Wife is considering filing - Need Help

[sandi2]

Hi LS, hope you don't mind my long posts. I try to go back over what you have said and respond to different things. I hope I don't lock up your thread, but if I do....just start another one where you left off this one.

I told w that I do not want a D but will support whatever decision she makes. Was that wrong?

No, I don't think so. The way I understand the LRT is that you do tell your S that you are not in favor of a D, but you won't stop them if that is what they want. I wouldn't offer to help move her out or anything, but you get my meaning.

I think your goals are super great!

180s I need to do but feel I can't due to sitch:
Small acts of caring/loving.
Spending time in activity with W (shooting pool, going out for coffee etc...)
Spending time just talking with W about non-R/M topics

Well, the 180's are how much you have changed and worked toward your goals. I think that is quite an accomplishment! Small acts of caring/loving is pretty hard to do wben one is bordering D. I think under the circumstances the way you help with the kids and all you do around the house....I don't know how much more acts of service you could do and hold down a job too! According to the post you went on later to tell, you have had an opportunity to spend some family time and seems everyone enjoyed it.....so, that can count as time with wife....maybe not alone, but perhaps "alone" time is a bit much for right now. You really are doing wonderful and I think she is coming around more than you may be able to see. You know the old saying about being too close to the forest to see the trees.

Your GAL is good. Well rounded.

Major R issues:

Did you notice that all the "major issues" had to do with your wife's issues? Maybe that is how you meant it....but what I'm saying is that they are her issues. Only you can allow them to become yours also. I know the intimacy part certainly affects you as well and I don't mean to sound "flip" about that, but you are doing all that you dare do right now. You can't push her or she will pull back, so that is something that will have to be put on the back burner for now. Hopefully, if she decides not to leave, that can be worked out....but first things first.

Backslides:
I somewhat pressured her into agreeing to see C one more time, for my benefit, not hers. Agreed with W to have conversation regarding M/R

Don't worry too much about that. It is done now and besides, if she was that hard against it, you probably could not have talked her into it that easily. The reason I'm thinking this is b/c you said that you agreed to have conversation regarding the M/R with your wife. So, she must be the one wanting to talk. Don't consider it a backslide by agreeing this time, but just be careful what you agree to during the conversation. Don't talk a lot.....let her do the talking and you listen to her and look at her in her eyes as she talks. While she talks, validate what she is saying by nodding your head or saying you understand. If you don't agree with what she is saying or her POV, then just say that you are sorry she feels that way.....but don't let her trap you into an argument.

W said she tried calling me at the office and I said I probably wasn't at my desk (she left no message). She asked me about my day etc... and I only gave short answers and did not ask about her day. I told her that I had plans that night and would be leaving after I played with the kids and got them ready for bed.

Oh, this was excellent! She is moving forward you as you pull back. Just don't appear to be "cold". As you said, keep answers short, but sweet and keep a pleasant expression on your face and in your tone of voice. Don't show interest in what she does. (lol) I love it!

She asked about plans this weekend

.....and you already had made plans! Great job! She is getting curious about what you are doing....she is interested b/c she is asking questions and she is somewhat surprised that you are moving ahead.

Asked if I had plans tonight. I said not as of this morning. Asked me if I was going to have a busy day and I said it should be rather productive.

See how she keeps asking about your plans?

I like the questions. I do not like my answers. I feel that I should use my answers to show small acts of caring and loving but afraid I will put pressure on her. Sandi, SC, anybody...should I loosen up with my answers or keep things short and sweet for the time being and wait to loosen up.

Listen, I'm not sure what you mean by not liking the answers, but don't change how you are doing things. You are correct that you will put pressure on her. Forget about doing the loving and caring acts.....that comes later after some of the healing....but not at this point...okay? She will misread the small acts of loving kindness....trust me. It will backfire on you. A hint at this is how she is almost resenting you for what you are doing to help out with the kids every morning. Much more and she will really start to get pissed off. So, don't push too much harder even at helping in the mornings. You started out by trying to give her space....but now, she may see she doesn't want to be "replaced" quite so easily.

Balance in the house is beginning to come into play. I see it. Does W? We can work together to get things done while she has the independence she needs. I can step up to the plate when she needs me too. Does she see it? I am capable of running things smoothly without her. Does she see it? Does she care?

