I also wanted to add, please consider filing for you so you can move on with your life. It really doesn't matter that W is eating cake - that is her life - and she is now irrelevant by virtue of her actions. All that is relevant is how this is impacting you and your kids.
Like Chris said - it will be tough in the short term but a good thing in the long term. Your M is like a cancer right now that is slowly eating away at you. The D is the chemo you need to get rid of the cancer. In the short term, the chemo will make you sick. In the long term - it will kill the cancer.
I know this isn't easy on you. And in my case, I didn't have kids so it was easier b/c I could sever all ties. Good luck with this... It takes a lot of mental energy to take those steps towards dismantling your M - and the M infrastructure... And the financial part really does hit hard. By paying her 1/2 the assets and the alimony, you are essentially paying W to go away. You will need your yoga and other outlets for stress to have the endurance to be able to do this in a constructive manner.
BTW: I am not sure how the law views this- you probably have to consult a D attorney - but I would shovel money into 529 college accounts and whatever accounts you can open in the kid's name - to minimize assets available for the 50/50 split before filing for D. I would also set non-college money up in a trust with restrictions on what the kids can withdraw and when. Any life insurance should be structured to the extent possible to benefit the kids. And I don't know if this is possible - I would try to condition payment of alimony on her not sharing an address with a single non-blood relative male. So if she lives together with someone, she isn't double dipping into two male wallets.
OK, I get the main point, which is that I will just have to accept the fact that W is not going to deal with this in any kind of fair, adult way. Perhaps that was the whole problem with our M, somehow that I was responsible for making everything better, no matter how much the problem was between her ears.
Some specific, really good points:
Originally Posted By: qoe100
Exactly what are the consequences of the bad choices she has made?
Only obvious consequence has been the separation of finances. Her income being much smaller, but 100% disposable. Obviously, she did not get the luxury SUV for her 40th b'day, but she did not know I was planning that, so it does not really count.
Originally Posted By: qoe100
I know this site is to "save" marriages but you've made it very clear that you have no intention of doing so.
From my point of view, DBing is about saving individuals who have lost themselves in their M. Sometimes this also saves, or rebuilds, a M. In my case, I DBed my butt off with W then finding that she had it really good, me not pursuing, still paying for everything, not asking her whereabouts, etc. That was when I realized that I had no desire to be with a person who will not only cheat on me, but also with a married man and have absolutely no qualms about putting me and the kids through all of this cr@p!
Originally Posted By: qoe100
She's like your teenage child.
Funny, that is just how I think of her.
Originally Posted By: qoe100
Do you think Yoga will get you through the next 10 yrs or so while she continues what she's doing?
It, and the Buddhist philosophy of life, will get me through much, much worse than this. However, that is not the point at all, but rather what is the right thing to do here, esp. regarding the kids.
AG, I agree with the three choices, and really would like it to be saving the marriage, but I don't see a way for that to happen.
Originally Posted By: AG II
Is it possible that you yourself are using a fear of W's reaction to you filing for a D as an excuse for not proceeding with a D yourself? In other words, would you, like W, prefer to essentially have an open M - where your share a home, finances but are free to be involved in R's with other people?
It is not a fear of her reaction, but rather of her ACTIONS that scare me. But yes, my desire to keep this amicable has hindered any progress since she made it clear in Dec. that she would go ugly if I started procedings and refused to go to mediation when I asked her to go.
As far as an open M, I am totally uninterested in this. I am not going to start dating until we file and to be honest am not interested in anyone who would date a married man, so that makes it tough. I have also thought about some sort of "transitional phase" where we get a D, but I agree to stay in the house for some time to ease the sitch financially and on the kids? Not sure if that is even an option, but could be explored.
Originally Posted By: AG II
Is it possible that you are reacting more to your own fear of confrontation and using W's behavior as an excuse to do nothing?
It is not a general fear of confrontation, but rather the fact that she seems to be willing to go to any extreme to avoid being "wrong". Every conversation we have ends with her saying some veriation of "you can't make me..." I think the only control she has in life is saying no to whatever I propose. Thus the unilateral actions on my part regarding finances.
Originally Posted By: AG II
The division of assets is tough during a D. I was the primary wage earner and paid a hefty sum to make The X go away. You will probably have to pay alimony and owe a chunk of change in child custody every month. You will go through a drop in standard of living yourself if/when you file for D. It sucks - but that is how it is...
