You Can Lead A Horse To Water...

[hopefloats7]

This might be the last thread I have here.

I debated on posting about this, but I felt I wanted to come full circle since I have been posting here for over two years.

I saw H about 2 weeks ago. He came up to get puppy and take him back to where he lives, about 5 hours away. It was a rough day.

He looks good. Great. He has a nice, new SUV, was dressed casually but put together, at a healthy weight, happy, smiling, no depression anywhere on his face or in his eyes. He looks like the old H before he got sick with this mind-warping disease.

He cordially hugged me as he came in. Puppy jumped all over him and H was so happy to see him. I know they have missed each other. He sat down and we started to talk; he asked about my job, my family, small talk stuff. He began to talk about work and some of the more heroic calls he's had of late. While talking, his cell beeped two different times, and as much as I didn't want to point it out, I eventually said if he needed to get that, he should. He said, "No. It's ok. I'm having a conversation with you." Well, let me point out that my gut told me it was his new girlfriend trying to get ahold of him and so I again said maybe he should pick up. To which he said, "Well, this might be important." and he called her back, right in front of me. I sat there like a Stepford wife and didn't move as he had a conversation with this woman. I heard her pick up, "Hey, how's it goin'?" and could hear her voice. She is not the original ow that my H had an affair with, that much I am sure of. Anyway, he asked her a few general questions, laughed about puppy with her and said he needed to "wrap this up and he'd call on the drive back."

I sat very still, and then told him calmly that he needed to go. He was all, "Why? What's the problem?" with me. I told him it was obvious that this woman had a problem with where he was, he'd only been at my apartment for 20 min. and his cell had beeped twice. He assured me that it had nothing to do with where he was and that it was actually an important call; he'd asked her to call him about something.

Naturally, this opened the can of worms I didn't want to open, and we began talking about all of this. To sum up the particulars, yes, he's in a new relationship with this woman; she is divorced, no kids, and his family is aware of her. He has not told her what happened to our marriage, what he did. He says he takes full blame but explains that he worked too much and he messed things up with me. Is not telling your new gf that you had an affair on your wife lying?

He wants to move on. He said he spent all of last year punishing himself for what he had done, and he had given things a ton of thought about working this out with me, but in the end, he just couldn't do it. He said it was totally unhealthy, and I didn't even know if I would be able to get past it. I told him I was never given the chance. He said I was much better off without him; I deserve someone better than him. I told him if he really felt so low about himself, I didn't think he'd be out dating another woman. He had no answer.

He will always have feelings for me and he does miss things about us, but he believes in reality (his words) and he's moving on. There's no way to work it out. He said he cannot move in with me just to make ME happy.

We took puppy for a walk together and I was very aware that this would probably be the last time we would ever look like a couple to the outside world. Someone stopped us to say how cute our dog was. I'm sure that man had no idea what was really going on with us.

He has his new home, which he is busy working on. He still overworks himself between his two jobs. And now he has a new relationship. He said he just wants to have a normal relationship with someone. In talking about the divorce, there are financial reasons why right now it is better to remain legally separated, but it has nothing to do with him being unsure about our situation. I know he would have filed now if that weren't the case.

He didn't stay more than 2 hours. When he left, of course I was crying saying goodbye to puppy. I asked H what he wanted to do; how were we really leaving this? He looked at me on his way out, quickly hugged me a little and said, "I just can't. I'm sorry." They left.

He called me 10 min. later to ask me if I was all right. I said no. He said, "I'm sure you're not." He wanted to bring puppy back, and I said no; that I understood last year that this was the arrangement, etc. He told me that I could see puppy anytime I wanted; he would bring him back for visits.

Deep inside I know that isn't good for me. To see puppy means to see H. And it is like pressing a reset button inside my soul everytime I have to interact with him.

I have since emailed him a long letter about my feelings. He got it but never wrote back at all. It is very hard to see him so put together now, moving on, straightening out his life, but not wanting to include me in it ever again.

I tried; I really did.

[angelica]

Dear Hope, my heart goes out to you. You did try. Sorry sweetie but this man is NOT OK. Not your problem, but until he actually faces up to what he has done he wil always live an emotional 'half life'. No consolation to you, because you are a wonderful, loving and courageous woman, who deserves much better.

For what it is worth, he is trying IMO to recreate what he had with you, and at some point it will all come crashing down him, but for now you have the pain of day to day living.

I am so sorry. Hugs, A

[Jack_Three_Beans]

Hope,

You're still trying.

Whatever you decide, you have not failed. You're an amazing bright, smart caring woman that any man should be grateful to have in their life.

He is a coward. He is afraid of the past.

Sometimes cowards find their backbones. And you want that, you deserve better than a coward.

[hopefloats7]

Thank you. You made me cry, but in a nice way.

Angelica,
He looks and acts just great. And I do hear what he's saying, which is basically how sorry he is, he made a mistake and has regrets, but he cannot undo this and erase it from happening, so there is no fixing it. It isn't that I agree; it's that some people do feel this is the bottom line. He moved literally 5 min. from where we had our house. That hurts. He's back in the neighborhood and now making new memories with this new gf. And you know what? He seemed pretty happy about it when he was here. He smiles now.

Jack, you are exactly right. He is afraid of the past. He can't be around me because it bothers him so much. He doesn't call or text anymore the way he used to last year. It's his way of moving on and not dwelling on what he did. We don't live near each other. We don't have children. It's very easy for him to start Part 2 of his life.

[cagzmom]

dear hope...i am sorry. I think one of the hardest parts of all of this is we know we would work on it..but if they dont want to it is futile..and I know how hard it is. I am so so so very sorry for your pain.

