Cake eating or progress?

[minkerman]

All of the above is why, after having an awesome weekend away with W, I am pulling back myself. I am watching her very closely, and I see the 'usual' pattern after we have positive interaction: Her going a bit quiet and not initiating any contact.

I acted 'as if we were a couple' during the weekend, but now I am 'acting as if we are apart'.

Monitor results, change if required.

I will just let her be for now and see what happens.

[Dom R]

I was wondering the same thing as Trixi. Whether its emotional connection or just a connection in general, the acting 'as if' seems to be counterintuitive. Why does this make the spouse want to come back, whether the case is that they are with someone else or if they are just not fully engaged in the marriage?

Errr... Sounds like both you and trixi, are maybe having confusion, by letting the "..." in "act as if..." be undefined.

"act as if.." what?

Where does it say in DB or DR, "act as if your marriage is going to be fine?"

it doesnt.

What it DOES say, is (paraphrased a little)

"If you are heading for [a confrontation/discussion/whatever....] (or even just "coming home"!), and there are two or more possible outcomes, one of which is 'your spouse will be nice to you', and the other is, 'your spouse will react nastily'... act as if your spouse will be nice to you, rather than expecting a negative experience.".

The concept being that if you approach a situation with negative energy, you'll get negative back, and it's a self-fulfilling negative prophesy.



This has nothing whatsoever to do with, "My spouse has asked ME for something... should I try to meet their needs" ?!!

OR even
"I should pretend like everything's going to be fine in our marriage, and we're going to be reconciled no matter what".

The latter, is NOT what DB suggests you should do.

[minkerman]

EXACTLY!

That is why I am doing what I mentioned, 2 posts back.

I know that if I 'act as if everything is OK', she will react poorly, feeling smothered and pressured. She has told me this more than once!

[hopeforfuture]

I was wondering the same thing as Trixi. Whether its emotional connection or just a connection in general, the acting 'as if' seems to be counterintuitive. Why does this make the spouse want to come back, whether the case is that they are with someone else or if they are just not fully engaged in the marriage?

Errr... Sounds like both you and trixi, are maybe having confusion, by letting the "..." in "act as if..." be undefined.

"act as if.." what?

DomR,
Okay, I hear you on the 'As if'. I knew that, just getting things confused. I think I was actually had detaching in mind. How does detaching work when what is lacking is an emotional connection?

[Trixi]

Yeah, I see what you all are saying about acting as if the spouse to be nice in a particular situation so that you don't inadvertently start a downward spin by *ass*uming negative things.

Maybe my question is this:
If a WAS says they want to feel emotionally connected, *how* do you do that when you are keeping your feelings in check in order to not pressure them? For instance-MinkerMan was a pissed that his wife got a transit pass and talked about renting for April AND May. If he was being "open and honest" in order to be "emotionally connected" he would have told his wife as much. But, he didn't tell her. He has begun to "act as if" they are apart since she is backing off. {Sorry to talk about you like you aren't here MM }

How do you emotionally connect/be intimate with someone when it's not safe (wise, prudent, smart) to truly open up to them?
edited to add that hopeforfuture has a good question too about detaching. If I am supposed to 'detach' (so as not to pressure) how do I connect?

[Dom R]

I'd say, depends what they actually MEAN, when they say they want to feel "emotionally connected".

I can think of a coupla different meanings to that phrase. One of which means "you open up and disclose your feelings to him", and one does not at all.


I'm not sure that you really understand what he means.
(I'm not sure that HE really understands what he means either but maybe you need to start by at least asking him to give you more explaination on what he means by that phrase)

for example, what he could really mean is, "ILYBINILWY".
In which case, you "opening up your feelings to him", probably wont accomplish what he's looking for. Because really, it's all about HIS feelings, not about your feelings.

(gee, what else is new )

[Trixi]

Wow Dom-
That makes total sense
Thanks!

[minkerman]

Any news,Trixi??

[Trixi]

Well- I have returned from Costa Rica.