I got over this a long time ago. Not an easy thing when you realize that there are no legal consequences of breach of contract within the context of FL marriage law! I am used to dealing with corporate law where such an egregious breach of contract (marriage vows in this case) would result in financial ruin for the offending party. Boy did I get a surprise when I went to the lawyer! Made me want to move to Louisiana where they have never heard of no-fault divorce!
I am taking as many financial steps as I can, but we don't really have many assets other than retirement funds and the house. W always managed to spend all I could earn. Funny, now that I am paying the bills, there is always a lot left at the end of the month. Great idea to fund up the college plans with that money. I have just been saving it in the bank acct. up to now.
Originally Posted By: fig
Do not stay in a relationship for your kids...they should never have to feel that responsibility like they are the only reason you are together. it's as bad as living your life through them.
Ouch! I will definitely keep this in mind as I decide how to move forward.
Originally Posted By: PhD_ChrisD
If you want her out (we all know you do), you have to move forward on it. She obviously is not going to do this. Yes, it will be hard on the kids in the short-term, but better on them in the long run.
Unfortunately, it is likely that I will be throwing myself out!
L2, thanks for the hugs, look forward to your next update.
AG, not sure about the cancer analogy. One thing is for sure, I am a much stronger person with a much better feel for who I am than before the bomb. In many ways, this has already been the best thing that ever happened to me. I definitely appreciate my blessings much more than I did before this sitch. I also am in great physical shape and really enjoying doing stuff with the kids now that I don't have to try to make W happy at the same time! Just need to find my Path with Heart out of here. Your posts definitely will help with that.
TTFN! SD.
Me 41 W 41 Kids: S9 S7 Married 16 years Bomb dropped 2/2/07 Still living together! current thread
It is not a fear of her reaction, but rather of her ACTIONS that scare me. But yes, my desire to keep this amicable has hindered any progress since she made it clear in Dec. that she would go ugly if I started procedings and refused to go to mediation when I asked her to go.
This says a lot!!! My take is that she will make it ugly no matter what you do or when you do it. She is holding you hostage by making this threat. And....you're falling for it.
SD, the ball is in your court. Even if you haven't figured it out, the rest of us know that she will do nothing because you're making her life pretty darn good in spite of her behavior. And, yes, you say that you've lessened her spending money, yet, when she has a hissy fit, you relent and give her what she wants.
Soooooo, what's your next step? I guess if she really were your teenage D, you could ground her, cut off her allowance, take away her car, etc. As your nonworking, demanding, unfaithful, free spending W, what are your options to move this along rather than waiting for her to "see the light" and move on of her own accord?
Just remember Eastern philosophy is not a mechanism for escaping your duty. It is a way of life. Yoga and meditation are designed to calm your mind of external angst so that you are able to face your fears and/or exercise good judgement. Do not use it as a means for escaping reality to create an illusion that allows to avoid making a decision.
Your highest priority is to define your duty to your kids. Not just so that they are spared pain today - but so that they have the proper upbringing to make the right decisions tomorrow.
Once you define your duty. Then use meditation and yoga to enable you to perform that duty.
Your highest priority is to define your duty to your kids. Not just so that they are spared pain today - but so that they have the proper upbringing to make the right decisions tomorrow.
Once you define your duty. Then use meditation and yoga to enable you to perform that duty.
In this case, I think this also helps to define my Path with Heart. I have been in a state of paralysis since I found out how unfair the legal situation is. Of course, I understand that this is a knife that cuts both ways and if I were the one cheating on my SAHM W, then the legal structure would probably be in the best interests of the kids! Just don't understand why breaking your vows in such a open and unabashed way is not even considered by the law!
In any case, my Path with Heart has to be the path that puts the kids in the best possible sitch and preserves (or restores) my dignity. It is also important that they learn that it is not OK to treat others like dirt, to abandon your promises, to be a self-centered %#!&$# AND that you don't have to take it like a door mat. I like your idea AG about converting as many assets into trust/education funds. This accomplishes the primary goal of looking out for the kids and also assures that W does not have the ability to squander these hard earned assets. This won't be particularly easy since house equity and retirements funds are not so easy to convert, but obviously cash and other liquifiable assets can easily be converted. Brilliant, can't believe I did not think of it. I guess it's time to get back to the lawyer and start on this right away.
Funny, but I feel much better having a goal on this front again. My last one did not seem to work out very well"
Originally Posted By: SD's Goal
5. Bring this chapter of my life to a close by... a. W to accept D is the right thing to do by March. b. Get into D mediation by end of spring. c. W financially independent by August.
Not even sure if a. and b. are in the kids best interest until I can get the financial sitch in order. c. would be oh so nice for me, but obviously an inconvience to her lifestyle!
