. It took me a long time Phil to start implementing or practice what I preach. This is why I feel confident when I tell you DB'ing works. But you have to start.
If you feel like your on a information overload do as Jack suggests and start out small.
When you see the actions your actions have on her, then you will be able to go further.
Babysteps do not always apply to our wayward spouses Phil, they apply to us as well.
Do you want to borrow my stick? I've finally learned to be still and don't need to bash myself so often
Jeanette
Change the Policy. Allow PM's Free all of us.
Also some new and improved emoticons would be nice!
