I Think I Have Officially DB'd Guys!!!

[jethro]

Thanks Shiny. I suppose you're right. I know she is feeling stronger about our R, but am I?

Funny thing happened while I was mellowing out at Yoga last night. An odd thought crossed my mind when my mind was supposed to be "clearing:" What if I'm purposely hanging on to the pain because it gives me an edge and doesn't make me forget that I need to keep DBing? Have I become used to being the martyr? Am I using my "pain" as a weapon in some way? Am I sabotaging my own efforts to really try and make things work out?

I don't know. I can't help but wonder if some of these things are true. I'd like to hear from some of you guys about this. Sage?

jethro

[sage]

Funny thing happened while I was mellowing out at Yoga last night. An odd thought crossed my mind when my mind was supposed to be "clearing:" What if I'm purposely hanging on to the pain because it gives me an edge and doesn't make me forget that I need to keep DBing? Have I become used to being the martyr? Am I using my "pain" as a weapon in some way? Am I sabotaging my own efforts to really try and make things work out?

I don't know. I can't help but wonder if some of these things are true. I'd like to hear from some of you guys about this. Sage?

jethro

How is it that cyber strangers who will likely never meet can know each other so well? As I was reading your paragraph about possibly holding onto the pain I was thinking...hmmm...I have some thoughts (and first hand experience!) with that....you know (!!!) I chuckled when I got to the end of your post.

I'll be back...I've got some work to do under deadline but I'll definitely stop in again with my 2 cents this afternoon.

Oh, and jethro, btw, I was thinking of you (and what you're going thru) this morning driving into work and did want to say that it makes perfect sense to me that w's recent disclosure would bring you emotionally (and hurtwise) back to the initial "finding out about the a" feelings...probably doesn't help any -- but I know that I would feel that way.

Sage

[lostlove]

What if I'm purposely hanging on to the pain because it gives me an edge and doesn't make me forget that I need to keep DBing? Have I become used to being the martyr? Am I using my "pain" as a weapon in some way? Am I sabotaging my own efforts to really try and make things work out?

you are the only one who can answer these questions...the fact that you come up with such specific ideas should tell you something...my guess would be it is not so much the are you as the why are you doing these things.

my guess again...protection.

I know she is feeling stronger about our R, but am I?

a new place to be in isn't it. when the was is actually present and probably more present in the r then they ever were...when we (the busy fixers that we are) no longer have our focus on them and their feelings what we are left with are our own. pretty scary aint it!

LL

[grislen]

Jethro,

I know I am still holding on to those things. I still have a text message my W sent me about 3 months ago telling me that we are going to get divorced and she doesnt want to lead me on. I hold to this to keep me working and thinking about DBing.

Lee

[sage]

So, Jethro, LL's right that only you can answer why you might still be holding onto your pain...let me do my best Dr. Phil impersonation --

What are you GETTING out of it?

You mentioned that these questions popped into your mind during yoga....not surprising to me at all! If I've got something troubling me, often meditation or yoga is the time it pops out...

How do you normally contemplate this kind of stuff? For me, a quiet car and a long drive works...thinking..thinking. Or, writing it down in a stream of consciousness helps too.

One thing I'd recommend -- don't dismiss any thought that pops into your head -- even if it's crazy, it may lead you to another truth.

Why hold onto your pain? I can offer up some of my reasons for holding onto mine...but maybe afterwards? I don't want to "project".

Sage

[jethro]

Thanks Sage, LL, and Lee.

I chuckled when I got to the end of your post.

I thought you'd like that. And yes, we know each other here very well in many ways.

btw, I was thinking of you (and what you're going thru) this morning driving into work and did want to say that it makes perfect sense to me that w's recent disclosure would bring you emotionally (and hurtwise) back to the initial "finding out about the a" feelings...

Thanks, Sage. It's pretty difficult because as far as my W is concerned, it's little more than what she's already confessed, so I'm not sure that she sees it the way I do. Although, on second thought, given what she's said, she may have an idea and just doesn't want to "go there." Had another 3 AM bout this morning of being awake and upset. Didn't want to wake my W, so I just tried to deal on my own.

you are the only one who can answer these questions...the fact that you come up with such specific ideas should tell you something...my guess would be it is not so much the are you as the why are you doing these things.

my guess again...protection.

What are you GETTING out of it?

Why hold onto your pain?

Perhaps I can address both of what you ladies have mentioned/questioned. Frankly, I'm not absolutely sure what it is. I do think, as LL Villa pointed out, that I am holding on to some of this stuff for protection. To let go is to assume all is well and there's no concern for further indiscretions. Not sure I can do this yet, as I can't REALLY trust my W yet. I forgive her, but I don't really trust her. Additionally, I think it's because it's simply what I know. I've been conditioned all of my life to feel crappy. Why should that change now? This is something that I need to overcome no matter what, really.

Furthermore, I have always considered myself a very moral person...a regular Dudley Do-Right. I met my W when I was 15 and have ALWAYS loved her...always... For her it's been different. So, I'm having to deal with...I suppose...a loss of innocence too, while having to deal with my own moral obligations and her lack of moral obligations. By choice I would never have M'd someone who would do this (not that any of us would have). However, there have been some red flags over the years. I just chose to ignore them.

Darn it, it gets complicated! The more I think about it, the more confused I become.

I also have to wonder about everyone on the BB. Is there some common trait that all of us have that brings us here? Is it neediness, a vigilent co-dependence, fear of change, strength, universal consciousness, a higher purpose? What is it? What is God trying to tell us? I can't help but think there's purpose in all of this...that the pain will lead to enlightenment.

