GOING DARK while my daughter is with my WAW...????

[matt7373]

My wife and I have been seperated for 1 month. We've seperated in the past but always put a bandaid on the real problems. She dropped the BOMB but she had no where in our area to go so I left. We did 3 assesment sessions with a MC. Last one was this past Friday. Now I am once again in limbo waiting on her to decide if she wants to start counsuling or get a D. I stopped chasing, ILY, frequent calls, and all the other stuff about 3 weeks ago. I am now seriously wanting to go dark, the only problem is my Daughter is with WAW. I want to call every night to tell my little girl I love her and good night but I feel it is giving W some sort of security. I will be ok with not talking to my daughter for a couple of days (for the sake of my marriage) but I am concerned that W will view this negatively. Can anyone help me with this? Just to add a little more.. 1 year ago she wanted to become a stay at home mom, I agreed and within the first month it changed to full time student part time mom. Since then she has been completly consumed with school and spending time with study friends. How long should I keep paying all of the bills? I want to be patient and give her the time she needs but I sometimes feel she don't want to throw in the towel because she is afraid she won't get to finish college. She says she would never do that, but she has a very self-protecting and gaining personality. I only make enough money to pay our bills and put a little in savings so I can't even afford to GAL. Everything takes money even if it's just the gas to get there. Do I tell her I will pay the bills for another month or two but she needs to be looking for a job, or do I just keep paying and being depressed sitting at my family members' house?

[Dom R]

Matt... it's probably difficult for people to give you advice, when you havent really said anything about the actual problems in your marriage.
You havent even said what "the bomb" is, that she dropped.

Maybe you should start with, What did she actually say, specifically, and what are the reasons you think she said it?

Then AFTER that, you could get into more complicated questions, like

• why do you think she just needs "time"? (as opposed to some kind of action on your part?)
• what are these "real problems" that you allude to, but somehow dont bother to mention?
• why do you think "going dark" is going to solve your problems?

[matt7373]

Dom,
She wanted to talk about a seperation about six months ago. At that time my mind set was that If we were going to work on our mariage we needed to be in the same house. About four months later I realized something had to change. I read Sex starved marriage and Divorce remedy and tried to start making changes in my life. I have almost always came home from work, cook, feed my daughter, give her a bath, put her to bed, clean the dishes, pick up toys, and W sits on the couch watching tv. Before I read the books I did these things with haste because W's laziness. Then I realized she wasn't doing anything because she wasn't happy. So I started being upbeat and happy all the time. Two months later things still seemed to be going down hill so I asked W if she still wanted to S. She said she didn't think we needed to seperate she wanted a divorce but she would think about it for a couple days but wasn't promising anything. The next day she called and asked if I would go to a MC. We went to 3 assesment sessions and I am now waiting to hear if she wants to try counseling or if she just wants to get a divorce. I only know a couple of things about why she feels this way. All she would tell me was that she wasn't happy, couldn't give any reasons other than we were arguing about every other day. Arguments are always about the same things... events that have occured in the past. No affairs or anything like that. Just typical stuff (money, in-laws, and etc...) but it seems she holds it all in and holds a grudge instead of trying to learn and work toward the future. Before we seperated, I tried to talk to her several times (using the methods in the books) to find out what was wrong and why she felt the ILYBNILWY. Her anwser was always the same, "I don't know, I think I just need some time to figure things out." I don't think going dark will solve all of my problems but I don't know what else I can try. I feel like I have tried everything else to no avail. Plus, my biggest fault (I think) was I was pushy (for anwsers), clingy, always wanting to know where she was, and etc..
The books helped alot with this. Once all intimate things stoped i wanted them more and I became desperate.
I hope I have you given you enough to go on. There is plenty more which Im sure will come out later.

[Dom R]

Wow.

that's tough. tough to figure out what you can do for your marriage, if your wife wont say anything about it.

maybe you'll want to tell folks what it was like when you were first married, vs when daughter was born, vs when she started couch sitting.

(and whenabouts you two stopped doing anything fun together. Has there been "no fun" for the last 2 years, basically?)



In the DB books, it suggests basically, "if you cant figure out 'what works' in your marriage now.. try to figure out what USED to work, between the two of you, and then try to do those things again".
so.. maybe that's something you could start thinking about also.

