Worse before Better?

[Sophie]

Okay I have to tell you about the day.

The end of soccer season always brings a team get together. My H missed S13's soccer party. That was the weekend of my bday and H said he had to leave town for his work. Probably true, but who knows. I know he was avoiding my birthday and we haven't heard from him since.

The soccer mom's plan these parties via email and we've been doing this since Monday. My H has his email on the list also because coach emails everyone schedules.

I didn't know if he was getting any info on the soccer party...sometimes his email works, some times it doesn't.

I didn't think he would go to this, it's not a huge deal and he has been invisible for over two weeks and as far as he knows, I've been in touch with someone...legal.

Anyway.........this morning, I see his number on caller ID. Uh-oh....I chill my nerves and answer it.

Creed...my 'resentment' was in check

I think he heard me take a deep breath before saying 'hello'.

He said, HI...(me)hi....HOw are you? (me)Good...and you?

He said OK..and 'are you guys ready to go?' I really didn't think he'd go!

I said not yet, but we will be, I told him I had to get fruit at the store on the way.

He asked how to get to the party and if I needed anything for it. (Wow...he offered to help out).

I remembered reading here somewhere that if they offer to help, let them!

I said, 'Well...you could get the fruit." (Short and simple, huh?)

He said 'okay, I'll do that'. 'Do you need anything else?'

(I'll tell you......... a billion things went through my head that I needed!!!!!)

I said, nope...you get the fruit and that will help a lot.

He then asked me, "How do you write a letter of resignation?"

I thought a minute and said, 'Dear so and so...I'm sorry to inform you that you will no longer have the pleasure of my assistance."

He has been working two jobs, the first one he has been with since we moved here in 2001...he met OW there,(she was only there 1 year) and there are negative, less ambitious men whom I, nor he, would want around our kids. A couple of these men, are who have been clinging to him since he moved out.

The second job is in the same field, and they want him full time. I heard words come out of my H's mouth today about the first job that I hadn't heard since he told me he was done with our marriage.

He said, "I've had it. I'm done!"

He told me the caliber of people at the new job is non drinking, non smoking, family people. He says he can't take the negativity of the old job! The moral at the job he is quitting is very low. I'm glad he wants to leave this job, because that job place has huge bad reminders of very hard, ugly times for us.

He has spent all day writing, and rewriting a resignation letter. He said he hasn't been able to sleep much lately and this week he has tossed and turned all night, all week. I asked if it was because of changing jobs. He said he wasn't sure if that was the only thing...but, it must be part of it. He says he's excited becasue he feels this will be good 'growth' for him....he proably meant career wise. But, it goes hand in hand with your overall life, right?

It feels good to see him feel better about himself.

I don't resent that. I know he has to feel better about himself before we can really talk about him moving back here.

Geez...two weeks ago, he was saying it was time to talk to someone about something...legal. (He won't use the word 'divorce' or 'lawyer' anymore...)

He had a good time with the kids in the pool at the soccer party. I enjoyed the pretty day, the pretty trees, watched everyone...and felt okay with me. I am fully aware that he still does not live here, he still does not have any comittment to this family. But, he wasn't horrible.

A thunderstorm rolled in and everyone left. The kids and I went home, H went home to keep tweaking his letter and resume.

He said he was nervous. I said, 'let me know how it goes'
He said 'I sure will!'

I guess H had a good day. He doesn't have as many of them as I do....so, that's a good thing for him...

So, at the risk of analyzing...:)....are these steps of a MLC'r coming out of.....something?

I've been reminding myself that resentment isn't going to get anything done...and I feel so much better when I just deal with myself and the kids and also, when I remember that I am honesty doing the best I can.

[momof2girls]

Sounds like the day went well! When H and I were S he never came to anything and would never offer to do a damn thing! I had to hire someone to mow the lawn!! There was no way I could do it with a one year old baby toddling around!

that is so funny that you, creed and I are questioners! I am asking the next before H is done answering the first. What is really bad is I will keep rewording the question so his answer is what I want to here. I have really tried to stop that and H notices. Now, instead of asking and asking I take his answer and bite my tongue.

Resentment is not going to get you anywhere and there is nothing much you can do about how H is choosing to lead his life right now. I think it is a positive that he is not pushing a D. Like I mentioned before my H was saying he wanted a D the day after he left!!

If H was nice today...expect him to backoff. Seems the MLCer backs away if they feel they have revealed too much of themselves.

You seem to be handling things really well...let him just spin out of control and you watch from the sidelines. keep you and the kids happy and healthy!!
On a different note:
So how is teaching online? I will graduate with my masters as a reading specialist next May and I am trying to think of something I can do in addition to my teaching job now. Maybe the community college or something.

