Saffie, I've seen you help so many people here and give out wonderful advice... why can't you support her here, where she is comfortable?
I don't have a clue what this site is that you and others keep trying to almost "recruit" people over to... is there something I said that you feel would harm Ingrid's efforts in some way?
Please, Saffie, if I'm/we are not doing well at this, let me know because we have no idea who may be reading. This is just a support group for those who are trying to DB. Ingrid has done an amazing amount of reading... but wants to try to get things on track... again, why can't you offer support here?
I'm sorry Ingrid, for interupting the conversation, thanks for answering so honestly.
It sounds like you are reaffirming your boundries in a way you are comfortable. If your S had not been around at that moment, who knows where that conversation could've gone?!?! You took a step toward telling him that you don't want to share, while giving him a hint of what he's missing. There are many ways to get our message across.
I want to think about everything we've talked about since we "met" here and write more later. I'm a little distracted and worried -- and honestly a bit intimidated by the other stuff going on here that I don't understand.
There are others on there with much greater knowledge than I have in this area.
I stay on this site to help those I can, but I know that I have my limitations. I don't think you are giving bad advice at all - there are just many opinions out there. Some of those opinions are not seen as 'good' DBing, and although valid, and do work, some people have been kicked off here for being quite frank.
It was at the request of Light Seeker that I came over here.
Hope that answers you questions.
When I have a bit more time I will try and read a bit more of ingrid's posts but at the moment I am dealing with juggling four children and a very sick pony.
Saffie me 46 H 46 M in 1986 D20,D18,S16,D13 H's A 01/05 to 07/06 H recommitted to M 07/06 renewed vows 09/06 Going from strength to strength
I am going to be quite frank in this post, and we don't know one another, so I am sorry if I say anything that hurts you.
I have skim read this thread and it would appear to me that yoour H knows that he can walk over you.
I don't believe you are piecing. In piecing I personally think both parties to the R are wanting to be together, even if they are having trouble accomplishing that; your H doesn't seem so sure. I do think that may be though because he knows he can 'get away' with it. Piecing should be where both parties are pulling in the same direction and are 100% open and honest. It's the template for the rest of your M'd life.
I stand by what I said in an earlier post about you projecting your worries onto your Hand that doesn't help. I understand now though that perhaps it was just your gut instinct seeing as he IS having an EA- and that is not acceptable.
Even though I get very down about my H's A and still get angry etc two years on, I KNOW he is not cheating again and he leaves me in no doubt that he wants to be with me. I still think about leaving on odd occasions because of the hurt and my lack of trust - and he gives me no reason not to trust him now. I cannot begin to imagine what it is like for you having those feelings and him still giving you reasons NOT to trust him (((((HUGS))))) I am scared I stayed because I was too frightened of the alternative - even though I love my H.
I found that, after being on all manner of AD's and panic attack drugs and valium etc, after a year I wanted off. I lived my life in a fog and just couldn't move on. For me what worked was Cognitive Behavioural Therapy (CBT). I read a lot about it - particularly a book called Learned Optimism by Martin Seligman,(who has also written Authentic Happiness), and found a good therapist. It has helped me move on from the wreck that tried to commit suicide in front of my four children, to a fully functioning, generally more articulate, (not that you would know it here), adult again. It has taught me how to cope. How to deal with the things I can and how to store away those things I can't deal with until a time in the future when I can. I know this sounds very simplistic, and I guess it is, but it has been hard for me to learn. I had to completely breakdown the way I naturally react in situations and re-learn what I do, to achieve the end result I need in order to be able to function. I fall back into old patterns horribly sometimes, but it gets easier with time.
The other thing I do, (and admittedly I have a H who wants to be with me and states that very much), is always have something nice to look forward to - even if it is a long way away - and make sure we talk about the future together...in a positive way. We talk about what we are going to be able to do when the kids leave home, (even though that thought scares the whatsit out of me), and what we will do when we retire - even though that is years away.
When things get really bad I chat online with my friends on the site that cannot be named as they are good fun as well as good advisors - and I chat to my GF's in real life about how to do away with our H's. We don't mean it but it does give us a laugh....things like sewing lead weights in their swimming trunks, etc.......you get the gist. I also go through periods of avoiding self help books and read alot of trash - thrillers etc - just to escape all the angst.