It is hard to tell with WAW's, but I think she will see it in time as long as she doesn't misread what you are trying to do. If she suspects that you think you can do a better job than her and that she wasn't so hot at it before....that would not be good! A suggestion would be that you might throw in how you don't know how she has managed a house and the kids all these years so well and that you are trying to help more, but that you could not even attempt to try to be as good as her b/c you know you couldn't. Might break that down into smaller bits at a time so it doesn't sound like you are kissing a$$ so much...(lol). But, yes, I think she will see that it works better for her and she's not so worn out with all the help you are doing. If she can keep her head out of the "fog" and if her friend doesn't start imposing some bad influence upon her thinking. As far as if she will see that you can do as well without her.....that is anyone's guess. I'm not sure what the correct way would be about that. Being a mother, though, I don't know that I would really want to believe that my H could make it that easily without me. I know she needs to realize that you can move ahead with your life, but don't appear that you can do a better job at replacing her motherhood (lol) if that is a good way of describing it.

Is the answer gentle pleasantness? Are my responses gentle pleasantness or cold?

I can tell that you are very concerned about this. It is hard to tell by reading how the voice sounds. The answers "look" fine and I think as long as you don't cut the words to sound short and snappy....that is the secret. Say your sentences with soft tones and kind of slowly so it doesn't sound too curt. The only thing I would change in your anwers would be:

W: Why are you getting the kids cereal ready?
Me: Because I wanted to.

You could have said, "I'm trying to step up to help more than I've done in the past. Besides, I'm learning that I rather like doing it." But, what you said was not bad.

Given lack of communication before sitch, how can I show her that I can be more communicative, outside of being a good listener when she wants to discuss sitch/feelings?

Well, I thought you said that sometimes you talk too much, so I would not worry a lot about it at this point. B/c frankly, most WAW's want to be "heard" and "validated". If she wants to hear your opinion, she will probably ask for it or just come out and tell you that she wishes you would talk more about the particular subject. If you are in a R talk and she gives you opportunity to talk.....then you may want to take the hint....just be careful and not get into a fight. I still hold to the fact that what you are doing for right now....is working! Like you said, she seems to be drawing closer and you don't want to screw that up....so try not to worry about these other things. With you seeking God's help, I believe He will help you know when the timing is right for certain "moves" or "talks" or whatever. Remember our slogan....baby steps. Very slowly. To the point of nearly going nuts...lol. But, it is working and I am very excited about that. I hope it will give you the encouragement and determination and "energy" to keep on keeping on.

I am very proud of you. I know what you are going through has been so hard. The goals you set for yourself has over-whelmed me! I probably would never have gotten through one week especially not drinking and smoking (lol) and I don't do either one. Don't set unobtainable goals for yourself. It is better to set smaller yet realistic goals and reach them, rather than set goals that are much too high and feel as though you have failed. You haven't failed.....maybe some of your plans fall through sometimes, but you haven't failed. I tell you this b/c I don't want you to keep beating yourself up until the depression starts in and gets the best of you. It is bad company. I have dealt with it for years and it is tough. So, do the best you can and don't sweat the small stuff. When in doubt, come here and ask. Some of us will do our best to answer. Anything about the DB book you don't understand....please ask us.

How can I demonstrate when it seems that LRT is the technique I need to be employing?

Maybe I don't understand what you are asking, but I think that you are demonstrating it the best you can while living under the same roof.

Okay......really loooooong post. Good visiting with you. Take care.

Sandi

[LosingSunshine]

Thx Sandi. Did you are my other thread today? W sent an email to me today wanting to list the house. My response this evening was not what she wanted to hear. I am on my blackberry right now and can't pose the link but the thread is yikes!!!!help!!!! Or something like that. Another fun day. I'll write more later as I Gotta get 4d t bed.
Take care!

[LosingSunshine]

Well W must be pissed about the house thing. She was supposed to be home 2 hours ago so that I could run out. Oh well. The silly games that are played. I am beginning to wonder if she'll be drunk when she gets home. Do I want to stay up for that? I guess I don't. I'll just retire to my room shortly and read some threads...maybe post some more thougts.

I can't thank those of you that have posted on my thread enough. Thank you so much!!! Your kind words and encouragement have made the last two weeks bearable. I keep all of you in my nightly prayers.

[LosingSunshine]

Going to add the other thread Yikes!!!Help!!! to my signature and stop posting on that one.

Last night was interesting and I had to come home and act as if. Of course, it was the first question and when we eventually discussed the topic of selling the house, I told her I didn't want to, I don't want this, and if she does she'll have to take care of it. She asked some clarifying questions (yes, you have to call the realtor etc...) and seemed disappointed in my response to the house sitch. I don't think she really understands that I don't want my M over with. Is she selectively hearing what I am saying? So we got the kids fed, I played with them outback and got them down to bed. She left after dinner and was supposed to be home in two hours...that turned into four. No big deal for me. I would have gone out if she came home but was content just reading threads here at DB. She didn't say anything or pop in when she got home.