[Creed]

Sophie

You and I must have been born twins and then separated. As you described your interrogation methods, I was sitting here laughing to myself...you were describing my exact reactions as to how I dealt with my H...the poor guy. Looking back now, I can honestly say that I feel remorseful for the way I interacted with him. What chance did he have with me coming at him that way?? You're way ahead of me Sophie...you're already recognizing the right/wrong way to try to communicate, or not communicate as the case may be. I also hung on to the answers, and figured they were etched in stone, and if I didn't like the answers I got, I immediately began trying to figure out how to change his answers, or how to approach the question differently so his answers were something I could live with. I also would have new questions ready before he ever answered the first one!! LOL I remember watching this little vein on his forehead pulse as he did his 'thinking', and almost always, he'd get a headache. I never truly realized how hard he must have been thinking. Oye..I behaved like a prison warden!! God forgive me!

And who says MLC doesn't drive the LBS just as crazy!!

Oh...and believe me...their memories are like a sieve. Although my H could dredge up negative times from 30 years past, he couldn't/wouldn't remember what he/I had said just the day before, let alone a couple of weeks. I dont know if it was selective memory or not. I have a feeling it was just something else he was incapable of. It's also one of the signs of MLC, along withe depression. It takes all of their resources to handle their careers correctly. I don't think they have too much left over for anything that deals seriously with their family, bill paying etc. I saw my H pour all of himself into his job..which he exceeded at, and put nothing into the family/marriage/home...and , of course, it began to fail miserably.

Many MLCers 'define' themselves by their job/income/materialism/youth. Family, marriage and home is how most women define themselves. Most men will be the first example. That's just a general statement..not all cases are the same. But I think its safe to say that many, if not most, MLC men will put much more into their lives outside the home/family..and soon their co-workers, friends and work begin to monopolize their time and energy.

I couldn't get my H to do anything around our home. But if work called, or a friend/relative called, he was Johnny on The Spot, and worked tirelessly for them. It hurt...it really hurt, because I was basing my own 'self' on how my family/home/marriage was existing. H was never like that before. He took pride in his family/home. And he never put work first. Then he did a 180 turn with MLC.

I can't explain why, I just know it happens. And I just know that I'm glad that I choose those things that I did to define myself. I'll never regret the time/effort I put into my family/home and marriage. I made plenty of mistakes, and took alot of things, including H, granted at times. But I believe my heart was in the right place, and I believe yours is too.

If you take the route of less questions, less intense scrutiny of his every word/action, you'll start to feel yourself relaxing. You'll start to feel yourself getting new perspective on things...about him, but even more important, about yourself and your family. Remember, those two things are extremely important right now. As others have said, you have to pretty much just let him 'flap in the wind' while you go on with your life, building up yourself and exercising whatever actions you may have to to provide your children and yourself a safe and secure future. Someday, he might want to pound your door in and become an active part of your lives again. But until/unless that happens, this is what your life is right now.

I truly feel that at some time in the future, my xh will try to contact me. If /when he does, I will accept the invitation. And I have every intention of not doing much more than listening. I think it would be very interesting and I'd probably get more answers from just listening, than I ever would from asking my own questions. Food for thought.

[Sophie]

I am asking the next before H is done answering the first. What is really bad is I will keep rewording the question so his answer is what I want to here. I have really tried to stop that and H notices. Now, instead of asking and asking I take his answer and bite my tongue.

ME too!!! I have to try so hard to not interrupt...teachers are really good at talking...talking fast, and we are good at listening fast too!!

The party wasn't at our house....but he did offer to pay for trophies too. I paid though.

Like you too, either I mow, the kids mow, or my neighbor mows for me. I am the only one on the street with a push mower...everyone else has a ride on mower. My H bought himself a ride on mower for the house he lives in. I always mowed when he lived here because it was some time by myself, the mower drowned out all sounds, and I got exercise too. Now, like you, I just don't have time.

You're right! Be nice...back off. That's what happened around my bday weekend. He had been great for a few weeks, then BAM...he ran!!

I like teaching online...it's a lot of work, especially getting to know computer programs, and all the tech stuff. I teach math and have a masters in education....you need a masters to teach online for an assiciate program. I have two computers now though. I never thought I'd have a laptop, much less TWO!

[Creed]

Sophie...sounds like the day went very, very well. I'm so proud of the way you handled yourself...I know from experience how difficult it can be to change our own bad habits

The whole thing about resigning from the 'bad' job is something that you should feel extremely gratified about. He may be in crisis, but it seems that his blinders have slipped off a little, and he can see the true negative and positive forces in his life.

[Sophie]

Well...I've been thinking...maybe it's resentment, maybe it's self protection....