So, now that I really got on a funky tangent. To answer you LL and Sage, I don't really know. Perhaps it's a combination of fear, protection, and being a martyr so I can continue to remind my W about the pain she has caused me. Healthy, huh? Ugh...

jethro

[jsiena]

J-

I also have to wonder about everyone on the BB. Is there some common trait that all of us have that brings us here? Is it neediness, a vigilent co-dependence, fear of change, strength, universal consciousness, a higher purpose? What is it? What is God trying to tell us? I can't help but think there's purpose in all of this...that the pain will lead to enlightenment.

I am wrestling with this big time right now. Especially why I feel the way I do even though my W treats me like crap. I understand that God is trying to tell me to work on a few things in my life and, truthfully, until those are done I would not be ready for a new relationship with my W. But the other part is harder. Is it unconditional or even pure love we had or have for our spouses that is now being forced to be shut off? I never saw any of this coming so the shock value of it is like some sort of post traumatic stress disorder. It is true that most people do not like or accept change especially when it is forced. But positive growth is always good.

[Dagny]

Jethro,

I understand revisiting pass hurts, I think this is just human. However, doing this, I believe, hurts us more than we can imagine. It seeps into our thoughts, affects our actions, we begin to live through these times again.

You said you are dudley-do right. Is your W intimitated by this? Here she does the worse thing in a M, realizes her mistake, but has probably been scared to give you details, how can she confirm the suspicions of a man who is moral when she has been amoral. I understand where you are coming from, but I think part of DB is understanding and accepting where they are coming from. I don't mean forget about this, but accept her apologies as legit and whole-hearted and move on to the next stage of this ride.

I think a vacation is a great idea. How about at least a mental vacation? Give yourself a week or two where you will use every visiualation trick you know to stop thinking of the R, and just do whatever else you do that is not about M. Easier said than done. You seem to be on the brink of a thriving M, just letting go of the hurt seems to be a huge part of that.

Jackie

[sage]

Perhaps I can address both of what you ladies have mentioned/questioned. Frankly, I'm not absolutely sure what it is. I do think, as LL Villa pointed out, that I am holding on to some of this stuff for protection. To let go is to assume all is well and there's no concern for further indiscretions. Not sure I can do this yet, as I can't REALLY trust my W yet. I forgive her, but I don't really trust her. Additionally, I think it's because it's simply what I know. I've been conditioned all of my life to feel crappy. Why should that change now? This is something that I need to overcome no matter what, really.

Furthermore, I have always considered myself a very moral person...a regular Dudley Do-Right. I met my W when I was 15 and have ALWAYS loved her...always... For her it's been different. So, I'm having to deal with...I suppose...a loss of innocence too, while having to deal with my own moral obligations and her lack of moral obligations. By choice I would never have M'd someone who would do this (not that any of us would have). However, there have been some red flags over the years. I just chose to ignore them.

Darn it, it gets complicated! The more I think about it, the more confused I become.

jethro -- so, it's clearly not just one thing, right? How about this....

If I let go of my pain...I....

* feel like I'm sending the message that an a. is "get overable" or OK

* expose myself -- without the a. as the "issue" in the m, we are back on level ground

* have to let go of something that's allowing me to feel crappy

* lose my image of myself as a man who would not tolerate this type of thing...

etc...(I totally paraphrased there so inaccuracies may exist). I'm going to say, though, that even the above list isn't the REAL story, is it? I mean, I know you've seen on my thread how immersed I can get in my own story, thoughts, but as an example -- what are you GETTING by holding onto your view as the "moral" one? for me, so much of it has to do with my parents, my f's infidelities, their d. etc. You say you were programmed to feel crappy all your life -- that sounds eerily familiar to me...

I also have to wonder about everyone on the BB. Is there some common trait that all of us have that brings us here? Is it neediness, a vigilent co-dependence, fear of change, strength, universal consciousness, a higher purpose? What is it? What is God trying to tell us? I can't help but think there's purpose in all of this...that the pain will lead to enlightenment.

I love my h. and want my m. That's why I've DB'd. Along the way, though, I realized that SO many of my actions and responses to him are (were) just patently unhealthy. And that the state we're in right now may be "blamed" on his a. and his dropping the bomb but have a tangled web back to the beginning of our r. AND, DB'ing gives me a way to untangle that web not only for him and our m. but so that I can get healthier, too. But you know that. I'd say that the people who "get" DB'ing have somehow reached the point in their lives where they've realized that whatever horrendously crappy sitch led them here is an opportunity for them to become more whole, more gracious, more forgiving, less judgemental, etc. whatever it is that they're holding onto that they need to let go.

For me? It's shown a bright light on my control issues, trust issues, lack of forgiveness towards my family and myself, fear of uncertainty....

Sage

[hoping]

Jethro..first..don't apologize for being "down" that is what we are here for, to help life you up..

I really like what Sage said about all of us who are getting what db'ing is about..Sorry I don't know how to do the quote thing..but to become more gracious, forgiving,more of anything that helps us improve our own lives and hopefully our m..that is what it is all about.

You really sound like you need a vacation..is it possible for you to get away?? even for a weekend of quiet..alone.Being alone is sad sometimes, but also a time to reflect and clear your head.

I know since I have started attending our church more and getting a better understanding of what God does intend for us, that I feel a piece and believe that He holds the future for what our lives will turn out to be...He tests us many times..in many ways.
Keep strong...

Sue