Quote: Our day was busy 'cuz it was her mom's b-day and her folks were coming over for dinner...so there were preparations. I asked what was wrong and she said she just felt tense. Maybe she was tense about getting all of this junk together.
BINGO!!! Don't MAKE trouble for youself, my man! One of THE most stressful things for me is having company (especially my MOM!) over to the house. I can get into quite a snit over getting everything done and "right"...and it has NOTHING to do with CJ, in fact, like you, he helps out a LOT during such events. It's just a hight stress time and CAN get the worst of me.
And J, although I wish I wasn't right in my "mind reading" endeavour on my last post, at least it shows my memory isn't THAT bad!!! (been catching a lot of flack for memory lapses of late)
Thanks to everyone for stopping by. So, admittedly, quite a bit has been going on in the jetho household, but I've neglected to post about it. Nothing really bad...except perhaps allowing my insecurities and pain of the past get to me.
----- So, a couple weeks ago my W came clean about her anxiety episodes. I guess she frequently feels pangs like she's going to have an attack, but it usually recedes. So, she's determined to read up, journal, and try to conquer this stuff. It is a result of pain from the past, stuffing her feelings for many years, and she just feels like she can't hold it in any longer. Basically, significant growth on her part to recognize this. She also mentioned that how she handles things is likely the reason she's so closed off to me at times...and if she works through this our R will be better. At least she recognizes this and is working towards finding a solution.
However, the other day she made the comment to me, "how can I put 100% into our R when I can't put 50% into me?" My interpretation is that she's saying she has stuff to deal with herself, and until she works through those things, she won't focus 100% on our R. So, more patience from jethro...ugh! -----
I happened to lose my wedding ring just before I found out about her A. It was really a freak accident (or was it?). I gave her a backrub with lotion one night, took my ring off and placed it on the nightstand. My W saw my ring the next day and put it on top of our dresser, as she thought it would be safer there. Well, my W saw my DD (4) playing on the dresser and when I looked my ring was gone. My DD, of course, didn't remember anything.
Well, we were rearranging things in our bedroom yesterday and my DD found my ring! I think my W thought it was "from God." Frankly, I felt odd because I'm not entirely sure I want my old ring. When I mentioned this to my W I think she was disappointed, but said that there were lots of good memories associated with that ring too. So, I guess I need to have a better attitude. I also mentioned to her that I was kind of wanting her to make a gesture of buying me a new ring, as that would show me where she wanted to be. Her response was that she had been thinking about that...
But, I think my reaction was not what she was hoping for, so I hope I didn't burst her bubble too much. Frankly, I'm kind of disappointed in myself for my reaction... -----
My W has mentioned how she wants to go to bar where she met OM...and where OM frequents (very often I might add). Her reasoning is that she kind of wants to make a quick appearance, show everyone that she's got it together (as she thinks there were rumors) and then leave. Kind of a pride thing. She wants me to come, but I'm afraid of seeing OM because I don't know how I'll react. I tell her that I don't feel comfortable with this yet, and that I feel somewhat unpredictable in my reaction to OM if he happens to be there (which would be very likely). So, I don't really know what to do... She's not pushing it, but has mentioned it a few times now. What do you guys think? -----
BTW, a couple weeks ago, my W and I went to sing Karaoke and she sang Lyin' Eyes. YUCK! You guys ever really listen to those lyrics? She kept giving me pointed looks while singing the song.
Oh, man, don't get me started on song lyrics and karaoke!!
The night he asked me for a D, CJ sang "Scar tissue" ("Scar tissue that I wish you saw.... Scarcastic Mr. know it all".....Gulp...I think that was me )....
Then he sang, among others, "When it's over...that's the time I fall in love, again"....two days after bomb#2 when he was about to leave for OW!
And don't even ask me about all the tunes I had HIM download which had lyrics that were LOADED...(if you're gonna have me, this is how it's got to be, first of all I won't take you cheating on me, tell me who can I trust, if I can't trust in you...why are you running away? too scared to admit you're afraid...etc etc)...
Jethro...if your W is in La La land to any degree similar to my H...she may have the same excuse...
HE said he never really paid attention to what the lyrics MEANT, just likes certain tunes. What????
I mean, J, that is LAME, considering the last e-mail he sent me WAS lyrics!
But I think for their own protection they dissociate some, you know how we're extra sensitive to such meanings? I think they compensate by being LESS sensitive!
Now, overall I LIKE what I saw in your post. W getting real with her anxiety and past....Excellent! I have a very good recommendation for a guide for her.
"The anxiety and phobia workbook" by Edmund Bourne. It saved my life, I'm sure. It has a whole section on panic reactions, and tons of great info on anxiety, family charts, stress inventories, self-talk exercises, relaxation training, even dietary suggestions (which I don't follow ). Top notch.
About the "show up" at the bar where OM hangs? What's up with that??? What does she hope to accomplish? what are the rumors? that she's dead? gained 100 pounds? That you've kicked her to the curb?
I guess I just don't get it. It sounds kind of juvenile to me.
Now having said that...ewww if I had the opportunity to rub it in OW's face that CJ and I are intact and thriving despite her interference.....
