Overwhelmed with uncertainty

[GoingForward]

Thanks, neecy.

Yes, I have received e-mails like this before from H. Cards, too, and all spread out over the last 3 years.

In the beginning, I would cry. I'd cry a lot. But now, well honestly, it almost saddens me that I don't get emotional about it anymore. Not sure if that's a good or bad thing. I do feel they are nice gestures though.

Sometimes I believe I've detached possibly TOO much, but then again, how could it have been prevented? 3 years apart (even longer than that psychologically, emotionally) and not ever knowing if my H was going to come back or not.....I suppose it's taken its toll.

And I have to admit that I am scared of the possibility of H moving back in. After all this time, I am scared.

[Snow White]

I have tried to type something a few times this afternoon and don't really know the right thing to say. I appreciate so much all the advice you have given me and i don't know that I have any to give. I understand the idea of being scared, you have finally gotten yourself to a point that you didn't want to be but at the very least could accept and deal with. Now you are faced with the unknown once again. Are you scared that you have detached so much that you will not feel the same in the realtionship again? Did you end up replying to the email?

[karen43]

GF, your H says he doesn't want the divorce but all I think you've really asked of him is that he moves back in with you isn't that right? And he hasn't done so! And it's been 3 years which I think is clearly enough time for him to get off the fence.

If it was me, I would give him the choice of moving in before the divorce hearing or go through with the divorce now, and as you say if he later decided he wanted to reconcile you could always remarry later. But of course that's just my personal opinion and you have to make up your own mind of course!

And I think if your H moves back in, you will be totally fine judging by all the great advice you give me and everyone else here!!! Karen

[GoingForward]

Neecy,

Don't feel bad or anything like that for not knowing what to say. Just the support and understanding alone helps greatly.

What I'm afraid of is getting burned again. I'm afraid of giving H the benefit of the doubt once more and end up being disappointed again. I know I can't think that way - I have to overcome it - but it is extremely difficult when there's been one lie after another, after another..... It is truly hard.

I also think the disappointment shows, and that is what my H was referring to in the e-mail about wanting to make me happy, wanting to see me happy. It's tough not to let his mood (which is usually very bleak) affect mine when he's around. I know he's also very disappointed in himself.

As to responding to H's e-mail, I did this morning, but it was actually already addressed yesterday when I was leaving for work. H unexpectedly came by. I'll journal about that a little later.


Karen,

Right, H says he doesn't want the D, and I have told him that he will have to move back into the house then.

Here's why: We have been separated for nearly 3 years now, and every time he brought up reconciliation in the past, I never suggested he move back home. I suggested we "date", spend time together, alone at first, then eventually with the kids if things went smoothly. I didn't want to risk getting their hopes up too soon.

Well none of this ever happened. Not until just after this past Christmas.

Things were looking ok for a bit there, then what do you know....H was right back on top of the fence. He wasn't sure again, he was confused, yada yada yada. Same old tune.

That's when I said ENOUGH. I told him, "Come March 4th, I am moving forward. I am either moving forward with the D, or I am moving forward with my H by my side. If you don't want this D, then you will have to move back in, and we work on this M TOGETHER. It has been far too easy for you to turn the other way whenever there's been the slightest bit of turbulence between us. All you've had to is go to your place while I'm over here, we go days at a time without any contact, and nothing ever gets resolved that way. You have a choice. You can either move back in and we do this together, or we're getting D'ed. I cannot live like this anymore. I won't do it."

So he does have the choice to move back in or not. He just has to make it on his own.

I also did suggest that we go ahead with the D and IF he still wanted to reconcile, perhaps we could remarry in the future if that's what we both wanted. Start all over again. He wasn't into that idea. He says he doesn't want to deal with the D. He doesn't want it to happen, period.


Thank you for the support, ladies! It really does help.

[tornin2]

IMO, your H is being pretty ambivalent, and ambivalence is not someting I would want to be married to. Are you both just not feeling it? That's where I am, and starting to be more inclined to just move forward than know that my H doesn't feel strongly enough to decide what he wants to do. I'm not sure real love exists with so much ambivalence.

[GoingForward]

Are you both just not feeling it?

Well I can't speak for H, but as for myself, I have to admit that I just don't know. That's a pitiful answer, I know, but it's the truth, and I believe it is because of H's ambivalence.

Oftentimes, the ambivalence of unfaithful partners is so hurtful and so confusing that injured partners react with their own ambivalence, vacillating between a desperate wish to stay and save the marriage and the wish to leave and save themselves from further harm. - Dr. Shirley Glass, "Not Just Friends"

This is my dilemma.

I don't want anymore disappointments, and I don't want H to come back if he is not 100% certain that he wants to be here. He's aware of the latter.

I'm not sure real love exists with so much ambivalence.

I wonder this myself.

Love is a decision. How can one choose to make such a decision when they're not even sure they want the R or not?

[GoingForward]

Ok, some journaling....