Through the other site you can also make contact by email with those you want to - so you could contact Light Seeker that way. I find her a tremendous support and we chat about mutual interests like the horses etc - sometimes that is just enough to keep you going just another day.
I think perhaps in your sitch, you may have to get to the point where you set strong boundaries and stick with them, however scary it gets, as your H just won't change at the moment - why should he....the past shows he has no need. I feel very sad to say that, but it's how it looks.
Good luck.
Saffie me 46 H 46 M in 1986 D20,D18,S16,D13 H's A 01/05 to 07/06 H recommitted to M 07/06 renewed vows 09/06 Going from strength to strength
I hope the pony gets better, saffie. Thanks for dropping by even in the midst of chaos.
I am finding the censorship on this site increasingly heavy-handed, which is not really a moderator's role. If someone offers a perspective that isn't part of the DBing philosophy, then the moderator should clarify what the DB stance is on the issue and leave it at that. If people want to refer others to websites, books, whatever, then I don't see that as anyone else's business. Having said that, I spent a few minutes earlier on the site that must not be named, and found myself not too thrilled with the tone of some of the posts. Perhaps I'll be more appreciative after I spend time on the thread saffie recommended. In the meantime, I'm very happy to be here and not having to deal with all of this on my own.
D, why are you 'distracted and worried'? Splits in schools of thought happen all the time - look at all the different versions of churches that used to be one organization. Hopefully the worry is not caused by something out in the real world. I will try to find you again, but it seems that you are mostly posting on others' threads, not your own, hey?
Last night I just couldn't stand it anymore and there was sex. Initiated gently by my H and I just could not resist. Afterwards, he said that I wasn't 'sharing' him with anyone now, so I guess that means he broke off the online EA. I am going to ask him if he is signed on to any dating sites and if he has blocked her email address, etc., so she can't contact him anymore, but I will have to be careful to time that conversation properly.
I told him that he wasn't the only one that needed a second chance, that it had been a lot of years of only me being allowed to have feelings and him always having to keep his feelings to himself for fear of my reaction - looking back, I can see many instances where I was totally unappreciative, unreasonable - lots of 'uns' on my list. I told him that now it was his turn, that I would be the strong one and that he could tell me what was on his mind, even if he thought it would hurt me, that he could do what he needed to do (in terms of thinking about/working on stuff - he apologized for not 'being able to get his s--t together' and I hope he'll take some steps towards doing that - and that if it included talking to me, that would be great.
I also thanked him for not leaving in those years that he was so unhappy, because I'm sure he wanted to. I wish he had found a different way to deal with his unhappiness, but he could have tossed us all and run off with someone else, and then I wouldn't have had the years I did as a fulltime mother, I wouldn't have the luxury of working part time now - I really appreciate that he hung in as our provider. Yes, it's only what he should have been doing (after all, I didn't make the kids by myself) but I can still appreciate it.
I told him that I loved him, after acknowledging that it's not something he really wants to hear. He said that he could see that, and that if he didn't love me, he wouldn't be here. This last part was not said in a happy voice and I didn't take it as a declaration of any kind - it was more like a grudging acknowledgement that he does have some affection for me, even if it's not the 'in love' high he's looking for.
Of course, this morning he was withdrawn again, seemed surprised when I kissed him goodbye and left without making any attempt to kiss me goodbye a little while ago, when he dropped our boy off (I was working away from home today, attending a meeting that takes place every couple of months, so my H did the school driving today).
Apparently he's only going to be affectionate when he wants sex. I am going to have to find a way to live with that if I want to continue to hang in. Can see feeling used and getting angry pretty quickly. On the other hand, any contact is an opportunity to let him see that things are different now.
I don't understand why this is so much harder than the months when he was planning to leave. Is it only because I have some hope now? If I were a good buddhist, I would just let go of all desire, but since I'm not really a good anything (a little too rebellious to totally conform), I suppose I'll have to find a way to live with that too.
I think once you get over the immediate scare of them wanting to leave....and then them staying.....you get a chance to breathe....and then the anger and resentment surfaces. It's very common.
Don't take the tone of one or two of the threads on the other place to heart and let them put you off.
Have you got into the MAAN group yet? You will find that you will gravitate towards those who you feel are in similar sitches and who you find it good to turn to for support.
I avoid some people and just don't read their posts, whilsts others I have a really good R with.
