THANKS SO MUCH jethro and KAW! It is such a relief to have someone understand my feelings.
Quote: After I found out about my W's EA/PA, she was doing stuff for me, but she wasn't doing these things with "conviction."
You are right H is doing the right things. I should not question his motive. At times H does have conviction, maybe I'm worried he will stop trying.
Quote: As we give them space, ease the tension, they are able to come around...slowly, day-by-day.
You are so right again. At times the harder I try I think H does feel pressure and perseives my intensity as failure on his part to make me feel better.
I have gotten the message- time for something for me. I think I just needed to know that easing off is o.k., that I don't have to work on this constantly. So I'm off to play in the dirt with S and his diggers.
thanks again for being there with great perspectives. Bumbling
wow what a thread Thanks to Kaw & Jethro alot of wisdom I am working on a great R and a new friendship with my h however, the trust is hard and forgiveness well that was easy Bumbling thanks for such a great thread I am rambling I know sorry kip
"Those who don't read, have no
advantage over those who can't"
Mark Twain
I have made my list of things and actions which I will give total trust to. It was helpful to write it down, some times reading goals makes them more real.
I have realized one barrier that is keeping me from giving total trust to H although. It was easy to look at our almost 11y M and see how we drifted and why H had e/a. It is harder to make changes and move from past. H says in order for us to get to a better place in R, I need to trust again. Doing so makes me feel so vulnerable. It has click with me that H didn't trust me enough to share his unhappiness for 5y. He doesn't trust me enough to open up and share is fears and feelings. He is unable to make himself vulnerable. I wish we could hold hands and make the leap into vulnerability together. But I fear I will need to be the first to make the step.
However, I think for a while I will just continue on doing things for me.
Bumbling, This is a great thread! Good luck on doing things just for you.... you sound like you both are in a good place let the healing begin trust will come kip
"Those who don't read, have no
advantage over those who can't"
Mark Twain
Quoting bumbling: H says in order for us to get to a better place in R, I need to trust again. Doing so makes me feel so vulnerable. It has click with me that H didn't trust me enough to share his unhappiness for 5y. He doesn't trust me enough to open up and share is fears and feelings. He is unable to make himself vulnerable. I wish we could hold hands and make the leap into vulnerability together. But I fear I will need to be the first to make the step.
You've summed up exactly how I feel! To me it feels like this crazy intermingling of insecurities ... it would make it SO much easier if we could just rip off the protective masks at the same time...but like you, I suspect it doesn't work that way.
Maybe it's build on baby steps...just like DB'ing.
Sage
Relax. Appreciate. Be calm. Laugh. Enjoy. Be secure. Be loving. Be loved. Don't personalize. Don't ASSume. Accept. Be grateful.
My H has really been working on building my trust. And I am proud to say I have not bringing up R issues.
However today I discovered H and OW have been in contact thru email and text messages on phone. When I first discovered their e/a we both agreed that if they were to continue working together that it could only be professional basis or she would quit her job. Well they broke the promise. Do I demand her to go?
And how I am to believe that H wants to work on M and regain trust when he continues to lie. Do I confront him( help he will be home in 1hr 1/2)? If I don't- I'm not sure how long I can hold together emotionally, without him realizing something is wrong.
one good thing I guess, I didn't put the kids in the car and go somewhere else like I felt like doing.
Suprisingly I am not a crying mess. I just feel like a battered women, afraid that sometime soon I will hear him say "I don't feel anything for you and M won't work."
Bumbling -- how did it go???? I can imagine very well how devastating it was to find out that h and ow are still in contact...are you certain that the emails and msgs were outside of normal professional contact?
How long have you been DB'ing?
You mentioned that you and h decided (???) that they would stop working together if they couldnt stop their a....was that an ultimatum from you or do you feel like that was a mutual agreement? I ask because if it was a mutual agreement it's easier to pull it out ... if it was an ultimatum then you need to weigh what your goals are right now....
It's not fair or right or easy but I believe it IS possible to DB successfully while the ow is still in the picture. Not saying that's the recommended course of action...it would depend on what YOUR goal is.
The other thing...you don't actually need to do anything RIGHT now, right? You could use the next few weeks (or however long) to get your ducks in a row, so to speak...DB for you and the M while deciding what you want to do.
Sorry to just throw all that out there without any real help offered! arrgh.
Let us know how you are, Sage
Relax. Appreciate. Be calm. Laugh. Enjoy. Be secure. Be loving. Be loved. Don't personalize. Don't ASSume. Accept. Be grateful.