After taking the boys to MIL's house yesterday, I came back to the house to change and grab a bottle of water before heading out to work. When I got here, I pulled the car halfway into the garage; therefore leaving the garage door open.

About 20 minutes later, I opened the door that leads out to the garage and BOO!!! H was right there in my face! Scared the living sh*t out of me! He got a big kick out of it; I nearly had a freakin' heart attack ! Geez!

He actually put his arms around me while laughing and saying he was sorry, but yes, it was funny, and I did laugh, too. Also felt the need to sock him in the chest and called him an a$$! Jokingly of course.

He was still laughing and apologized again. He said he just walked up and was about to knock but quickly decided to have a little fun when he heard my footsteps coming toward the door. Still a kid at heart at least!

Anyway, I asked what was up; I was on my way to work. H suddenly looked serious and said nothing, he just came from MIL's house. Then he asked if I got his e-mail. I said yes, and he said with disappointment, "Oh, well you didn't respond." I told him I was sorry, I didn't think to. H said it was ok, but I could tell it wasn't.

Anyhow, he started telling me about his brief visit with MIL. He said he went there to say hi to the kids but actually wanted to talk to MIL away from them for a moment, so they went outside while the boys remained inside. H said he told MIL that he's trying to make things right, and he didn't want her or anyone else to bring up or even say (the girl H was dating)'s name ever again. H said MIL blew up and shouted that he didn't know what he was talking about......and it all just went downhill from there. He got into a really bad argument with his mom.

Later, when I got done with work and went to pick up the kids from MIL, I could sense that she wanted to talk about it, and even before she could finish her sentence, I told her I knew about their argument. H had told me. So we discussed it, and I feel pretty confident that our convo did her some good.

Basically, I think a range of emotions got the better of MIL when H approached her. She gets frustrated with him, and vents to me, all the time because she tries to call him just to see how he's doing, but he rarely calls her back. Also, her mother (H's grandmother) is in the ICU for the second time in the last few months. She's been in extremely bad shape for a long time now. Been hospitalized for all sorts of infections (bladder, urinary, they even suspected meningitis - I'm unclear if she did in fact have it or not), pneumonia, dementia, and now her kidneys and liver are failing. She was readmitted almost a month ago. I think they have her back on a respirator now, too, and MIL said something about a possible tracheotomy having to be performed.

Well, understandably so, MIL's very worried and upset that her mother may not have much more time, so she's been wanting to talk to H and update him on the current sitch. She wants to talk him into going to see his grandmother. She's very upset that he hasn't called his grandfather or gone to visit his grandma in the hospital.

According to H, he has never had a loving R with his grandparents. When MIL D'ed H's dad, they moved out here to CA and had to live with his grandparents. H said all his grandmother would ever do was talk down to him. Nothing he ever did seemed to be good enough, and he was going to end up turning out just like his father. A no good deadbeat. Could you imagine?

H's grandmother was a seriously troubled alcoholic for many, many years. H has told me numerous times that while he cares and is sad for his mom, he cares nothing about his grandparents, especially his grandmother. That is why he doesn't call or go to see her.

Anyway, MIL seems to think she can talk him into going; she wants to make him see it her way and go. MIL cried out, "If he loves me, then why doesn't he go?!" I empathized with her, told her how I understood how much this hurts her, but I explained that no matter what she feels or thinks, if H doesn't want to go, he's just not going to go. She can't make him; she can't control him. I said, "Look at me. For years, I've been trying to get him to come back, even without pressuring him, but he wouldn't do it because he didn't want to. You can't make him do what you want him to do. He has to want to do it himself. You can't control anything or anyone other than yourself." I said I was really sorry, but it's the truth.

We talked about a few other things, and overall, I think she did understand what I was trying to tell her.

Fast forward to this morning, I responded to H's e-mail after all. I just said that I was sorry I didn't respond sooner, and plus he asked me before not to send personal e-mails to him at work. I thanked him for the compliments, wished him a nice day, and that was that. He didn't reply back.

One of my sisters called me today and said she just wanted to see how I was doing. She then said, "So I hear you're going to court on Tuesday." I said, "Yep. I see that you've been talking to your mother ." She laughed and said yes. She said our mom called her and said something like she's worried about me and wondering if I'm going to go through with the D or not. I told her yes, H is not in the house, so I'll be in court on Tuesday unless something happens otherwise. We talked a little more, then she asked me if I'd like some support. Someone to go along with me. I said, "On your birthday?! Are you sure you want to do that?!" She said, "Hey, anything for my sister." I then said yes, I'd like that. Told her I might really need it. She said alright and that she would tell her H of her plans to spend Monday night as well as Tuesday with me. I thanked her, then we said we'd talk some more later.

[GoingForward]

H is pressuring me for an answer (wow, can't believe I'm saying that), and I don't know what to do.