Thanks again, SD
Me 41 W 41 Kids: S9 S7 Married 16 years Bomb dropped 2/2/07 Still living together! current thread
Leaving goals that are out of your ocntrol off the list is a good idea. You have no control over W and her action - only your own.
And W has really made one mistake that has dominoed into much more - right? She is having an affair. I don't want to diminish the nature or impact of her mistake on you and your kids. BUT she is also your children's mother - the only mother they will ever have. Had you not met her - you would not have your boys. And you posted that she is a good mother.
Remember that as you go through the D process. Remember that you are not the judge, jury and executioner. If your kids see you exercise compassion while taking care of you - that will be valuable lesson for them.
Focus on taking care of you and your kids. As for W - over time you will care less and less about whether W is benefitting or not.
It's one of those early morning/can't sleep days for me...so I thought I'd try to be a little productive!
Quote:
In any case, my Path with Heart has to be the path that puts the kids in the best possible sitch and preserves (or restores) my dignity. It is also important that they learn that it is not OK to treat others like dirt, to abandon your promises, to be a self-centered %#!&$# AND that you don't have to take it like a door mat.
I agree...and it would be nice if our WAS could see/grasp this as well. BUt clearly, in both our sitches, they don't, and as I am FINALLY starting to understand (in my own, all-too-brief moments of clarity), we are wasting precious time and energy when we feel like we have any control over that.
As you wisely said to me, our own actions and behaviors can influence the future of how our WAS react; but that's so different than being able to deliberately influence them.
If your goal really is to move forward with a D, then maybe the time has come to investigate your options more fully. I know you've said W threatened to make things 'ugly'; but aren't they getting uglier anyway?
One of the rationales for staying together 'for the kids' (which I would contend isn't always the wrong choice) would be that the family unit functions well together...I don't get the feeling that that's the case here. Is it more that you operate in two almost totally separate spheres, with only tangential interaction as it relates to your boys? Not much 'here's the SD family all together out for dinner/a movie outing/a ballgame/a trip'...maybe this is a distinction without a difference (although it's been one of my guiding principles/justifications for hanging in there for so long...) but without that part, I wonder how that does impact your kids, and what they see/feel.
I guess what I mean is you are seeming less and less sanguine with your current path (much as am I); so maybe it's time to give a look to that slightly rougher, more rocky path around the bend.
I'm rambling now...maybe I can get a little more sleep before my alarm goes off...
I'm thinking of you SD; I know how much you want to make good choices...you are a good man, full of heart and dignity.
Donna, Thanks for the advice. I started looking into this a bit today, but I don't think there will be quick solutions! That's OK I've got time because "she ain't goin' nowhere, she's just leavin'" to quote a classic Texas song. Funny, but I am at peace with the concept that my marriage is over...just not with the fact that it isn't officially! Odd that.
AG, Yeah, that was my goal from Dec. regarding the sitch. I gave up on trying this goal as it was too controlling and other focussed. Just never replaced it with a new goal. Need to define the new one much better than I have so far!
Originally Posted By: AG II
And W has really made one mistake that has dominoed into much more - right?
It is not the A that bothers me nearly as much as the fact that she thinks I owe her this lifestyle. If she were pursuing a life independent of me in all aspects, including pursuing other men, I would be more patient about the time that it might take to build this life. It is the fact that she has only used the time I have given her to pursue her desires and not to establish this independent life that is the real problem.
BTW, I did not say she is a good mother, just that she does love the kids and she IS there mother and they love her. This is subtly, but critically different.
L2, Thanks for the pep talk! I don't know why I am so focussed on the negative right now, just the way it is.
Originally Posted By: L21959
I don't get the feeling that that's the case here. Is it more that you operate in two almost totally separate spheres, with only tangential interaction as it relates to your boys?
That's it. We generally eat about 3 meals per week as a family. I probably talk to her about 3 min. per day, all relating to kids and/or her complaining about something she wants from me.
I have lost all respect for her and consequently have no desire to be in her presence other than to deal as I have to. There are also rare "small talk" conversations that pop up when we are in the same room, but more force of habit than anything else.
She has stopped asking to join in when I do things with the kids and I don't extend an invitation, so she hasn't been coming with us. I also have not accepted the few offers she has lately made for me to join her in activities.
I do feel compassion for her and don't want to hurt her, just want to have my life for myself again and not be part of her issues, whatever they may be (depression, low self-esteem, ???).
Thanks again, SD
Me 41 W 41 Kids: S9 S7 Married 16 years Bomb dropped 2/2/07 Still living together! current thread
