Help Me Act AS IF, Part 5

[Grace_O]

lmg,

I hope you get more responses here. Ready for my take?
I have only done the proverbial 180's where I have seen it to be in my best interest. For example something I am/was doing needed to change. Did it need to change for H to stay/come home? There's the rub. In the beginning everything I did was with that as a focus. Did it work? Noooo. Now, I'm glad it didn't. I'm to the point (most days anyway) where I see things I need to do. Not so he comes home (and yes, ultimately I am hoping for the chance at a chance), but so that my life is back on track (um, that would be the track I want/need it to be on). As much as I miss him, I'm not ready for him to come home. If that were to happen now, well let's just say disaster is a word that comes to mind. Why? Because I'd go right back to walking on eggshells and trying to make him happy. I know this about me as sure as I know I'm breathing. I clearly have some work to do. Like all things in my life there are days when I'm stronger and days when I'm not. I need alot more of the stonger days before I'm ready to tackle anything we might do to be able to dream together again.

So, why are you doing the 180's? For you or for him? Are they real (as in permanent)? What kind of responses do you get? From the way you posed this post, I assume nothing.

It's a fine line to try different things and monitor the results vs doing it all to "get them back." DBing is really about us and our ability to come out of this as whole and better people. The alternative is to spen the rest of our lives destroyed and untrusting of any type of relationship.

What kind of 180's did you have in mind and what kind of outcome do you see?

Sorry about the length here.....I can digress.

[tmi]

I found making a list of 3-4 VERY small signs that would tell me things were moving in the right direction very helpful. Things like 'maintain eye contact for a few minutes' - things I probably wouldn't have noticed if I hadn't identified them beforehand.

It is likely that your H is aware that all of your efforts are geared towards keeping him at home, and this 'pressure' makes it difficult for him to move away from the spot he has chosen to stand, that leaving is his only choice. A 180 for you would be to at least seem to be moving towards the separation with enthusiasm, if you can pull that off. It may make you feel better too, if you can find a way to focus on the things that will be good if he leaves.

I was really quite excited about spending the time that my children were with my H getting involved in politics at some level (I've been a green lefty for as long as I can remember) and meeting people (men) that I have more in common with. My H and I don't see eye to eye in a lot of areas, although there are many points at which we do agree. I've been trying to tell myself that that would be true with anyone, that you would 'fit' at some points and not at others, they would just be different points, but I really struggle with how the differences between my H and myself affect my feelings about him.

A book you might find helpful is For Women Only, by Shaunti Feldhahn. I wish I had read it years ago. The author is quite religious and throws that in a lot, but I found I could ignore it and take only what I thought was valuable. That was also true of a book called Healing the Hurt in Your Marriage. Can't remember the authors, but it's a husband and wife.


As for the weekend, just ignore his mood, unless he's happy, in which case try to respond as long as it lasts and don't let it get to you when it stops. Pack for yourself and the girls, let him do his own thing. Make plans for activities with your children while you are there (will you have Internet access?) and have fun. You can politely tell your H what your plans are and indicate that he's welcome to join you; go on ahead with your plans cheerfully if he decides to stay behind. I agree with Grace - don't talk about it ahead of time. To him, it will still feel like a R talk.

Have a wonderful time!

[newnamenewlife]

I found making a list of 3-4 VERY small signs that would tell me things were moving in the right direction very helpful. Things like 'maintain eye contact for a few minutes' - things I probably wouldn't have noticed if I hadn't identified them beforehand.

The DB baby steps thing doesn't work for me. Isn't looking for signs looking to one's spouse for reassurance that things are getting better?

My H does things all the time that one could say are baby steps, but they're not. Recently he gave me a lovely compliment in front of some friends--it was about how beautiful I am. My friend later told me she was blown away by that and thought that was a sure sign he wasn't going to leave. Since then, he still sees only S in our future. So, for me personally, the baby step concept is confusing. However, making some goals for myself is something I should do more of.

Anyway, I know I'm a trouble maker and that I'm always challenging the advice I get here--sorry! No wonder my H finds me difficult, huh?

Ingrid, I am so glad that things are working out with you and your H, and Grace, that you are moving into your new life.

I, too, have to admit that having my kids elsewhere a few nights a week wouldn't be all bad! I just wish money wasn't an issue because it would sure be fun to travel and re-decorate and indulge in retail therapy of all kinds!

[Grace_O]

Isn't looking for signs looking to one's spouse for reassurance that things are getting better?

Right now you won't get reassurance from your spouse. This is where you have to evaluate the signs and get your validation internally. I know it's hard as most of us are not accustomed to an internal system. As far as baby steps go, perhaps you could just objectively (as possible) journal some of them. It's good to write the emotional stuff too, but try looking at him and your sitch through different eyes.

The compliment is a baby step, it just isn't what you want. You want giant steps not baby ones. That he says one thing and then another just shows confusion IMO and if he's confused.....the messages wil be, (that's right) confusing.

You mentioned goals for yourself. How about that, do you have some? What are they?

I am moving into a new life. It isn't easy and it isn't the life I ultimately want. It's just the one I have right now. I can either make the most of it and take the time (as other's here suggest) to be the woman I know I'm capable of being or pay a much steeper price than I have already paid. I'm not willing to do that.