[hopefloats7]

Thanks cagz...I would have worked hard to restore things, but you cannot make a marriage with one person's strength. It takes two and my H isn't going to come around.

I try to be "over" him as much as I possibly can, but it still hurts and lingers in my thoughts. I don't think you ever fully get over it.

[always_14]

((( hope )))

You are so special to me. You know that. I love you so dearly. I'm so sorry this hurts so much - and we all understand that feeling.

I won't dispute that he looked good and is making efforts to move on with his life. But, I will say this. To me, after hitting such a low point and destroying nearly everything you had, would warrant more closure to the past that he's given. Sure, sitting for a year and thinking about it, suffering through it, is one thing. But, real healing and moving forward, to me, would mean seeking out those things you destroyed in the past and facing them. Especially if the both of you have a good enough relationship that you can do that. You have given him every opportunity, every signal, and made it so comfortable, yet he still feels too badly about his past to face it. Sure, that's guilt, but it's also not the answer to moving forward.

Also, my BIGGEST block with his moving forward is also what he's doing to someone else. To not tell someone you are involved with, for a few months now, the clear truth about your past IS LYING. There was much more than the affair, and to throw it all under the rug is LYING.

It's one of those things that at this age and time in your life, you get out in the open. Sure, no one wants to do it, and it's hard, and it might scare someone off, but YOU DO IT. If not right away, then at least a month or two into it. Surely they talk about past relationships. Surely his family sees her and says nothing of his destruction. This is so awful. FOR HER.

Imagine dating someone for months, and then somehow you find out that he had an affair, left the house, acted awful and weird, lost a house, went through depression, and all this time he (and his family) led you to believe (and TOLD you) that it was just that he "worked too hard"....

I may be making a big deal out of this, but it's wrong. He is removing this new woman's RIGHT to the truth, and her RIGHT to make decisions about her life accordingly. Then, he is also lying about the pain and time you went through.

But, you know what?

It's not your life. These are not your choices. All I know is that I'm glad this isn't the way YOU choose to move forward.

He may choose to get a spine, or maybe not. Maybe not everyone does, but pretends to instead, by smashing their new sqaure life into the round hole of the future. Then, they wonder why things explode later and come back to the SAME issues.

But, you have the choice on how YOU will lead YOUR life moving forward. It's hard, but face this....right now, or maybe forever, he cannot be the man that you keep wishing him to be. His saying "sorry, I can't" is literally him saying this to you. He may have moved on and looks good, and he may be really happy. But, it's STILL not the man YOU want.

And, we all know, you do deserve so much better.

[forward]

Hope,
Well, if he is in a new R, he's probably in the exciting new stage. That phase will wear off too, you know...and then what? The reality of day to day living is not fun.

But you need to drop the rope entirely. That's what I am doing now. When H says D, just agree. Be independent. Do not talk about how he has hurt you any more.

I find it interesting that he still wants LS instead of D. Even for financial reasons.....

[Lissie]

I may be making a big deal out of this, but it's wrong. He is removing this new woman's RIGHT to the truth, and her RIGHT to make decisions about her life accordingly. Then, he is also lying about the pain and time you went through.

Yes. How little he must care for her. It is obvious, still that the only person he cares for is himself.

He may choose to get a spine, or maybe not. Maybe not everyone does, but pretends to instead, by smashing their new sqaure life into the round hole of the future. Then, they wonder why things explode later and come back to the SAME issues.

Exactly, he will be back with the same issues, in no time. He has not rolled up his sleeves, and put his nose to the ground, and started the work on himself. He has not looked deep down inside, and see all that scary stuff, that is deep inside, him that creates the muck.

Change of geography, change of clothes, change of homes, change of who he is dating. None of it will work. He is not being true to her, he is not being true to himself.

This is a man that skims off the top to survive.

You on the other hand, my gosh, have come such a long way. You have done the deep down dirty work, and still are doing it. You are a work in progress, and you will never stop. You will never stop bettering yourself.

That speaks volumes of you, and who you have become thru this process.

How can you be in an R with him. It will be totally lopsided. He does not have what it takes to reach you.

And you my dear friend, should never settle. Oh, how we have talked about this. If these guys really knew how deep they cut.

How their words, are so hard and go right for the heart, with no detour.

But as they say, what doesn't kill us....................

SMile my lovey. You can go to sleep at night, with a clear mind.

You can say you tried your absolute best, at everything that came up.

Your spirit is free.

I love you.

[hopefloats7]

always, love you too. I will call you later.

breton, lol...my rope's been dropped a long time. No worries there. I'm an old pro now. It took me a while, but eventually you just fall into place with all of this. I don't DB or follow that kind of thing anymore. If I feel like telling him something, I tell him, or email him, whatever. No tiptoeing around my feelings. My situation's long past "stages" etc. This is what the aftermath looks like. This is when some H's come back wanting to reconcile. Mine did not. I post about it so that others can see, they don't always come back when they come out of the crisis.

You are right, though about the new R stage. I don't think about it too much, as it's happening so far away from me now that I can't let it be a problem in my life. Always is right; he is being dishonest by keeping silent, but then again I can't see my H ever telling any woman that he meets how he lost his mind for 2+ years, had an affair, a personality crisis and destroyed his life. Would that make him attractive for dating? I think not. That explains why he remains silent and pretends like that never happened at all.

He didn't actually say he wanted to keep things as a LS, but in that status he can still claim me as a dependent and in one of his jobs he collects more money per paycheck that way; this is helping him afford support for me right now. That's all it is; it isn't because he has unsure feelings.