another date set today!

[jandn]

Yes I saw that you posted and I was like "yes, this is going to be great from sandi" But then I start reading and get shot down. But that is ok I am going to explain to you what you asked.

Yes there have been parts where I have said I just waiting for that time where I am able to hold, hug and kiss W and tell her how much I love and miss her.

We actually kinda detached about the same time once W said she was taking D off hold early May. I went dark, then a couple weeks later W seemed to go dark also until this past weekend, that is the sex I was talking about how W asked "once last time?" That was on Sunday, then comes over lastnight and she brought that event up about if I regretted it and so forth. We did have sex back in april a couple times, once after a hard night drinking for her, then she appeared in my bed another night.

The going out to dinner is her doings. Seems like anytime I would ever try to set something up, my plans arent ever good enough. Its like W has all the control, so I just go with it to a certain extent. I know you arent suppose to accept all offers, just some, but there really hasnt been many lately.

I was trying to do both, journal and seek advice. I know I never set any goals, I am not good at that. I know you know the ultimate goal, but that doesnt count, its the little ones leading up to that.

DivorceCare is a 13 week support group and that is the book they use. W started getting emotional and talking about the emotions she has been going though lately, and I thought it was just me. I showed her that part in there, and she commenced to go through the whole book which is only about half done. I was under the impression W already went through what I was going through and was healed, ready to move on.

This is where I get confused. Going to the C, she suggests some things I try and sometimes they go against DB. A couple of months ago, C said start going to this support group and leave that book laying around and maybe W will look at it. W hasnt lived her since mid Jan but was coming over in the morning for the kids a couple times a week. The people at the support group said yea, she can come here now or when you are done. So, I tried to comfort W in her time of need that she ought to go to one of these groups to be around people that are having the same feelings she is. I didnt push it or not, one thing lead to another in showing her that workbook.

On another token about the C, she suggested yesterday that since nothing else has been working, maybe W wants me maybe to beg for her this and that. The C has meet my wife a few times and has got a pretty good feel for her personality. C "primarily utlizes cognitive-behavioral, solution-focused, supportive and play therapy." and is at a christian based facility.

About DB, yes in my first posts from back in Feb, I screwed up. I dont think I had been on here and came across DB and bought a copy for her and checked one out for myself from the library before W even filed. W even told her dad about me buying the book and how I never use to read and that I had good intentions about the book and working on our marriage. I saw the title and thought "this is us, will be good for us to read". Little did I know I that both parties werent suppose to read it so I messed up before I had a chance to find this and do research on the book.

Thank you for taking the time to try and help me. Its like no matter what move I make or dont make, its the wrong thing and has always been that way with my W. C even pointed that out one time that W probably has this list in the back of her head, and I do 100 good things, but 1 bad thing or something that reminds W of the old me, poof its gone and everything you have done is forgotten.

W did text mid morning and said "thank you for the gifts!" but through text you dont know how to perceive that. But I havent responded since then, and know tomorrow W will text me or call me telling me that her mom has the kids and I can pick them up after work from her.

[sandi2]

Sorry you felt shot down. I wasn't trying to see how cruel I could be....I think you have had enough of that from your wife, already. I understand a little more now than when I sent the post, but I don't back down from what I've said. I do think you are getting crossed messages or advice by going to this counselor. I know I saw another poster that uses that style of program and it seems to work okay for her, but her stitch is different than yours.

Anyway, I am sure you are at the point of not knowing what in the world to do now b/c of all the different things you are hearing. But, I don't think what is going on now is working at all. Surely you can see that the more you pursue her and catter to her, the more she is backing away and walking all over you.

There is a time to be nice and polite as the DR books explains, but you are kissing a$$ big time. You two don't even act like a couple that is separated. That is not going to get the job done. The only advice I can give you is what I told you in the first post and stop seeing the C yourself and begin strickly following the DR way. I think you need to serious detach, which I have not seen where you have done that since she (so called) left you and then start working on that list I gave you. Seriously detaching is not the same as going dark....and I really don't think you understand how it works, but anyway.....