[matt7373]

Dom,
When we first married things were great. But we did not have long to enjoy each other as we became pregnant from the honeymoon. 1/2 way through the pregnancy W changed, although now I would say her maturity may have passed mine for a bit in ertain aspects of life like retirement. When my daughter was born, W was so overprotective and dominating about all issues involving our daughter I feel she pushed me away. Anything I did with her wasn't right or I should have done it the W's way. This pushed me away for the first year or so. I still cooked dinner and played with her but didn't give her a bath but about 2 times in the first year and a half. One night W made a comment about me not giving our Daughter baths. This got me thinking... and since she would not talk to me I decided to take it upon myself to figure out what is wrong with our marriage. W has always been a couch sitter, but the last four months I was at home it was like she grew roots into the couch (if that makes sense.) I think the roots came when I started trying to address and/or at least get her to talk about what was wrong and what we could do to fix it. Same anwser every time "I don't know, I just need some time to figure things out."
The things that used to work for us, well... We used to go out together a lot even if it was just to a movie, or jump in the car and go to Florida for the weekend. I have tried to plan trips, make dinner dates, etc... W always has an excuse or will start a fight a couple of days before we leave and then the trip was off. I would love to do those things again, but I would have to do them by myself. No fun for.. well we might as well say since the Honeymoon.
Just a couple of things I have figured out, W has alot of built up anger toward me because of arguments and things of the past. Before we seperated the only things we really argued about were things that happened over a year ago. Ex: My mom put my daughters car seat in the front seat ONE time, my brother(BY HIMSELF) had to much to drink one night and ran his truck into a wall so he was no longer allowed to watch my daughter, I bought a camper and W didn't want me to(2 years ago, I shouldn't have done it and I know that now but she still holds it against me). Stuff like that. I hope this anwsered your questions. Any advice on the question from my first thread?

[Dom R]

I dunno about "the question from your first thread", methinks you should ask it again here, and stick to one thread

I hate to say it, but... sounds like your wife is basically regretting getting married and having children, and wishes she had/could party more. She's only 24; she may be feeling that.
Rather than recognize that she is in a situation of her own choosing... seems like she wants to put the blame on you for it.
Thus the resentment and total lack of cooperation with you trying to make your lives better. maybe she'd rather sabotage and destroy your current situation (so she can justify "escape" when she makes herself miserable enough), rather than improve the marriage.

You claimed "her maturity may have passed mine for a bit in certain aspects of life like retirement. "
I think that's not neccessarily "maturity", but rather, simply "looking out for #1".

My personal definition of maturity, would be more along the lines of, "taking responsability for your own actions/choices; being willing to do things that arent 'fun', because of the overall benefit; and being considerate and willing to sacrifice some personal freedoms/enjoyments for the benefit of your family".

Doesnt seem like your wife is willing to do any of that. So, she doesnt fit my own personal definition of maturity, anyways.

Soooo... maybe all you can do right now, is stand back a bit, give her space, be the mature person yourself for your daughter.. and hope that in a year or three, your wife actually wants to be a wife and mother again

I'd say still attempt to be nice to her, and occasionally invite her to things... but if she wants nothing to do with you... then dont get in her way.
That's not to say you should say, "sure, if you want to be divorced, I'll help you", though. I'd suggest just encourage her to do her own things, if that's what she wants.

There's a thought. Rather than trying to drag her out WITH you... perhaps look around for things you know she would like doing by herself, then offering, "Hey, there's .... I'd be happy to watch our daughter if you'd like to go to it yourself"

oh, wait... you're separated now, though. that makes things difficult.

maybe you should move back.
The positive reasons for you doing so, would be

#1: because you miss your daughter!!
#2: because you would like to help your W more.

depends a lot on what her emotional state is right now though.
What did the counsellor say? both to you, and to her?

[matt7373]

Thanks Dom


I meant to say post not "thread." Sorry. But here is one of them:

"I am now seriously wanting to go dark, the only problem is my Daughter is with WAW. I want to call every night to tell my little girl I love her and good night but I feel it is giving W some sort of security. I will be ok with not talking to my daughter for a couple of days (for the sake of my marriage) but I am concerned that W will view this negatively."