Saffie me 46 H 46 M in 1986 D20,D18,S16,D13 H's A 01/05 to 07/06 H recommitted to M 07/06 renewed vows 09/06 Going from strength to strength
I asked him about his schedule for tomorrow - he's going to a work thing overnight (legitimate work thing) to which I both cannot go and do not want to go. However, out of my mouth flew 'other spouses are going, aren't they?' and 'it really hurts my feelings that you don't even think about asking me' or something like that. Then I started crying and said there was no point bringing it up since it didn't change anything and turned my back. He left the room and I went outside and sat on the stairs and cried.
After a while I calmed myself down, reminded myself that I didn't actually want to go and that I had said just a few hours ago that he could do what he needed to do and I would be strong - that lasted a long time, didn't it?
So, I went back inside, he came back into the kitchen (had been in the bathroom) and apologized for not giving me a chance to say no. Lovely smiley eyes, looking right at me. I am just a sucker for this guy, he turns my insides to goo. That's a romantic image, isn't it?
Anyway, I said I was sorry for going back on what I had said last night and thanked him for what he had just said. And then we were back to the distance, which is going to drive me insane, insane, insane. I will take to drinking heavily, I'm sure of it.
Is this good or bad? I don't know, but I'm going to go outside and do whatever comes up in the garden and stop thinking about this for a while.
Must stop obsessing about my H - so difficult to do, but so necessary.
Good or Bad! Ha. You're kidding, right? You got the lovely, smiley eyes and gooey insides and you weren't anywhere near the bedroom (uh, not that a bedroom is necessary, but you know).
I wish I could understand the "distance". But you got through for a while and previously you said that the only time he wasn't distant was in bed. Soooo. Hmmm. Is it possible you've been putting up too big a wall in front of him?
See the thing about DBing is doing what works. Most people advise to detach, be happy, etc. That is what is best for the S that ends up on these boards, no doubt, but in my sitch, (and I hardly ever suggest someone else do it my way), I was already living my life (while he worked to pay for it),going on trips with the girls, letting his complaints about work and most everything else just roll off my back.
He'd come home from a hard day at work and complain about his job. I didn't listen anymore. I'd say something flip like, "Everyone has to work. There's a support group for this problem and they meet at the bar."
But hey, I was supportive. LOL. He started hanging out at the bar instead of coming home and I hated that so I went and got a job bartending at his favorite watering hole. I got to wait on him and everything! I thought I was so darn clever. He didn't.
There wasn't much to argue about, I'd trained myself years before to hold back the tears and accept that I couldn't change him.
He wanted my attention.
He got it.
He wanted me to fight for him. I'd always told him (in many ways)that I wouldn't. That was before I had to. Surprise. I loved my husband.
The biggest 180 I did was pack up my car and drive 1500 miles, without telling him, just to see his face. I showed up on his job site (that wasn't on a map) because I couldn't go to the apartment he shared with ow.
The rest is history.
Obsessed much? I love being obsessed with my husband again.
Thanks so much for taking the time to answer my questions. I'm so sorry about your pony. I hope he(?) gets better soon.
I hadn't noticed any moderating other than no advertising and no email exchange... which, although unusual for a support board environment, I can understand on some levels.
I've seen mods jump in when they disagree with advice dispensed, but that is comforting to me. The reason I was so concerned that you were pinpointing my suggestions/exchanges with Ingrid is because I have no credentials whatsoever behind solutions I try to come up with. You also were not the first to mention another board that I did see in a previous post had the DB boards as a "hotbed of controversy". I spend a lot of time doing my homework and reading situations before I speak up, but if I'm missing something, again, I wish y'all would just jump in. Everyone reading, myself included, would appreciate the help and learning from each other.
Many folks come here with their lives and hearts on the line. If I say something wrong, I'm comforted to know someone will jump in because the last thing I want to do is hurt someone.
My threads from '06 and beyond are fractured up and all over the place. For whatever reason, I didn't get much response to my novels of angst and I don't open up easily.
I've started a thread in piecing... but I don't have tons of computer time either. I generally log in and look in on people I care about. Sometimes I'm inspired to talk about "us" but usually by the time I'm done with my post I've already answered myself or I sound whiny or "gushy" to myself so I don't push the submit button. My h just called me in the midst of this posting--he ended up hanging up on me though so I will probably go to my own thread to try and sort it out. :-(
