Ouch! Nasty dream, Aud! Not sure how you can be more 'safe' for your H to open up. Some men never really learn to discuss their feelings with anyone, not even their wives (my H sure doesn't ... he will discuss facts and events about work and trips, but rarely our R or anything about his feelings except maybe he was frustrated or angry, or it was a good day, etc.). Try not to take it personally, and if he ever does speak about something effecting him (work issues, or whatever), be open, and interested, and let him talk without giving your opinion, just validate (and give him cues, such as, "so, what happened then?"), and then, much later, give him a 'gift' (nothing obvious), for example, his favourite dinner, or extra hugs.
You've probably done all this, but it bears repeating (for all of us on the piecing road), doesn't it?
Me:57 H:52 M:28 Got another lawyer last year and filed. D35,S/D twins28,D22 EA4/04 End? Who knows? "Life is like a mirror. Smile at it and it smiles back at you." — Peace Pilgrim
I think you're right that a lot of the emotional intimacy issue is a product of our gender and personality differences. And at some point, we can choose to make peace with it and appreciate the good things we enjoy or keep fighting it and be miserable.
For the most part I've made peace with it. The broken trust of the past does make it difficult to leave it alone and not worry about recurrences, but so far, we seem to be on solid ground. And for that I'm grateful.
I will work on being more aware of being open and available for him when he is ready to talk, and to follow through with some extra-special gestures afterward.
Sorry for being out of the loop, but things have been out of control here. BeingMe has it right, do the positive things that re-enforce the good actions H makes. Stick with what works.
I've been feeling unsettled the past couple of days. Nothing has changed really between H and I, I've just been feeling a little bit of sadness that things aren't exactly as I'd like them to be. I'm trying to keep myself focused on gratitude that things are much better than they were, and off the disappointment that we don't have the deep abiding love and respect and intimacy that I crave...that we're not exactly on the same page.
I think I'd be doing much better today if we hadn't watched a big fat tear-jerker love story movie last night. Need to stay away from those.
Aud, First of all, no more mushy love movies. I try to stay away from those myeslf. Remember, those movies usually depict a couple at the early stages of their R -- all in love and goo goo eyed. I'd like to see that same couple 10 to 20 years in, with kids, a house, a mortgage, other temptations, etc... Anyway, stay away from mushy love movies.
I know the feeling of just being "unsettled". I still go through that. It sort of comes out of nowhere and many times, I don't even know what triggers it. No relationship is perfect. No partner will be the perfect partner. Rather than focusing on what you don't have wiht your H, focus on what you do.
I'll give you an example. A friend of mine was telling me about some problems she's having with her H. He is a really anxious guy. He is struggling with stuff lately. Anyway, he did something crappy the other night. It didn't involve another person or anything, but it was bad enough -- an old pattern returned - that my fried threatened to leave him. Anyway, the next day, he was filled with utter remorse, promising to get help, do whatever it takes, etc... All I was thinking was that when my H was going back and forth with OW, his remorse was minimal. It was there, and I knew he was hurting, but I really would have liked to see more desperation from him to keep me.
Anyway, I was thinking about that when she was talking to me. I was thinking, "i wish my H was filled with as much fear of losing me and regret and remorse". But then I remembered that her H is the same guy who is pressuring her BIG TIME about going back to work full time -- something she is just emotionally ready to do. When she's home with her D, he makes comments like, "it must be nice". Then I thought of my H... he not only doesn't pressure me about going back to work full time, he completely supports my schedule because he sees how much happier I am. I never feel ANY pressure from him -- really about anything. My friend's H pressures her all the time about stuff.
My point in this long example is that with different personality types come differnt "goods" and "bads". You've got to not only accept both sides, but try to focus more on the "goods".
Movies always depict these guys who are hopeless romantics, yet real guys' guys. You know... the perfect man. Totally in love with his leading lady, great looking, funny, successful... just all around awesome and without flaws. Doesnt' exist my friend.
Chin up. You are doing great.