He called me this morning, and we spoke for nearly an hour. He is very adamant about not wanting the D to happen on Tuesday. He says he will move in, he'll start moving his things back over the next couple of weeks or so. He just needs a little more time, and he's sorry that it's taking him so long.

After much discussion, I told him I need some time for myself to think things through. He said what do I need to think about; he thought I wanted to work this out. I said I do but only if he was back in the house and he's not. I don't want to put a stop to this D, then another month goes by, and we're still in the same sitch with him not living here. I don't want to regret having stopped everything, then go through the whole D process again, having to wait another 4 - 6 months. He said that won't happen.

He tells me (wtf!) to think about how good it would be to be a family again, the cozy fires shared, taking the kids to the park, blah blah blah. He said, "Don't you want that?"

I said of course! But we could still try for that even if we went through with the D. We could still try working things out, and if all went well, we could get back together and the rest would follow.

H said no. He's not ok with that. He wants to work it out now, without going through with the D. He told me how he's not even prepared to go on Tuesday, and he doesn't want to go in there looking like an idiot.

TOO FREAKIN' BAD!!! He's known this day was coming for a looooong time, dammit! Ignorance is no excuse.

He again said that he doesn't want the D, and he will move in if I just give him a little more time. All he asks is that I be nice to him. WTF??!!! He sounds like S3 when he can't have something he wants, "Mommy, you be nice to me!"

I asked him what am I doing that he feels isn't nice? H said nothing. He then said, "You have all the control right now."

I said,"H, this has nothing to do with control. This has to do with where I'm at mentally and emotionally right now, and you as well." He said yeah, I was right.

All I asked from him was to let me get off the phone now. I needed some time to myself. He said ok, ok. Then he started talking about the kids and asking me if I thought him moving back in would make them happy. I said I thought S12 and S8 would be delighted, yes. He asked what about S3? I said I don't know. He's still too young; he doesn't understand what that means. (H moved out when he was still a baby, so sadly, he doesn't quite have the same type of bond with H like S12 and S8 do. It's not nearly as strong. S3 knows that H is 'Dad', but does S3 know what that really means?)

After that, he told me about some things going on at work, then finally said goodbye after asking me to be sure to call him back this afternoon. I said alright, I would.

I don't know what to do!!!

I want to give my boys the chance to have both parents back in their day-to-day lives. I want to give the R a chance. I want to make the right choice.

I don't want to be sorry for making another bad decision. I don't want to regret having stopped everything because nothing happened again. I don't want this next month to go by and see that H still isn't back.

Somebody help please!!!

[Snow White]

He says he will move in, he'll start moving his things back over the next couple of weeks or so. He just needs a little more time, and he's sorry that it's taking him so long.

Is there any reason he can't grab a toothbrush and some clothes and be moved back in even if it takes a few weeks to get all his belongings over? If he wants to come back why does it need to take a long time? I understand he wanted to pay the rent, but that doesn't mean he needs to stay and get his money's worth.

He told me how he's not even prepared to go on Tuesday, and he doesn't want to go in there looking like an idiot.

This concerns me a little, I would hope looking ill prepared would be the least of his worries if you decided to go through with the D he is claiming so adamantly not to want.

I want to give my boys the chance to have both parents back in their day-to-day lives. I want to give the R a chance. I want to make the right choice.

I don't want to be sorry for making another bad decision. I don't want to regret having stopped everything because nothing happened again. I don't want this next month to go by and see that H still isn't back.

Play both situations out which would be the larger regret? Not taking the chance and going through with the D and not knowing what would have happened if you did? or Not going through with the D and filing again a few months down the road because the risk didn't pan out?

[GoingForward]

Is there any reason he can't grab a toothbrush and some clothes and be moved back in even if it takes a few weeks to get all his belongings over?

No particular reason for me. Suppose I should ask H?

Then again, I would feel like I'm pressuring him, and that's not something I want to do - guess that has something to do with my DBing instincts . I want to see him come back on his own, but also within my timeframe.

If he wants to come back why does it need to take a long time? I understand he wanted to pay the rent, but that doesn't mean he needs to stay and get his money's worth.

Right, I even pointed that out to him. I said I didn't want to see him staying there until his time, moneywise, was up. H said it wouldn't happen like that. Again, he's said a lot of things and rarely done them.

This concerns me a little, I would hope looking ill prepared would be the least of his worries if you decided to go through with the D he is claiming so adamantly not to want.

Exactly! I don't understand it either. I think he's afraid because he knows I'm going to be there with my ATTY while he is without representation himself. He's always expressed concern that I'm going to "ream him". That's so not true! Everything I've requested is well within CA D guidelines and totally reasonable, and he knows it. It's just that he feels it's all "unfair".

Play both situations out which would be the larger regret? Not taking the chance and going through with the D and not knowing what would have happened if you did? or Not going through with the D and filing again a few months down the road because the risk didn't pan out?

That's the trouble for me. Right now, I can't see which would be worse.


My phone's ringing; it's H's ringtone.