#3 Did I find DB too late? Maybe not...

[cw68]

I'm sure he is retreating to an extent. But his disregard for our vows, the commitment of marriage troubles me an extreme amount. How can I trust that the next time it doesn't feel good to him he won't bolt? I know how people who have it worse than us get through it: it's called commitment. His "make up" doesn't allow him to stay through the rough times and there will be more rough times. Together is not his fashion.

I don't think I can live with that.

[Virtually_Handsome]

But his disregard for our vows, the commitment of marriage troubles me an extreme amount. How can I trust that the next time it doesn't feel good to him he won't bolt?

This is a question I find myself as I read a lot of these situations. I don't have a good answer.

[newnamenewlife]

Ugh, cw--I'm sorry he's being such an ass. What is wrong with these men? What do they think they're going to find that's so much better? I think of my H (if he actually does it) living in a small apt, seeing his kids part time, increasing our financial burdens and I think: how is that a recipe for happiness?

I'm with you on the commitment thing. I say love the one you're with. It's so self-indulgent. If it was against the law to get D, I KNOW my H & I would be able to make things great in our M. I'm sure it's the same for you. I don't like that your H is giving you such mixed messages--it's not fair.

[JenInVen]

(((CW)))) I get the same messages from H. Sometimes I just feel like giving up too but the I think of D.

I think of my H (if he actually does it) living in a small apt, seeing his kids part time, increasing our financial burdens and I think: how is that a recipe for happiness?

Oh God me too! My H claims to be living with his parents but I am sure he sleeps in the car some nights! What are they trying to do? Now H has to find more work to pay for x2 expenses.

Jen

[Sara]

CW,

I understand your frustration. As I was sitting here catching up on your thread I was thinking, if they would go to Retrouvaille, they could have a chance. And then I got to the part where you said you were asking him to go to Retro. So that is good. But it seems to me that you might have expectations about Retro that are wrong. People think because there is a priest there that they make you think about why you took your vows and the religious part of it. I dont' remember that happening. Retro made us think about ourselves and what we wanted in life. It made us think of our lives together and the good times we had shared. It made us think about what is really meaningful to us as people. And it made us think about what we would be willing to change about ourselves to get along better with each other. It taught us to open up to each other and talk about all of those things. And when we did talk about all those things, we felt connected to each other again. We looked into each others eyes, and heart and soul, and we liked what we saw again. That is the experience I think you and your husband could benefit from. I hope he will go with you.

[cw68]

H and I spoke today and I feel a bit more settled about some things. Apparently he is actually a lot more concerned about the vows and commitment part than he's expressed to me. H doesn't like talking about his therapy sessions, but shared with me that half of them consists of him talking about how much he doesn't want to fail our marriage. Thank goodness he told me this.

Tonight I told him that I realize so much of this isn't about me and that I don't feel comfortable making demands, but at the same time this IS, by nature, about me and I have to have a few things too. I told him I needed him to go to Retro with me. He came up short of agreeing, yet I feel he HAS to do this. He did agree to do the working end of the Dr Phil Relationship Rescue book. I'm just glad that he's stepping out of the box for me and trying to actively change our R instead of just waiting for it to change on its own.

Sara, I know that the religious aspect of it is minimal and not invasive. My worry is that H won't be able to get past that because of a deeply ingrained distrust of religion that his mother has pushed on her kids.

LMG and Jen, I've told my husband that if they are having a hard time being happy now, I just can't imagine them being happy given all the hardships divorcing will bring. Oftentimes I can be too analytical, but seriously, it's fairly obvious that things will be stacked against us all should we divorce. Happiness will just be that much harder to achieve.

[cw68]

How bizarre. Just had a very interesting day, one that didn't directly involve my H. My son and daughter have classmates that are also siblings and their mother and I have been talking about getting them together for a playdate for quite a while. Today it happened. It turned out to be a nice exchange; first I dropped them off at their house and ran some errands, then picked them up and they came to my house while their mother did some chores. After that we returned and had dinner there. She and I have been living parallel lives!

Her H moved out last June and is just now returning. Her sitch and my sitch are aerially similar. How her H was going out and excluding her, how they drifted apart, etc etc etc. Our kids are almost he same age, same age difference between them, we both studied the same things in college and had similar careers. Our Hs have lots of similarities and our kids get along quite well. While we were obsessed with our Hs and our Rs, it was like talking to a mirror.

And my H thinks that we are so special, that our problems are so unique. hehehe

[cw68]

I meant to type that we WEREN'T obsessed with our Hs and Rs yet whenever we did it was the same story on both sides.

[MichelleLT]

It's strange and bizarre how many of us are in the area.

I blame Hollywood. Both for why these dumb girls think it's okay to have As, and why these WASs think life will be better if they can find a better spouse.

Maybe there are so many of us because of our proximity to So Cal? Lol.

(((hugs)))

[cw68]

I think things are going to get a bit interesting. H went away to the mountains yesterday to clear his head. For some that may mean communing with nature, but for my H it was drinks at our favorite restaurant (put it on the debit card, so I saw), window shopping and hitting a casino.

He came by today to see the kids before he's out of town for work this week. We had a nice day, planted some new plants, went for a bike ride, hung at the park, had dinner, blah blah blah. While the kids were in the bath I asked him to come into our room to chat. I'm sure he was nervous about what I was going to say, pre-dbing that was a bad sign, but all I wanted to know was what was going to happen during his mother's visit later this week. After we figured it out, I asked for a quick cuddle, which he said he had no problem doing. It was just a long hug in a not very personal position, which was totally OK. He paused and asked me, "Is that perfume I smell?" I'm allergic to perfume. Over the past ten years, he's bought me a few different bottles, but since it makes me itch if I wear regularly, I just don't wear it. About three months ago, I started wearing some again as a little 180 for myself. (I've discovered that if I spray it into the air behind me and then walk backwards into it, it just hits the clothes and not my skin. Therefore I don't itch.) I confirmed. Quick hug, over, all good. Then while we were in the bathroom watching the kids, I leaned over and said into his ear, "I want you to move home Aug 1st." Our lease is up July 31. He said, "I know you do." But not in a dismissive way, just a statement. In response I said, "In the meantime, lets use this time to work on ourselves. Let's get ourselves into the best shape we can so we can move forward for our kids, for us." Then I got the kids out because I didn't want the convo to be anything more than that.

When he left, he kissed me a few times and held me tight. Really tight. A really good hug and then another kiss. As he was walking down the path to the car, I told him that I really hope his trip to the mountains did him well. He said that it did and that he's turning the corner, that you can only stay down for so long before you pick yourself up. I validated and agreed, "It's true and I can totally personally relate to that, H." We parted nicely.

I don't know what's going to happen, but I think H is in a little breakthrough mode and the timing is good for him. He's out of town and then his Mom comes into town, so we can just sit and glide for the next week, spending time as a family and being.