I'm wondering if your H may have had issues with intimacy? Just curious. I think it's great he went into therapy, worked on himself and was able to make some changes. That's not always easy, especially for a lot of men! You mention having expressed your unhappiness and him just doing his routine. I think sometimes it's really difficult for people to internalize what needs to be changed and live it. I think it takes a lot of time and effort to make changes natural, effortless, routine... I work with special needs kids and there's a sort of similarity. For example, "rewiring" the brain and making behaviors and cognitive skills automatic. It definitely doesn't happen overnight. And only so much can be rewired.... But when someone wants to change and actually does work on it. Well, that's commendable....
So what did you see in your H in the first place? What attracted you to him and why did you marry him?
There is no arriving, ever. It is all a continual becoming.
I have been reading your posts for a while but haven't contributed anything to them so far. Didi, I appreciate very much that you are prepared to open up to us in this way.
Runningoutoftime, I can attest to what works for "personal change". Read Psycho Cybernetics by Maxwell Maltz and apply the exercises religiously and precisely. It works like you would not believe. I have used it with great effect on the anger and selfishness issues which led to me and my W separating and I have also used it to go from D and E student at school to a straight A student. I have also used the teachings with great success in my professional life. I must have faith that they will be just as effective in my M.
But, you must do what the book says TO THE LETTER or any effort will be wasted.
It works, trust me. I have gone from being an angry and selfish piece of junk to being an unflappable and generous person (whilst still remaining an alpha male).
Good luck to both of you!
GH31
Me: 46 W: 46 T: 23 M: 20 DS12 DD11 DS5
W left: 01/28/08 Discovered OM: 02/26/08 W back for 9 days: 04/08 W returned 05/21/08 EA/PA - 01/08-07/09 W's MLC 2008-2014 (realised this much later)
One more thing before I go to sleep... you probably know all this stuff already. You are wise in spite of confusion...
OM will replace you much more quickly and easily than your H. Just because someone doesn't express feelings easily in words or even actions doesn't mean deep feelings aren't there. Even if your H is unhappy and has gone through a lot of pain in the marriage, that doesn't mean he doesn't have valuable history and memories with you that will have a lifetime of importance to him. Children are a binder.... I hate to say this but to OM you are most likely just a blip on his timeline.
If you died tomorrow chances are the one who will miss you most, and who will grieve most, and hold you closest in his memory.... your H.
I'm not trying to convince you to leave or stay, or even appreciate the history, time and memories you have with your H. I'm just trying to state a likely fact.
Okay time to sleep! My H is deep sea fishing out in South America... so I'm kind of aimless this weekend.
There is no arriving, ever. It is all a continual becoming.
OM will replace you much more quickly and easily than your H. Just because someone doesn't express feelings easily in words or even actions doesn't mean deep feelings aren't there. Even if your H is unhappy and has gone through a lot of pain in the marriage, that doesn't mean he doesn't have valuable history and memories with you that will have a lifetime of importance to him. Children are a binder.... I hate to say this but to OM you are most likely just a blip on his timeline.
If you died tomorrow chances are the one who will miss you most, and who will grieve most, and hold you closest in his memory.... your H.
This is very true. In my sitch, there's pretty strong evidence that the OM found a new GF when he moved away from our town but he continued to play WW when he could arrange it or when she'd take off and drive to see him. One weekend OM told WW he was going home to talk to his wife about divorce and then he'd let WW know when to proceed with filing for divorce so they could be together. WW texted him on that Saturday asking him if he'd talked to his wife and he told her that she and his kids had went out to dinner without him so he didn't get a chance. He even texted WW on a Sunday evening telling her he was just getting back into town. But....I found out the next week when I exposed to OMW that he wasn't even home the weekend before. Of course I told WW this, but she doesn't believe me because "OM would never lie to me"! Ummmm...let's see, he has no problem lying to HIS wife, why would you think he won't lie to his mistress?
Sorry for the mini-TJ, but I just wanted to illustrate how OP's are experts at what makes THEM happy. If it's not you, the next one comes along pretty quickly. Sometimes while you're still involved with the OP. Think of things like that when you have visions of how wonderful OM makes you feel. Because that's the draw of an affair. It's most likely not that you "love" OM, it's how OM makes YOU feel.
Hope4us
Me - 49, W 49 S22 & S18 Dday 9/4/07 W claims NC 4/7/08 8/29/09 - Divorce Busted. Lots to work through, but we're going to make it.
ROOT, H DEFINITELY has intimacy issues. Growing up he never remembers seeinng his parents hug or kiss. He can't remember much of that toward himself either from them. It took us 2 years to have a baby due mostly to the intimacy problems. He knows this about himself, always has, but finally did something about it and worked on it. It does seem real to me now when he says or does something affectionate. Before, he was always robotic.
When I met H, I had dated only a few other guys and they all turned out to be self centered jerks. I consciously decided to look for a "better guy" this time around. H is tall, dark, and handsome. He is fit and loves sports like myself. He is unselfish and hardworking. Great work ethic! Smart. VERY good listener. Knew he'd get along with my familly. Religious. Good morals. He was in the same spot in life as me when I met him. I was attracted to H more in my mind, then my heart, but my heart had sent me to other no good guys and I didn't want to do that again. I don't remember the "in love" stage with H at all.
GH31, psychocybernetics huh? I'll have to check that out.
I know both of you are right about about the OM. My heart says "no way" but my mind knows what you are saying is true. Thanks for reminding me. I need to keep hearing it over and over...seriously. Please do not stop.
I was attracted to H more in my mind, then my heart, but my heart had sent me to other no good guys and I didn't want to do that again. I don't remember the "in love" stage with H at all.
I can relate to this...I never had a 'crazy in love' feeling with my H either. It was just more easy, laid back, comfortable and felt right. FWIW, all the R experts say the "in love" stage does not last beyond two years.
I think I was past the "in love" stage with H, more into the "this feels right," contentment phase. I think love "feels" different to different people in different circumstances, and sometimes codependent relationships, with their emotional intensity, feel most "crazy in love" but aren't really love at all.
M60 H52 D20 M14 yrs OW-old gf from 1986 bomb-5/18/08 H filed for D-9/10/08 D final 4/24/09 xH remarried (not OW) 2012
Hearing you say that "sometimes codependent relationships, with their emotional intensity, feel most "crazy in love" but aren't really in love at all." helps because that feeling felt so right so wonderful and soooo something I hadn't felt before. It's hard to think that my feelings toward H are love, too.
Do a bit of reading about codependence in relationships (just google it and you'll find plenty) and see if any of it "resonates" with you regarding this or past relationships. If you begin to recognize yourself, it's worth giving some thought to.
M60 H52 D20 M14 yrs OW-old gf from 1986 bomb-5/18/08 H filed for D-9/10/08 D final 4/24/09 xH remarried (not OW) 2012
Real long-term love is not crazy, heart-beating, addiction feelings (that's unsustainable). It's something much more subtle, and it's something that happens over time.
From what you've described it dosen't sound like the feelings you have for OM had reached the "mature love" stage. Is sounds like the bio-chemical stage of "strong attraction" and the crazy drug-like feeling of a "crush." It's a great feeling, but it's not yet love. It's an earlier stage. There's always a chance early love can turn into mature love, but that's a gamble. I personally would never recommend anyone gamble their family on this type of possiblity. The statistics are just too low, the potential for drama and damage too large.
There is no arriving, ever. It is all a continual becoming.
