How to get past the sex thing

[sage]

Brian -- Hey -- your post had a lot of good info in it! Just some thoughts....

Since we were already sort of on the subject, I calmed down and fessed up to seeing her cellphone bill. I think she felt badly because she knows how obsessed she must look to anybody else. I was successful in not getting angry.

Good for you for getting through this w/o anger...that leads to...

My W, however, thinks that I'm getting too much information, and that the knowledge will only get in the way of us really getting back together.

I think this is a common fear...you can help dispel this by what you're already doing...staying as calm and non-angry as possible during the discussions. One other very important thing -- try, try, try to NEVER throw any info back in her face. In other words, don't use the info in the future to "make a point".

She has been very upset about things that I should "just know" and that are "obvious". Evidently, I have been completely clueless, when it comes to my W. And, my W basically just holds it all inside, expecting me to clue in, and doesn't talk about what bothers her (although she regularly has been telling the friend).

OK so this is GOOD information. You know that your w has issues with your m. You know that her current mode of operation is to NOT tell you about it directly (well, in a way that you currently are able to "hear"). You want to be a sleuth?? Here's your chance -- your mission? SLOWLY figure out your wife's issues with you and the marriage but listening with a new set of ears.

I asked my W to start telling me as specifically as possible what I had done wrong and what I could change about myself. She didn't want to get into it. I also asked her whether thinks of me as weak or needy because I didn't kick her out right after finding out about the A. She didn't answer directly, which I took as a yes. She said if the situation was reversed, she would have kicked me out immediately.

I wanted the laundry list, too but didn't get one...it would have been easier to just hear ALL of it...but, well, it's not gonna be that easy. ALSO, don't ASSume that w thinks your weak just because she didn't answer you!!! She was probably too wrapped up in her own guilt and grief to get out an answer. I don't think there's anything weak about NOT knee-jerk reacting to an a...what could be LESS WEAK than staring utter betrayal in the face and DEALING with it??? ('course, I may be biased!)

Later, I gave her another back rub. Then I started kissing her neck and shoulders. She closed her eyes and seemed to enjoy it. Feeling in the moment, I tried to initiate sex. Bad move, Bri. She started crying and accused me of only giving her backrubs because I want sex. Tony, your post came a day late (not that I necessarily would have listened to you anyway). You are so right. I'm going to back off, for the foreseeable future.

OK -- that's a good data point.

From there it went from bad to worse. I tried to tell her how much I love her and that I know we can make it work. She responded that she doesn't know that, and thinks that she will always wonder "what if" about the OG if she doesn't pursue it now. We went to sleep, both of us feeling bad. I woke up around 4am (I can't seem to sleep more than 4 or 5 hours in a row now) and stupidly cuddled up to her. She yelled at me that she needed to get some sleep, I ending up crying (thought that stage was behind me) and she softened just enough to put her hand on my chest (probably just wanted to shut me up). Sometimes I just can't help doing what I know I shouldn't. I find myself craving physical contact with her.

OK -- two more data points -- as difficult as it is, stop telling her that you love her and stop trying to cuddle with her. Maybe one more point...time to back off on R. talks for now?

Not to offer platitudes but hang in there. You're learning a lot from your w. It's gonna be a long and bumpy road most likely but you've got good support and what seems like a very reasonable head start!

Sage