Thanks smurf, your probably right, about the sitch with your daughter and thats why shes been squeezed out, my son wouldn't have anything to do with ex's ow, wouldn't spend time with her and his dad wouldn't spend time with son without her, bulls clashing horns I suppose, then when ex was getting married he more or less was forcing son to don on a suit and attend, son wasn't having any, so in a way I suppose it is the fact that son hasn't and won't accept that the ow stole his father from him and that he would sooner be with her than him, son actually says that and he also says, dad wanted a kid and it hasn't taken him long to get fed up of it, poor babes, he is nearly 14 years old and more grown up than his father.