If money is an issue (it is for me), be creative. We have a recycling place here (through the sanitation dept) where you can get paint for fee. Granted it's either a light beige or grey (they mix it all together), but if nothing else it makes great primer, so you spend less on the "color" paint that is the final coat. I also shop thrift stores and "Craigs list". I've even been known to barter.

Now, how about those goals?

[newnamenewlife]

Now, how about those goals?

I've been trying to think of some for this weekend. Trying to have no expectations would be a good idea, but it's so hard because I have so many memories of H and I at the house (in the country) over the years.

Fortunately, my D11's friend is joining us--a last minute decision. That will defuse the tension a bit--and keep D11 from watching out every move.

I'm open to goal suggestions, of course.

Never heard of paint recycling--that's a good idea.

[Grace_O]

Ever done any meditating? No time like the present to start. I use walking as a form of meditation too. Of course, I'm like the only one around that doesn't have something stuck in their ears. More time to think and that's not necessarily a bad thing.

[newnamenewlife]

I'm up at our (my) house in the Adirondacks this weekend, with H, Ds and one of D's friends. It is absolutely gorgeous here, as it always is. I've been coming up here since I was born and right now this house, this place feels like the one thing that has remained constant in my life.

H is more remote than ever. I feel like I am alone. He does anything to distract himself from my existence--looks for birds through his binoculars, reads, gardens. I feel very lonely. Yesterday I went for a walk alone and cried.

I have so many memories of H and I up here in happier times. Does he? Has he reduced everything to nothing but negatives?

Grace, meditation is a good idea. I have a CD of the Dalai Lama chanting which I listen to sometimes at bedtime. I seem to need something to focus my mind like that. Being up here is also very good for my soul. It's so beautiful and peaceful.

I have been pretty good at DBing and am hoping to keep it up. I've stopped myself from making snarky comments several times (for example, H asked me if I wanted an ice cube to make my white wine colder and I wanted to say "or you could just hold the glass next to your heart. That would chill it." But I didn't!)

I have agreed to go to the mediator with him next week, too, though it's killing me to think about that.

[mishka422]

Good for you on the stopping the snarky comments. Is your tongue bleeding yet? I know mine did.

It will get better. Enjoy the beauty of God's creation!

(((((lmg)))))

[SirPrizeMe]

Grace, I love the perspective you have on the 180s. The bomb can be a wake-up-call - what would you like to change about YOU? More patience. Less laziness. More fun. Less procrastination. Whatever it is.

LMG, you asked me earlier - would I really prefer to be in limbo-land? YES. Certainly, as opposed to the open hostility I currently face. On the other hand, everything happens for a reason, eh? I like the way Grace said it -
I am moving into a new life. It isn't easy and it isn't the life I ultimately want. It's just the one I have right now. All I can do is Make the best of it. One day at a time.

LMG, I am soooo encouraged by his compliment to you in front of the other people. That is hopeful. That is a really nice step. Really nice.

[newnamenewlife]

LMG, I am soooo encouraged by his compliment to you in front of the other people. That is hopeful. That is a really nice step. Really nice.

I'm glad you're encouraged. It was a fluke, though, and if I asked H about it (which I won't) he'd say he does think I'm beautiful (and sexy and smart and funny) but that doesn't mean he has the right feelings to stay in our M.

Tonight was bad. We came home from the weekend. I went upstairs to put D7 to bed and I heard D11 crying downstairs with H and when I came down to get him to say goodnight to D7, D11 was sitting in his lap. H passed me on the stairs and said "D11 needs you."

So I sat next to her on the couch and she blurted out: "Are you and daddy getting separated?"
I was caught totally off guard and stupidly said "No, what makes you think that?"
She said : "I just think it sometimes."
I figured H and she must have had a talk while I was upstairs and that's why he said she needed me.
So she went back to reading and then she went off to bed and I went and talked with H. I asked him what they were talking about and told him what she'd asked me. He said they didn't talk about that at all, it was something else unrelated.

ARGH. So now I've lied and said no, we're not getting S. I didn't mean to. I was caught off-guard at 9pm on a school night--what was I supposed to say?

Then I got angry at H and asked him when he was planning to talk with her/them. He said he was waiting until he had something to tell them. He has not even started looking for an apt. I again said he could move to his parents' house anytime (only 12 miles away) and he said again that it wouldn't be convenient for seeing the girls.

And then I got madder and said "Too bad. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. You don't get to live in this house and avoid me and refuse to go out with me or watch a movie with me or act like my H."

He said "I'm trying to do it in a way that's convenient for you. You said I should stay until October." (I didn't say that, the child psychologist I spoke to recommended it if possible.)

I said "it's never going to be convenient for me. It's not fair to keep D11 in suspense like this when she clearly knows something's going on."

Then he sort of half-heartedly said "I guess I'll look for a place."

I said: "Why do you want to live apart from your kids?"
He said "I don't want to live apart from them."

So I've now done exactly what I wanted to avoid doing, which is essentially give him an ultimatum. But the pressure of living like this, especially when D11 knows yet we keep putting her off, is getting unbearable.

This is what I didn't want to do though. He is clearly stalling and I am pushing him to leave. I am just really getting so stressed out. I can handle the DBing most of the time (did it all weekend) but my D11 has made so many comments, and now asked me directly and it just seems totally unfair to her to make her wonder why she thinks something is up and not verify that she's RIGHT. I refuse to be the one to deliver the bad news, though. H must do that. But he is so passive and non-confrontational that I can't picture it happening.

WAH! I HATE THIS!