Fan-flipping-tastic trip! I would love to go back at some point and *not* do the whirlwind tour thing. That was exhausting, but a great way to see the whole country for $1000. Highly recommend taking the tour we took- totally worth the price; we must have saved at least $1000/person. Now we have a better idea of where we would like to go for extended periods of time.

We were there for 12 days- ML every day for 15 days in a row, often 2 or 3 times a day.

Highlights-
-on the way to the airport (and a few other times during the trip) he said he loved me more than anyone else in the whole world

-other people on the tour thought we were newlyweds (because of our obvious affection for eachother) and at the end of the trip, one lady came up and said we were an inspiration to her on what was possible in a relationship while she got tears in her eyes. (obviously, we didn't tell anyone we live seperately)

-we only got in one fight, which did get resolved fairly easily

-we ziplined, whitewater rafted, atv'd, and did TONS of other stuff. I almost chickened out on the ziplining (which according to H would have *dramatically* negatively affected our trip) but I did it and he was proud. I did lots of things new to me (that would have scared me) and he liked that a lot

-he gave me so many compliments; many on things I am/was insecure about. This morning as he caressed my tummy, he said "if you got a tummy tuck, would all the stretch marks be gone?" and I explained that some are just too high, so no they wouldn't and he said (drumroll please) "good, because I like them. I know it sounds weird but I do." and he kissed them. Also, I don't have perfectly straight teeth and there is one tooth that can occassionally sort of pokes out of my lips, I guess. We were ML and he started poking at my lip to try to get this tooth to show. (Odd to me.) So he tells me how cute he think it is when it shows and I said "oh. so I guess I shouldn't get braces like I was considering" and he says "OMG-no!! that's [one of the best parts]" My saggy breasts he said were "the most beautiful boobs in the world". !!!

-he said I must have cast some sort of spell on him because he can't get away.

-said that he cries about 'us' sometimes. That recently when we have been doing all these fun things, he cries and wonders why we couldn't do these things when we were 'together'. I said we could do these things going forward and that I was 'sick' from my thyroid. Obviously, I wasn't perfect, and I probably could have tried harder in some areas, but I was ill.

-he's afraid that I'll go back to being a lump on a log. (my response was same as above.) [I just want to throttle him!! he doesn't "get" that the thyroid messes a person up!!UGH!!!!]

-he wants us to take Spanish lesson together

-if we do well with Spanish, he'll take me to Spain

-he said he wants us to spend more time together

-there were several ILYs and lots of ILYs in Spanish during the trip

So, that's all good. There were several pics that were taken of us and me that he thinks are "so cute". On in particular with a blue morpho butterfly being held next to my face. That one is "very special" to him. (the signifigance of this is that he is not one to "gush" about me being cute in a picture.)

The bummer is that once we got home we had a brief R talk. He likes how things are going BUT. There are some things he really likes about being single. (can't tell me what exactly..maybe just being able to do what he wants, when he wants.) He is still taking things day by day. Likes what he sees, but doesn't know where we are headed. His tone of voice was not very assuring.*sigh*

We have lived apart now, for 9 months. People, I am getting impatient. I know I am making headway. really, I do. but as time marches on, I wonder how we will unravel this separation.

Hey Minker, I caught up on your thread- what a roller coaster!! You are inspirational!! As I read your thread, I wondered if I am going to get a surprise "I am 100% done" speech, since it seems like everything is going so well between H and I.

Also, I am getting a little "polluted" in my head with thoughts like "even if we did reconcile, how would I know he isn't going to bail again?"

Tonight will be the first night in 15 days that we won't be in the same bed. I got spoiled. I just hope he'll miss me tonight.

[minkerman]

Wow! What a whirlwind adventure indeed!

So, he "likes being single". So did I, and so did my wife. But she asked me a couple of days ago if I was going to miss having my freedom. I told her, no, because I haven't really lost it. We are both pretty much able to do what we want in our fresh new relationship, but we choose to do most of it together.

I would say, let him digest the previous 15 days, and put NO pressure on him at all. He may come to the conclusion that he would like to give things another try.

Even though I had no real inclination of it at the time, my wife said our 3-day trip to Seattle was a turning point. It was 2 weeks later that she asked to come home.