Married 9 years Kids 5 and 6 Bomb 2006 H back and forth for a year M now back on track
Hi, Hope you don't mind me butting in. PS, know what you mean, and what Aud means. I crave the intimacy, closeness, that still isnt' there,and I secretly want my W to show more (some real?) remorse. I stll can't believe she did what she did. But, I know I can't know what she thinks or feels. Personally, I think the pain and remorse is so big, that she (and maybe your H) can't admit to it. There is always the threat in there mind that what they did is so horrible you will never forgive them, or worse, they just aren't worthy of your love. I try not to dwell on hoping my W shows more remorse. Hell, she came back and faced the music. How much more can I ask.
I've been struggling like Aud with the intimacy and closeness not being there, like I'd like it to be. I found some energy and started reading again. I finally got Men are from Mars, women are from Venus. Good book. I'm planning on re-reading some of the other books (DB, Fighting for your Marriage),and, I got Passionate Marriage, by David Schnarch. This book is really opening my eyes. The others are good, and have important insights, but this one talks about what I'm most concerned with, the intimacy and passion and love.
Have you read it? What do you think of it?
It kind of corresponds to GAL, and detaching, but puts it together in a way that makes sense when you try to take two individuals and bring them together in a relationship. Detaching is so important, but I never understood how it could be good to detach from the one person you want to be closest too. This book has an answer.
I sound like an ad. Sorry. I tend to get that way when I hear new ideas. I'm only half way through the book, but I think it's a fresh idea that will be helpful to me, and maybe you all.
There are men who crave that closeness and intimacy as much as you women (and no, it's not Just about sex (although, for me at least, that is important)).
Well Aud, I said I'd find your thread and do some reading. Now I'm going up to the top of this thread and see more details.
OH! Happy Mothers day (or is it Mother's day?)
M45, W45,S15, D10, Bomb 10/3/06, Moved back in 11/6/06, finally ILY 9/07 last thread
Peaceful--Thanks for your insight. I nodded my head through your entire post, because I say many of the same things to myself all the time... I generally try to keep focusing on what I do have, remember that no R is perfect (even those that look that way at church on Sunday), take care of myself, fight off the fear of reccurance, and give as much as I can to my M while having faith that someday it will all work out in the end.
Deauxlie--thanks for dropping by with warm wishes. I hope you had a nice Mother's Day too.
Login--Please, butt in anytime! Additional perspective is always welcome in my neck of the woods. I always appreciate validation that I'm not the only person to feel this way.
I think that it's important to enjoy the fact that things are much better than they were, and to be grateful for the improvement...but after the turmoil of the past several years, the last place I want to be is in a position to go through it all again. And I believe that closeness and intimacy are part of the prevention as well as an ultimate goal. I think I'm doing my part in working towards that. Him? Honestly, I do see him making big effort to show me he loves me...lots of acts of service and touching, which I believe are the love languages he speaks with (not 100% sure if they're the ones he hears with). Why am I not sure? Because he doesn't share as much verbally as I do. I don't know what he's really thinking or feeling at any given time. I think this disconnect is mostly related to differences in gender and personality. But it does leave me with some uncertainty, because he has demonstrated in past actions a great ability to manipulate and deceive.
As for the remorse, he has apologized to me more than once, and it's funny how something so longed for can be so easily minimized in my head when it's received. (I try to not forget that.)
For me the rub comes in the continuation of some "small" habits that I believe contributed significantly to the entire betrayal. If he can't/won't change those, what are the odds it can happen again? I might feel more secure about this if we were connected on a deeper level, but I have what I have, and it's a fine line to walk between gratitude/patience and dissatisfaction/smothering.
I purchased the PM book a while ago, but have not had a chance to sit down and read it yet. I'll try to find some time to go through it and let you know what I think.
Just (((Hugs))) today. I don't have any real great ideas on the commitment and change issue that you face. It is amazing how some people really struggle with true repentance. I think that's why so many people opt out for D, they can't do the real hard work.