He may be in crisis, but it seems that his blinders have slipped off a little, and he can see the true negative and positive forces in his life.

He tm'd saying that he gave his two week notice, that it went well with his supervisor, but that the stories might get pretty good when the men in the shop find out.

I replied, 'congratulations...that took a lot of guts and determination. P.s....I'll stay tuned'.

Now....I don't want him thinking I am okay with everything in his parallel world!!

The hairs on my neck stood up when he said he was giving his two week notice...he said 'It's over! I've put up with all I am going to! I'm done!"

OMG I've heard those words...a FEW times!! Same ones he used on me and our marriage! I held back, but I wanted to say 'OUCH...I've heard those words!!"

Anyway, I feel I have to let it be known (to him) that just becasue he quit a crummy job, that doesn't change anything about his behaviour toward me and the kids!

Maybe this is just a 'feel good' decision, like the feel good purchases of a camaro, motorcycle, riding lawn mower, new little car...like the first feel good decision of the OW..,,

This doesn't change the fact that after 3 years, 2 of them seperated, things have to change! I cannot get sucked back into him cake eating/coming an going whenever, and however. I still refuse to be involved in that parallel/non committal life he wants us to live.

So...do I write a note, reminding him that he told me to talk to 'someone'..I assume he meant someone in the legal field? Just because he was civil at a public soccer party for a couple hours, doesn't mean diddly squat to me... and the kids think it's pretty crappy that he has so much fun with other kids and then drives the opposite direction and won't do anything to be with them!

Oaky...see? The resentment rears up!! I like my distance and non interaction with someone who show such ignorance toward me and no regard for anything I am about, not to mention my feelings.

I am mad at myself for texting a nice message indicating I'd be waiting for more stories! Why couldn't I have just said, 'congratualtions' and left it at that??

I don't mean to portray resentment as much as I have made a decision and want to stand by it. I don't want any involvement with him anymore under the noncommittal terms that have been for 3 years.

I'm done!!

Okay....guidance?...How can I be friendly and pleasant without letting him float his way around here again?

[Creed]

Sophie

You layed out some pretty rigid requirements you'd expect from your H, and have stated that if he doesn't meet them to your satisfaction, that you have no desire to be involved with him any further, especially if you feel they are noncommital.

Yes, you're resentful, and honestly, you have every right to feel that way. Now you have to decide if you can ever let that resentment go long enough to make some well thought out decisions. You can NOT, as I've said previously, make these decisions when you're carrying such strong resentment towards your H and what he's done.

I hear a lot of fear in your posts...and fear is the forebearer of anger. I hear lots of anger, along with the resentment. One of the reasons fo DBing is that we learn to become stronger while going through one of the most difficult times in a persons life. And as time goes on, the longer we survive, the easier it is to let that fear and resentment go...because basically it does nothing but eats us up inside.

No one can say how long a certain phase of a marriage will go on, especially MLC. If you need an expiration date to your Hs MLC, you will be sorely disappointed. If that is the only way you feel you can deal with it, then you'd probably feel better talking to a L and getting a divorce filed.

If you're just sick and tired of his noncommital, hurtful way...and you're losing your patience, and think you sometimes will lose your mind if it goes on much longer..but you really don't feel 100% that divorce is what you want , or is needed, then you have to step back and not let your H emotions/ractions/choices have such a strong impact on you. He only controls your life when you let him. Otherwise he can't. Remember that.

I know how it feels to distrust yourself in how well you judge someone. Are you really looking at them truthfully, or are you being misguided by their words and actions. I hated feeling like that, and found out the hard way that sometimes it's just better to put your trust in God than in anyone else..including yourself.

Don't be mad at yourself for being nice in the tm!!! Why should you feel that way for being open and honest about your interest??? You can't change yourself to try to change him!!! Don't ever think that is the answer. And if you were the opposite to him, would that have really made you feel better?

I'm sure you're kids are hurting pretty bad because of all of this. Its important that you show them a level headed and emotionally secure parent. Think how scarey it must be for them to see their dad acting this way towards them. Think how much they just want the 'old' dad back. Someway, you've got to try to explain that their dad is going through something that none of you can help him get through...that he has to figure out on his own. And while he's trying to deal with this problem, he will no doubt seem like a stranger at times. It's not that he doesn't love you all...it's that he doesn't love his life right now, and he doesn't know what to do about it.

Thats why I thought him resigning from that job was a good sign. I wish my H would have quit his crappy job, and gotten rid of all the hangers on that attached themselves to him. I still believe he pretty much 'morphed' into the type of people he was working with day in and day out.

Sophie, only you know if you want this marriage to have a chance, or if you've already decided it's not worth it to you. Only you know how long you can/will deal with his moods/emotions/reactions or non reactions.