I am trying to give her space so last night I did not call, when W called I didn't anwser, first thing this morning she called again and said "Why didn't you call our daughter and tell her goodnight last night?" (she sounded a little mad, which could be a good thing I don't know) I told her I was just giving her space and she said I told you I don't care if you call to talk to HER (daughter).

The MC said our problems are very common. Prob. with family, money, arguing, and etc.. He said they are every day problems we just need to figure our a better way to deal with them. We need to communicate better, W needs to learn to let go of the past (not verbatam here), I need to chill out and quit being so pushy for anwsers and be more patient (which is exactly how I was before we seperated.) He said he doesn't think W knows what she wants and I just need to be patient and give her all the space and time she needs. Keep in mind these were only assesment sessions. I am waiting on W to decide if she wants to start the real MC.
W and I talked on the phone today. She wanted to tell me that she had overdrafted one of our accounts and wanted to let me know that she was taking care of it. Of course I already knew, but I threw her a curve ball by not calling her and raising cain about her doing that again. We never talk about our M or R and I don't think I should be the one to bring it up, but she drops either alot of hints or she is not thinking about what she is saying and I can't figure out which it is. Ex: Earlier she said "If I knew you were going to that part of town today I would have given you my engagement ring to stop it by and have it's annual inspection. I need to go do it but I just never get out there." She throws these future comments to me a lot but I just laugh and be happy and get out of them as quickly as possible. How can a person not know if theylove someone, not know if they want a divorce, yet still talk about their future togehter?

[matt7373]

Alright DBr's I shure could use some advice/opinions. Dom you've been great, keep it coming.

[Grace_O]

matt,

That she is talking about a future together is a good thing. Don't get overly excited, you need to keep your expectaions down as low as you can or you'll be in a constant state of disappointment.

If your W doesn't want to start MC per say, could you see someone to help with "communication" issues? This could be a way to get you talking better about just the everyday stuff and with such a young D2 to raise...you have to be able to talk effectively to each other.

What do you want to do with regards to talking to your D2 everyday? If you want to, do it. This isn't about your W, it's about your little one. You can be nice to W and just say "hey" and then talk to your D. When my H calls here (he ususally calls D's cell, but if he can't reach them...) he tells me he's called to talk to them. I don't take it personally that he doesn't say anything to me. That doesn't matter. His staying in touch with our D's does. Your W may feel the same way regardless of any other confusion in her head.

BTW, good job on not calling her out on the overdraft. Did you say thank you to her for taking care of it?

[Dom R]

matt.. if you would like a particular question answered from a prior post... pleas dont repost the entire thing... just retype the specific question you'd like answered, fresh?

Hmm.. seems like I missed a reply that you typed, to my questions to you. going back and replying to that one

SHE initially asked for MC? that's interesting.
Sounds like you have a dumb MC, though. 3 "assessment sessions"?!
You "just need to learn to communicate more"?!!

The MC sounds fairly useless, apart from the following:
He said he doesn't think W knows what she wants and I just need to be patient and give her all the space and time she needs.
I think this is very true. I also think it's important for you to be prepared for the eventuality, that "the time she needs" may be a year or more.

It's no wonder she's not sure if she wants to do MC any more though. that one doesnt sound very helpful. Maybe you should *BRIEFLY* talk to her, introducing the "solution based therapy" idea instead? look up what michelle writes about how it is different from "regular" therapy. it might sound more appealing to her.
Particularly the bits about [you should have something to try out, after 1 or at maximum, 2, sessions]
A female counsellor might also be more appealing to her.
and/or seeing the counsellor by herself. Just make sure that the counsellor isnt one of those "divorce counselors" in disguise, but rather, one who is truely pro-marriage!

I don't think going dark will solve all of my problems but I don't know what else I can try. I feel like I have tried everything else to no avail.

I dont think you've tried everything else. I think there's more that you might do.
I also believe that if you "went dark" right now, it would make her feel like SHE had "tried everything else", and push for divorce, since you had 'given up' on her.
Right now, seems like she's still in only "thinking about it" mode. Dont push her towards making up her mind in the direction of divorce!


You also might consider seeing an SBT, just for yourself. See if "the professional" can suggest more ideas for you.