And about the wedding ring...so you had mixed feelings. You were honest about them, she handled her disappointment, AND you found out she'd been thinking of a new ring.
Quote: Jethro...if your W is in La La land to any degree similar to my H...she may have the same excuse...
It's not that she doesn't realize the lyrics...she REALLY realized the lyrics and that's why she was giving me pointed looks. Someone asked her to sing that song anyway, so it wasn't her idea. In fact, she went as far to say that there we a lot of interesting things in that song that are true about people having As...and she's right... It just bugged to hear the lyrics...
Quote: "The anxiety and phobia workbook" by Edmund Bourne.
She did buy a book to help her out. It's huge. I wonder if it's the same one???
Quote: About the "show up" at the bar where OM hangs? What's up with that??? What does she hope to accomplish? what are the rumors? that she's dead? gained 100 pounds? That you've kicked her to the curb?
I guess I just don't get it. It sounds kind of juvenile to me.
Now having said that...ewww if I had the opportunity to rub it in OW's face that CJ and I are intact and thriving despite her interference.....
Well, I can't REALLY explain why she wants to go. I think it's a combination of things, albeit odd. I think it's to show people that I haven't "kicked her to the curb," and I think it's also to rub OM's face in our reconciliation. About a month ago, she admitted that she had a tiny, little, weincy (sp?) part of her that wanted me to pummel OM. So, maybe there's a sense of wanting to watch him squirm? I don't know, SB. I think maybe I'll ask her about it tonight, 'cuz it does seem juvenile. The best answer I can get out of her is that she wants to prove to people that she's on the "right track" after her poor behavior. Of course, this is based on her thinking rumors are going around about her and OM. Ahhh...heck...I don't know...
BTW, the e-mail exchanges you're having with your H are fantastic. I was so very happy to share your news!
Well about the lyrics, I AM relieved. I would hope your W is past THAT stage of denial (CJ was still "with" OW when he claimed ignorance of those lyrics).
And since she didn't pick it out, I'll bet it was her way of communicating to you that she's GETTING some of this now, seeing it from your side? Wait a minute though...I know that song and it kind of makes it seem like she sold out for money in her M and SHOULD be stepping out???
About the bar thing, I guess it makes more sense now. I'd be flattered if I were you. She wants to make a show of unity for the two of you...is that right? Or is it more about saving face for HER?
Go with YOUR gut on this one, don't do anything if you'll be uncomfortable or might punch this guy out.(ask SAD about THAT...where are those two??? ).
On the other hand, Talista has the best "showing the OP what's what" story of all time!! I'm sure you recall the Tourette's sting?
Quoting jethro: My W has mentioned how she wants to go to bar where she met OM...and where OM frequents (very often I might add). Her reasoning is that she kind of wants to make a quick appearance, show everyone that she's got it together (as she thinks there were rumors) and then leave. Kind of a pride thing. She wants me to come, but I'm afraid of seeing OM because I don't know how I'll react. I tell her that I don't feel comfortable with this yet, and that I feel somewhat unpredictable in my reaction to OM if he happens to be there (which would be very likely). So, I don't really know what to do... She's not pushing it, but has mentioned it a few times now. What do you guys think? -----
hmmm...my first (and last) reading of this is pretty positive...I can understand the pride thing...maybe to prove to herself and others that she has recovered the positive/good thing in her life? Seems to me that the WAS ALSO loses something in the process -- maybe as simple as a sense of pride in themselves, maybe something deeper like an entire self-image. Either way, I can see her wanting to show people "see? I brought it back from the brink...with this handsome dude by my side".
Dunno...I'm having a hard time NOT projecting here...I think I'd jump for joy if my h. wanted to show off how far we'd come to ow, etc. Guess that shows....
sage
Relax. Appreciate. Be calm. Laugh. Enjoy. Be secure. Be loving. Be loved. Don't personalize. Don't ASSume. Accept. Be grateful.
Hiya jethro,
I hear ya on the lingering doubts and the struggle to put all this behind you, but I came away with yesterday's post with an overall sense that you and your W are working thru this and are making a good bit of progress ... like you have reached some mid-way point. I even think that you have surpassed where I'm at and putting some distance between us. Way to go Big-J!!
Quoting jethro: However, the other day she made the comment to me, "how can I put 100% into our R when I can't put 50% into me?" My interpretation is that she's saying she has stuff to deal with herself, and until she works through those things, she won't focus 100% on our R. So, more patience from jethro...ugh!
Basic principal of DBing, work on yourself before directing the priority of your focus on R. Same is true for her, Big-J! Many here will be envious (myself included) that your W is making a conscientious effort to work on self improvements with an eye on the benifit of strengthening the bonds of the R as well.
Rings!! Boy did I make a BIG stink about rings last year before I knew about DBing, when I woke up one morning shortly after my W made the point to stop wearing hers, to discover my ring was no longer on my finger! I tore the bedroom apart and came short of implying she took it to make a point M was over, but she sensed it. I'm still feeling the repercussions of that!
Quoting jethro: My W has mentioned how she wants to go to bar where she met OM...