I just wish I could help you see that all the anger (although understandable) is holding you back from better things in your future...H or not. And that it might be adversely affecting the kids in the long run. Never think for a moment that they don't pick up on your feelings, no matter how much we think we're hiding them. Find peace in your own life, and then decide if you're ready to make decisions regarding your marriage.

Protect yourself financially...that is wise to do now.

The other options/decisions you do not want to make in haste, and certainly not while feeling as much anger/resentment as you feel right now.

[Sophie]

Thanks Creed...I was opening my worst thoughts to get some perspective on them.

If you're just sick and tired of his noncommital, hurtful way...and you're losing your patience, and think you sometimes will lose your mind if it goes on much longer..but you really don't feel 100% that divorce is what you want , or is needed, then you have to step back and not let your H emotions/ractions/choices have such a strong impact on you. He only controls your life when you let him. Otherwise he can't. Remember that.

This is where I am truthfully. I am just sick to death of being lied to, or fibbed, or half truths etc. It insults my intelligence and it is just another form of cheating.

How do I 'allow'/stand here/ let him come and go knowing he is dishonest with me, keeping secrets...and does nothing to contribute to the health and mental stability of me and the kids? I am fine if he stays away, but when he expects us to welcome him after who knows how long...and who know where he has been...how do I do that? After 2+ years of doing that, I do not feel good about myself to allow him to come and go as he pleases, and to treat us with NO concern...as if we have been waiting in anticipation for him to show up and jump to greet him with open arms? The kids and I are extremly leery and hesitant when he comes around just loiters here....until, he gets bored and goes somewhere else. How do I stop that?

How do I draw boundaries without resentment coming out? What boundaries are right? What boundaries stop the 'cake eatting'. I really don't know. What are healthy boundaries for my home, that are fair and not rigid?

I just don't want to be expected to put up with that kind of treatment in my own home from him or anybody else?

[Creed]

Sophie

You've just made a good list of 'boundaries' in your last post!

If he decides to overstep those boundaries, then that is when you will have to show him that you mean business. That you will no longer have an open door to him if he cannot abide by the boundaries.

Noone is suggesting that you let him 'cake eat', especially if it is disturbing the peacefulness of your and your kids lives.

I believe all of us have had our fill of lies, deception and deviousness. I know I sure did. And it's especially hard when those are the things that we've always abhored in the past..and now our beloved spouses are doing it without thinking twice. Why that happens, I don't know. It's like it can't be MLC unless lies and deception is an up front symptom. Believe me, he's not thinking that you're not intelligent enough to see through the smokescreens..he knows better. He's trying to convince HIMSELF of his lies. If it makes himself feel better to think you might fall for some of them, all the better, heh?

As I said before, resentment is totally normal and no one could go through this without feeling tons of it towards the WAS. We just have to be careful that resentment is not the driving force behind major decisions.

Setting boundaries is to protect yourself and your family. It is not the same as filing for divorce, which would be a major decision. That is the type of major decision that I suggested you would want to put resentment aside for.

Remember, right now, it is all about you and the kids...not your H. He's living in his own little reality right now, and he will be the one that loses out, has been losing out. You can't fix him, you can't change him. All you can do is protect yourself and your family and live your lives as fully as you can regardless of how he lives his.

He may agree to the boundaries, and he may not. I think you're probably going to have a lot of resistance from him in the beginning, but if it's the only way that you and the kids can live more normal, peaceful lives, it will have to be the 'way it is'. My only concern is that he is allowed time with the kids, according to their schedules and their needs. Regardless of how they must feel towards their dad, they still love him...they may not like him at all right now...but they still do love him, and vice versa. The kids may want to sit down with you and discuss what they need from their dad, and what they don't need, and something can be worked out between all of you.

My kids were older when their dad walked out. I didn't have to deal with alot of what you're dealing with. But to say they despised their dad and what he was doing would be an understatement. Now, 4 yrs later, they still don't have the respect they use to, they still remember the hurt, but they will make time for their dad on occasion. But the closeness of family is not there anymore. Ihope your H wakes up before the same happens to him. But that, again, is something only he can do anything about

[Sophie]

Creed,

Just checking in to let you know, well...I'm trying to channel resentment into something constructive or to learn something instead of just being...angry.

Thanks for reading my venting posts....you're saving my H from them...so far...lol...:)

We had a huge storm, some tornados and a huge oak tree broke about 6 feet from the base and squashed the house next door to my H's little brick house. It's about 20 ft from his...

The house the tree hit is vacant...must be God giving my H a little 'hint'....

My friend told me about the tree.

The boundaries I need...I don't know how to say them in a direct, firm but fair way.