This morning she apologized for coming home later than expected and I said no problem. She proceeded to make the kids pancakes after I had already got them dressed and made them some cereal. I guess she feels she needs to step up to the motherly plate as she has been too busy with her personal life and is trying to overcompensate by cooking pancakes? Not sure. I already told her I am not trying to invade her territory, take over her role...and that I am just helping out etc...Strange. She also brought up how two of her girlfriends will be coming over tonight to watch a movie after the kids go down. I said okay because I'll be out with GAL activities tonight. She also said that she'll begin pulling things together for storage. I took the opportunity at that point to reiterate that I don't want to sell the house, I don't want the M to end. If she does, she'll have to do it herself. Not as shocked as last night but wanted to make sure that she understood as she couldn't run away this am to not think about it. Probably not a good idea but what was I to say when she brought it up?

She also asked about my weekend plans and I told her that the kids and I will be going to the pool, having a picnic dinner and doing fireworks on Friday. She said nothing.

I am feeling better and with each day, becoming more at ease with the sitch provided that she doesn't through any stink bombs, like yesterday. I pray the rosary every night asking for strength, courage, wisdom and patience for me and all of you. I pray for my kids and W as well.

I told my mom last night about sitch too. She was surprised and very understanding and had good comforting words for me and will keep me in her prayers as well. She said what we all know and talked about some of the times her and dad had issues and how they were able to work through them. I did not let her know the true gravity of the situation but she knows it's bad and that the D word has been tossed out there.

Still working hard at keeping my PMA, GAL and 180s intact. My life seems very well structured right now and I am getting used to the routine and enjoying it. Going to try to 180 on the smoking starting next week. I need to stop for me and my kids and as long as I can make it one day on the patch without smoking, I'll be fine. I've done it before and I can do it again. Focus on me. Focus on kids.

Sandi, I did have a question for you regarding your post on my Yikes!!! thread. You said that you smell a rat. Can you elaborate? I think that she is getting very biased information and if she would trust others outside of a few people, she might be enlightened to slow down. Of course, I can't do or say anything with regard to this without aggravating the sitch. One of her new friends actually stopped by my office yesterday but I wasn't there (we work at same company) and left a message asking how I was doing and that I should email or call sometime. Should I? The last time we talked I said somethings I probably shouldn't and I don't want to come across to her that I am pursuing my W.

Well not much to really post about today. Looking forward to the 4th. Looking forward to golf in a few hours with my old boss. Looking forward to dinner and playtime with the kids. Looking forward to getting out a little tonight to free my mind of this craziness.

[LosingSunshine]

Home Sale Crisis Thread

Home Sale Crisis

[sandi2]

Hi LS, I did reply on your other thread, so maybe you saw it before closing it out.

Is she selectively hearing what I am saying?

I think that is possible. That is one reason you can't allow yourself to believe anything she says is b/c she will twist around your words and throw back at you. She may even rewrite yours and her history together.

I guess she feels she needs to step up to the motherly plate as she has been too busy with her personal life and is trying to overcompensate by cooking pancakes? Not sure. I already told her I am not trying to invade her territory, take over her role...and that I am just helping out etc...Strange.

Actually, I think she sees you as competition..lol. It was rather rude of her to do it in that fashion since you already had the cereal ready.

She also said that she'll begin pulling things together for storage.

I think I would have had to tell her that unless it is her personal belongings, that she is not to touch anything in the house that is considered "shared" property. She has no legal rights, I wouldn't think, to take whatever she wanted to take out of the house and place in storage without your consent....not when there is talk of D, but I'm no lawyer. You might check into that. I'm sure she can come up with an idea or two for doing it....like getting the house empty and ready to sell. I liked the idea that was given by another poster about telling her that you would buy her part out and keep the huose for you and the kids. That might cool her heels a bit.....especially if she is feeling like you are being the "better parent" at the moment. I would be careful about leaving her there alone with "girlfriends" that say they are going to watch a movie and pulling some things together for storage. Take my word for it....they won't be watching any movie! In fact, if you leave, you may come back to an empty house. I think I would stay put until the friends left. I don't like the sounds of this. She would not leave them in there to watch a movie by themselves while she pulled some things together for storage and I doubt she would wait until they left b/c of the late hourse, so you can rest assured that the girls are going to have a hayday as soon as you leave.

She also asked about my weekend plans

This makes twice she has asked about your plans for the weekend, I think. It could be because it is a holiday, but then it could be that she has something up her sleeve.....and it isn't good. I would be watching if I were you.

I'm glad you talked to your mom about the stitch. She did not need to hear it from somebody else first. You know, I think couples use to handle their problems b/c they saw their M as being for life. Sometimes if it was bad engough they might separate for a while and then work things out and go back together. But, people didn't stay in the house having sex one night and then the next day file for D like I hear about couples doing these days! I don't get it. Why the hurry? I suppose it is our hurry up attitude of our society and that they can't wait for a separation and just head straight for D court.