Well whatever her reasons are ... they are her reasons. The question becomes how much are you willing to support the fact she feels she needs to do this for herself? If you decide to go, I would consider going "act-if" she is taking you to show you off as being her man ... the man that stood by her side! ... go with the kind of confidence that one has in themselves for knowing ... its living to your code of integrity that has made your woman want to bring you back into that domain.
Well, everyone seems to think that the bar thing is positive. I guess for me I don't feel real comfortable, as I am torn. On the one hand, I'd like to totally ignore OM (other than dirty looks) if he's there, but I also feel compelled to go "talk" to him and ask him WTF. As my W put it, "he got off easy." Well, in retrospect, maybe he didn't, 'cuz I know he was scared I was going to hunt him down. My W confirmed this on many occasions.
I want to take the "higher road," but I also want to let him know what a piece of s--t he is!
Quoting KAW:I even think that you have surpassed where I'm at and putting some distance between us.
Don't know about that, KAW. You seem far better than me at letting things go, my friend.
Quoting KAW:Many here will be envious (myself included) that your W is making a conscientious effort to work on self improvements with an eye on the benifit of strengthening the bonds of the R as well.
I know. I feel pretty fortunate in this regard...that my W has admitted to her own issues and is doing something about them... She has also been sharing more of her fears with me lately, which is also nice.
I still can't shake the feeling that I don't really know her...that everything has been an illusion for so long. Having a healthy, loving R seems distant to me...but I don't know whether I've built up some kind of perverse fantasy in my mind of what a "true" R is, or whether my expectations are realistic...
Wow -- catching up on your sitch, and all the great interactions on your thread -- just want to let you know I'm in awe and inspired.
Yep, it's amazing we are all so close. And no, I don't think it's because we're especially deranged -- we are in the vanguard of a change in thinking about human psychology -- and it's hard work. We need each other's support, that's for sure!
Great, thought-provoking "aha" lessons and insight from many wonderful DB pals on Jethro's thread. Hey, spread the word -- Jethro ROCKS!
Feel very lucky to listen in on all this.
No wisdom to impart. Gonna take notes for the hopeful day when The Wart and I begin to piece.
One thing that HAS helped me is when Wart, my H (who lives in his own apartment and reserves the right to date others) notices that OTHERS are interested in me. I have more value to him then.
Is this fair?
Is it "game-playing" to capitalize on this?
I don't go there. Just complicates things. Instead, I try to UNLEARN old habits of thinking ("he should do this or that, if he loved me he would have come home by now...") and ACCEPT what works.
Would it be possible for you to get your W's attention by somehow demonstrating that YOU are a hot commodity? Maybe sing a karaoke song in HER presence with ambiguous lyrics?
Pulling ON the Wart makes him pull away. Pulling AWAY from the Wart draws him toward me.
Trying not to be manipulative or cold-hearted, but self-valuing about it seems to work for me. I put on heels, a skirt and red lipstick, flirt with him and smile, but do it in public -- where others catch a glance at "the babe" and it's obvious I'm a catch.
Make yourself "the babe" somehow. (Gee, best not to go with lipstick, but maybe tight jeans and wraparound sunglasses?) and take her out to the bar and be COOL, her rock-and-roll star -- give her a thrill?
Only food for thought.
Might get you some more attention?
Anyways, I love ya though I'm just a neighbor and we don't talk much. Thanks for your ACE db-ing!
Quoting jethro: I still can't shake the feeling that I don't really know her...that everything has been an illusion for so long. Having a healthy, loving R seems distant to me...but I don't know whether I've built up some kind of perverse fantasy in my mind of what a "true" R is, or whether my expectations are realistic...
I'm curious to hear more about what you mean by not really knowing w....could this be a good thing? a discovery process? kind of like dating and falling in love all over again? Perhaps I shouldn't throw all that stuff out there since I'm not really sure what you mean...
What about pulling out those "expectations" and getting them on the proverbial table? You can figure out which ones are "reasonable" (whatever that means) and which are not (again). Are those expectations blocking you from enjoying what you have today, right now???? If so, well, you probably know what to do with them...doesn't mean you can't ever have expectations of course, maybe just if you throw them away for now, see what "the day" brings, and gather stuff up again, you'll find that your m is more than you thought it could be. But, as long as you're holding it up and comparing it to that "picture" .... well, it probably isn't ever going to look "just so". But maybe what it's missing "over here" it makes up for "over there"?
Sage
Relax. Appreciate. Be calm. Laugh. Enjoy. Be secure. Be loving. Be loved. Don't personalize. Don't ASSume. Accept. Be grateful.
(been catching a lot of flack for memory lapses of late)
I also mentioned to her that I was kind of wanting her to make a gesture of buying me a new ring, as that would show me where she wanted to be. Her response was that she had been thinking about that... 
)....
So, maybe there's a sense of wanting to watch him squirm? I don't know, SB. I think maybe I'll ask her about it tonight, 'cuz it does seem juvenile. The best answer I can get out of her is that she wants to prove to people that she's on the "right track" after her poor behavior. Of course, this is based on her thinking rumors are going around about her and OM. Ahhh...heck...I don't know...