Have you ever read Dr. James Dobson's book Tough Love? That is along the same lines that Michelle goes. We want what we think we can't have...and your W knows she can have you any time she crooks her little finger. Yes, it is hard....it's not called tough love for nothing, but it works.

This is where I get confused. Going to the C, she suggests some things I try and sometimes they go against DB. A couple of months ago, C said start going to this support group and leave that book laying around and maybe W will look at it.

The 13 week program may be okay, but I don't know so much about the counselor. That was not good advice at all....it was showing your "game plan" and that is not something you do. Now, everytime you try to implement on of the DB principles, she may throw it up in your face....but hopefully, she will forget what saw.

This is where I get confused. Going to the C, she suggests some things I try and sometimes they go against DB.

That is why I feel that this C is not doing you any good. It is only causing confusion.

I'm sorry you were disappointed in my advice to you. I often shoot from the hip! But, it only means tht I care, and it upsets me seeing a H/W doing all the wrong things that need to be applied in DB. Too much soft peddled stuff is handed out and it doesn't do squat for the person that is needing some hard fact information. I thought that was what you needed. You need to be a strong man, especially with the wife you have. Let me tell you something about women, sweety, we will walk all over any man that we don't respect or that will show any weakness. But there is a way to show strength. Also, there is a time to be like steel and a time to be like velvet. You just need to know when to be like steel and when to be like velvet for the woman you love. That's the tricky part, and when you find that out, you will know how to make that wife of yours fall in love with you all over again.

All I know for you to do, is to decide which way you want to travel. If you decide that these people on this board knows what they are talking about and that Michelle's experience & knowledge outweighs the C, then I would do some big time detaching and start over. I have personally had a few dealings with so-called counsleors and they all were very incompetent. It doesn't take much schooling to become a counselor, I discovered, and schooling doesn't always give a person "wisdom".

So, God bless you on what ever discision you make. If you decide to stick with DB and you want to post back to me.....I will do what ever I can to help you step by step, but if not, that is fine too. In the end, it is your life and you have to be the one to make those decisions. Like you said about texting, it is hard to know what tone of voice I am using here, but believe me, it is one of compassion.....not condesending. I pray for the best for you and your family.

Sandi

[jandn]

"You need to be a strong man, especially with the wife you have. Let me tell you something about women, sweety, we will walk all over any man that we don't respect or that will show any weakness. But there is a way to show strength. Also, there is a time to be like steel and a time to be like velvet. You just need to know when to be like steel and when to be like velvet for the woman you love. That's the tricky part, and when you find that out, you will know how to make that wife of yours fall in love with you all over again."

I know about this but yet I just dont believe it if you know what I mean. This is a problem for me sorting this out and knowing how to react to W. Its like a catch 22 IMO. You dont be nice, then the fighting gets tougher in the D. You be nice, you still get screwed in the D.

Thank you sandi for your advice and that should be the next book I start reading. Had some backsliding today but I will overcome them.

[sandi2]

I understand. My H had no sisters and grew up thinking girls were really made of sugar and spice, so he was in for a rude awakening. Even after we had been married for a few years and I would try to tell him about females that was not what he thought they were and he was blind to their ways, he just couldn't believe it and didn't want to believe it. He really was too sweet and too good (if you know what I mean), but I think he at last begin to see the light later on. He tells people that I taught him how bad women could be......but I don't think they know how he means that (lol). Trying to use a little humor there, but guess it isn't very funny. I know you are hurting, sweetie, and trying to find the right path. I hope you will choose the DB way b/c I truly think it is the best....if you understand it.

Sandi

[ernest88]

And did we ever find out about ping?

Ping is OK. He was in the hospital for a few days but is out now and doing good. His Divorce is moving forward,

[jandn]

Dang storm crashed my computer, cable is out along with internet. Guess this is a sign to go to a book, prob the bible. Or tough love if i had it.

[jandn]

Is that book "Love Must be Tough"?

Well today S had soccer camp thingy. W texts an hour before says she will meet me there for his shoes and shin guards (although he doenst need them, W thinks its a game or something S has). W shows up 10 mins late, chipper as can be ("one day I get it all together" jokingly she says cause is always late).