Going to try to 180 on the smoking starting next week

That's a wonderful goal, and yes you do need to do it for all of you, but remember what I said about putting too much at one time on you and getting too stressed out about it. If W is starting to put pressure about selling the house, it may get very tough. But, like I was told today at work, we are put under prerssure only if we allow it to happen. Sounds good, but tough to pull it off.

Regarding to my statement about "smelling a rat", I was referring to her "new friends". I really feel that she is getting the wrong encouragement and influence. She seemed to be doing pretty good there for a few days and then suddenly she comes up with all this business about pushing for the house to sell and getting a D. I know from what you described that she was getting closer to you and having fun with you and the kids in spite of herself! It seems common for WAW's and W's in MLC to find new friends that are single, divorced or live a different lifestyle from the old friends. So, directly or indirectly, something or somebody is influncing her! She is hanging out with them too much for them not to be. One thing about a WAW or W in MLC, they are going to be around only the people that support their feelings! Remeber that.

One of her new friends actually stopped by my office yesterday but I wasn't there (we work at same company) and left a message asking how I was doing and that I should email or call sometime. Should I? The last time we talked I said somethings I probably shouldn't and I don't want to come across to her that I am pursuing my W.

Nooooooo.........run like a bat out of hell! Several reasons I can give for this. This friend of your W's is either out to get information from you to take back to your W, since you talked before.....or else, she is setting you up for something in particular......or she is trying to hit on you. Either way, it spells disaster. Stay away from that woman!

This is a terrible thing to say about my own gender, but it is just like I told my H about women......they really are not made of sugar and spice and everything nice! Some are cats! Some of conniving, cunning, and decietful. There are some things that they will not stoop to low to do to get what they want. They will stab their best friend in the back and even sleep with her H. Now, notice I said...some are like that....not all. There are some real sweet women out there that are good down to their toes. They are the "real McCoy" as people use to say. So, I don't want you to give completely up on the female sex, but at the same time......don't be fooled about her new friends, either.

You are still doing very, very good. Don't back down from your gut instincts and don't let her cross your boundries. When women start getting "horsy" or pushy.....they need to be put in their place. They will repect you in the long run.

Take care,
Sandi

[LosingSunshine]

Sandi, I wish I read this post before I left the house!!! I just may have to stop by in a while to see what is going on. I believe she was planning on doing some things before they came over but you never know. She also told me during Dinner tonight that she wanted to spend some time with the kids before her friends came over. Hmmmm. Fishy.

[LosingSunshine]

Sandi, another question. If these new friend are influencing her negatively, at what point do I draw the line? At what point do I call her mom?

I also believe that she is realizing that because of her spending so much time with new friends that she has been neglecting the kids hence the time with them tonight and the questions about the weekend. I have too much trust and love.
The good thing is I already have a L in the wings should anything happen and could easily get access to funds that are not ours to give her one hell of a fight if that is what she is wanting. Bad LS is coming out of the closet now. LOL!

[LosingSunshine]

Well, I feel liked I kicked the hornets nest tonight. I went home and asked my wife what she wa getting ready for storage and said that she should make sure none of it's shard property. I also said that I was looking into buying her out to keep the house for me and the kids. At that point she new I had talked to my folks. She started to get angry infront of 4d and I stayed calm. She brought up custody and started slinging mid all the while her friend was downstairs getting ready to watch the movie. At one point 4d started to cry and friend said she would get her and I said know. It felt good to stand up and say what I did. W asid she has tried to talk to me but I have been ignoring her. I said you are the one that wants to end the M and destroy the family not me. She was angry and I was calm.
Did I just do a major backslide?

[LosingSunshine]

Okay. Some thoughts that I will try to pull together tomorrow am.

My W is a typical WAW. She is numb to the M. I am her friend only. There is no love.
Admits it was both of us that got us here.
She is not resentful just wants to break fee and be herself. She wants the focus to be about her and not me.
Her friends don't understand why she is so numb. So I guess it is her sense of immediacy that is driving this forward.
Doesn't want me to be angry nor ignore her...LRT impact?
Knows that I am capable of all changes but does not want to be open to see what if.
Wants the D to be as easy and non confrontational as possible.
Just wants to break free.
So I guess it is more LRT!

After I came home I asked W to talk to diffuse the earlier conversation and these were the main themes that she brought up. Nothing has really changed but the LRT is producing some small results. She did agree to go to a joint MC session with me.
The question to the WAWs out there, what can I or C do to show her the way...the way to see that small dim light deep in her heart and to explore it?

It's late. I am going to read some threads and call it a night.