I did confront it. Actually I wrote a note for him to read as he walked in. And when he joined me in the living room I just sat there. Unlike our usually discussions I just sat and waited for him to begin. What seemed like an hour he just stood there and looked at me. His only initial comment was "What do you want me to say", I told him it was in the note. Which he admitted not to read all of because he wanted to talk to me. I am not sure how it went.
I do know: he is sorry he doesn't want to hurt me he feels R with OW is professional he wants to stay with me he feels there is no passion or desire in our M he is unhappy
I am having a really hard time believing that I am not the sole cause of this unhappiness. Nothing I have done (DB for 2 1/2m) has helped him feel anything for me. Yes there are some baby steps - we giving each other more attention, he is trying to make me feel reassured (phone calls, snuggles, hugs).
It makes me so angry that H again lies and sneaks behind my back. Though I also believe that OW is not who he wants to be with. According to him he just needed a friend to talk to . I am an extremely understanding and fair person. If he needs a friend fine, but why must that friendship be so secret. I told him that if she was really just a friend he would call her on the phone like any other friend.
Quote: was that an ultimatum from you or do you feel like that was a mutual agreement?
When I think back I guess OW leaving her job was an ultimatim which H agreed to. I may have goofed big time, but when I discovered H sent message (before I found her message to him) I called her to let her know her job was on the line. She actually talked to me, telling me she does not intend to come between my R with H. I told I want honesty and to tell me if H had sent her a message. She denied any message. Later I discover her message to H. I phoned her back and on her voice messsage told her all I asked for was honesty she couldn't give me that and yes she would not be able to work with H any longer. I guess I do not have the right to fire an employee of my H business. My goal right now is contiue to improve M.
But I feel it is such a farce for H to say he is working on our M while having some type of R with OW, no matter how innocent.
I asked H if we are working on M to see if it gets better and then decide if we stay together OR are we working on M to find a way for H to be happy and keep working until we find a way to keep our family together. I feel as though H is working toward first option and I am working toward second.
Sage I think you are right I am going to take a break from this. I realize that I do not influence H decisions about OW and he will find a way to remain her friend if that is really what he wants. The only thing that worries me now is that I feel myself pulling away from H and beginning not to care what happens.
Hey Bumbling. Sorry to hear your H is contacting OW. You know, this crap just takes time to smooth out. I look at it as a process that simply needs to play itself out. I know...easier said than accepted...
There are a few ways things can go in everyone's situation: - One's S is gravitating towards OP. - One's S is on the fence and can't decide. - One's S is committed to being at home.
Seems like your H might be taking the middle road, which was the way it was with me while (about a year) my W was having her EA/PA. What does this mean, in my most humble of opinions? That he hasn't made a decision either way. He's as much admitted that he feels there's "no passion or desire," yet he continues to stay...I think because he knows these feelings can possibly change. Again...on the fence. I believe the best thing you can do right now is not pressure him because that may push him over the fence. Like KAW and I have mentioned previously, I think it might benefit you to really do your own thing...do some stuff that you've always wanted to that you've put off for a long time. Although extremely difficult, try not to let your H's erratic behavior upset you...try to detach with loving kindness. As awful as it is for you, try to remember that your H is hurting. Give him space to think about things while doing your own thing. Doing your own thing will likely make him curious, and hopefully, slowly gravitate towards you again.
My suggestion is to brush up on DR, do something(s) for yourself, and buy another book called "5 Love Languages." You're not out of the woods yet and patience is paramount right now.
Quoting bumbling: he wants to stay with me he feels there is no passion or desire in our M he is unhappy
I am having a really hard time believing that I am not the sole cause of this unhappiness. Nothing I have done (DB for 2 1/2m) has helped him feel anything for me.
What are the kind of things you picture the two of you doing in happier times? What kind of recreation do you both like? Hobbies? Ways in which you enjoy spending time together? Why not do one of those things one evening this week. The best direction to take with someone "sitting on the fence" is to start building some good times together. Work at getting the good times outnumber the not so good. However, if he's not in the mood / declines, then pleasantly let him know its OK if he doesn't want to join you, and spend the evening doing something you enjoy and for that evening take a break from focusing on R.
When you come back and he sees you had a good time, next time you ask he may consider taking you up on it. Its all about creating a new cycle of what works. It happens a little at a time, but eventually you get there and when you do he will discover those feelings are back.