W did most of the talking, thought I was in a funk but just smiled and said no. Thinks I am mad cause she didnt respond to my texts yesterday, just a couple after she told me where the kids would be (ready for 2x4's, this was the backslides I had) about if she still wanted to get together this weekend then a couple hours late said ok just suprise me, if you need to ever talk about your emotions dont be afraid to call.

Funny thing is W mentions something about me not responding to her this morning? Anyways she starts all the small talk. Asking me what time is church tomorrow cause in that email about the kids I told her what time church was cause I was going off the other day when she said she wanted to get together this weekend. Also put I would like u to go 2 church with me. (more 2x4's I know, sorry sandi I dont know wtf I was doing). Hints that she might go.

Also asked about the C we had seen and about the C wanting to talk to her. I was like man, sandi says to rid the C. W said I will go. W says so C is going to treat me more like family than a client. Said yes. So I dont know what to do. Prob cut all ties with W huh?

So we are walking out and W says what time you want to meet with kids tomorrow. Then says, well I might see you in the morning, I have to see. It wont hurt me if she doesnt go, cause Im sure she probably is going out tonight and wont feel like church tomorrow. I just dont know about how to take W.

Im ready for the whippings, but confused at the same time still on the right direction to take with W.

[sandi2]

No, I don't like to kick a man when he is already down. You are so confused that you don't know which way to turn.

Yes, the book by James Dobson is "Love Must be Tough" and it is worth the read.

I may be misunderstanding what is going on here but it seems wife is calling all the shots:

W said I will go. W says so C is going to treat me more like family than a client.

She tells you that you will go? What did she mean that C is going to treat you more like family than a client?

I still think the C doesn't know what he is doing where you are concerned. He is giving you all the wrong advice and even said as much that he was guessing that your wife wanted you to chase her. That is the opposite of what you need to be doing. It would be hard to detach from her b/c she is constantly using the son to text you about something regarding him or some other excuse. She talks to you too much and finds excuses to see you. That is part of the rollercoaster ride she is on and you never know what to expect out of her.

Have you read the article here on the boad from Michelle about the WAW? Also, in the MLC forum I think she has the fist chapter on her book about MLC and it is good.

I still believe that you need to cut the counselor. If your wife wants to continue without you...fine, but I think you are getting bad advice from him. Some counselors just are not that educated in these matters and a lot of what they say is guess work b/c they don't know. A lot of them even tell couples to divorce b/c they don't know anything else to try.

Take care,
Sandi

[jandn]

W hasnt gone to C (female) for a few months. She only went first couple of times cause it was her Ls idea to show we couldnt work it out then W could file. W had change of heart then went back a few times more. I was going back on a as needed basis, especially after the last time we were suppose to go together after we had already resched, and W went to the bar instead. One thing I should mention that W and I have talked about the fact of I seemed to have been talked into a lot of things including just about everything like this R. Now that we are to this point I dont want tn lose eveything. I love her so much, but never know how to handle her. One last thing is W says things about missing this or that. I dont know if it would be wise to just lirten or respond back telling W that i dont want it to be that way cause maybe that is what she is after? mind games!

[jandn]

Im sorry sandi, I was talking in different person I guess. W mentioned to me that she would go and talk to the C to help me out and W was wondering if she went and talked to the C if the C was going to treat her more like a family member to better help me or if C was going to talk to her as a client instead. Yes I suck at expressing my thoughts.

Where I screwed up yesterday, IMO, is that I wasnt as cheerful as I should have been. And when W was talking, didnt look at her the whole time. W didnt call, text or anything this morning about her going to church so guess that was one of her games. Will see her tonight when I drop kids off, and gotta talk to her about the dang house cause relator has been bugging me about a counter offer. What I would do about the house if I knew things would work, I would let it go for cheap just to make my M work, but Im not wanting to get screwed either so trying to protect myself right now. And on top of that is just a contingency.

Well, I seemed I wanted to write more to help you understand. I have read the WAW article and need to reread and look into the MLC again. Need to check this book out again from the library. Thanks