All Hope is lost/Help - Part 2

[Evie]

Hi all,

Back from my holiday, nice & bronzed... We had glorious weather and a great holiday.

I felt more relaxed and comfortable as the holiday wore on. I didn't go with any expectations. H had his moments but I didn't let them get to me.

I handled one difficult situation quite well. H slept one afternoon and I took the boys out to an ice castle, I was out with them for nearly 3 hours and was shattered when I got back. The next day H tried it again to go to bed and sleep, I was really cross, so I told him I was annoyed as I had had the boys the previous afternoon and hadn't had a nap and was just as tired as he was. He offered to take the boys immediately, but I had already decided that I was going to say something to H and then take the boys out for a cup of hot chocolate.

The next day I skied with another family and ended up being out for most of the day. It wasn't planned like that, but H was angry when I got back b/c he had wanted to ski with the boys and couldn't on his own, so he had stayed in the chalet with the boys. I think the rest did them all some good. I apologised when I got in (once). I refused to let his mood get me down (180) His mood improved later that evening. Things were much better after that.

We managed the boys well between us. I did a few 180's in regards to how I have acted on previous holidays. I hope I came across to H as confident and assertive rather than aggressive. I looked after the money and H seemed happy for me to do this.

It was difficult with H sleeping so close to me, I wanted to reach out and touch him and I desperately wanted to ML. Part of me thought if he wanted to ML he would and as he didn't make a move towards me, I believed he didn't want too, on the other hand, he may have wanted to but didn't know how to make a move. I just couldn't face the rejection, so I didn't touch him either.

I emailed him this morning and thanked him for inviting me on the holiday, that I'd had a lovely week and enjoyed his company and spending time with him. His reply was:

'Yes - thankyou for coming. It was really good for the boys and was good for us to get away from School and work. Weather was exceptional.

I was so pleased that you were able to see S2 ski and to be able to ski with him.

Despite the circumstances between you and I-I did feel bad in December when I took the boys that you were not there to see S2 ski-I know how much it would have meant to you. Despite that I do believe that you didn't miss out on much due to the fact that S2 only skied for 1 morning like he did all of last week-so you have seen the best of him-and it was good that both of us were there.

I do hope that we are able to do this once a year in the future for the boys'.

I was hoping he would say something a bit more personal/positive, I know that's having expectations, but I had hoped the holiday had done us some good and bought us closer together, that he may be wavering? I guess the positive is he feels we can go on holiday again as a family.

[Jen_Jam]

E that is a positive ... your H may see it "hey look we can co-parent" but ANY time he has in your company enjoying himself is a positive... if he has enough of these he MAY come to the conclusion that he enjoys being with you and the separation is nuts. But it will take a long time, and may not happen at all (sigh )

But enough of H! YOU feel proud of YOU and that's what really counts.

[Evie]

Thanks Jen, I do feel proud of myself and generally much more comfortable around H than I have in a long time. I still live with the hope that one day he will come home. If he does it won't be with any great fanfare and r talks, I think it would be more like he starts to spend more and more time with us. I still have these negative thoughts that enter my head that he'll never come home as he seems to still have a brick wall of defence around him?

I know I mustn't overlook the baby steps, but I guess b/c I'm feeling more postive I had hoped that H would too?

He moves into a new flat on Friday, bigger more expensive, but in our town, so much nearer.

Another positive is we were invited to an evening wedding reception next Friday. I accepted a while ago with a view of taking a friend. But yesterday I emailed H and reminded him our colleague was getting married and that I had accepted, I said I could arrange a sitter and would he take me please? (Didn't want to give him the option of deciding to go, just asked him if he would take me) He said yes!!!

[saffie]

But yesterday I emailed H and reminded him our colleague was getting married and that I had accepted, I said I could arrange a sitter and would he take me please? (Didn't want to give him the option of deciding to go, just asked him if he would take me) He said yes!!!

Now, does that sound like a man that doesn't want to go near you? And I think weddings are particularly difficult at these times - but hey - they can also serve as a good reminder to our S's without us saying a thing - good one E!!!!!!!

[Evie]

Today i feel down again, sorry.

H & I are getting on really well, positive interaction, we spend time together with the kids, he has started to phone me at work again and emails me (mainly to do with the kids or work).

Last night we had S2's birthday party at a soft play centre, we got on well, talked together, H came back to the house to see S2 open his presents and he stayed and put the boys to bed so i could leave for my yoga class.

Then this morning 2 things happened, which shoudn't get me down but are and i'm trying really hard to think positive thoughts and remember the progress we have made.

I mentioned to my colleague (i know i shoudn't) that H was moving into a new flat on Friday and she made a comment that it was part of H's initial plan to move to a bigger place and move on.

The second thing is that my SIL emailed me to say she was planning a surprise 40th birthday party for my BIL (H's brother, lives 100miles away) in a couple of weeks time and we were all invited. I accepted on behalf of the kids and myself and said we would stay the night. I forwarded the email onto H and told him I had accepted and was staying over, did he want to come?. He has replied and said he will go to the party but he may not stop the night. I haven't asked him why, do you think i should? b/c i'm assuming its b/c he will have to share a bed with me. He wouldn't come with me at New Year but he did take the boys up and stay over after NY.

It all makes me think that he meant what he said when he said he doesn't love me and all this positive friendly interaction is to ease his guilty concious and to co-parent the boys.

I don't know what to do now? He seems to take his cue from me, if i'm happy, he's happy, if i phone/text/email he does, if I go distant he does. Any ideas or thoughts welcome, or is it time yet to start admitting defeat?

x Eve

[Jen_Jam]

E, has your H ever mentioned getting a D?
Was it you who asked him to move out? Why? Do you think he would have moved out anyway?
Have you told him you don't want to get a D? What is his take on that?

Sorry for all the questions

[Evie]

Hi Jen

Thanks for stopping by, don't worry about the q's i need aanother take on this sitch.

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has your H ever mentioned getting a D?

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No H has never directly said he wants a D at the time of the initial bomb, i asked him if that was what he wanted and he shrugged his shoulders, it has never been mentioned since. I think he feels really guilty and hates confrontation so he allows me to stay in the house b/c of his guilt?

If i were to say today that i'd had enough i wanted a D and the house sold, he would go along with whatever I wanted, even if he didn't want any of it, if it was what I wanted and it made me happy he'd do it.

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Was it you who asked him to move out? Why?

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Yes I asked him to move out.. He had said 3 times he was going to move out and never did, but the R had deterioated and unfortunately I didn't know enough about DB to let things stay as they were. He said recently that things couldn't have gone on the way they were. I don't know if I regret this now?

This is what he recently wrote to me in way of an explanation to something he had written in an anniversary card in December:

I have put so much effort, time in to work to earn money which at the end of the day is not as important as we all think.

I have done it at the expense of my family at the cost of my family

I forced you to go to work when I now realise you wanted to be with the boys and should have been with boys

I hate what I have become – I hate every thing (Best friends name)is and I don't want to be like it any more.

The most valuable thing we have is time, however none of us know just how much time we have left.

The Boys are growing up fast and when I think back about the girls I didn't spend hardly any time with them because I was working all the time chasing what I thought was the most important thing-A bigger house, better cars, more holidays. I now realise the most important thing is your family.

My life style will change in time-I will be changing the way I work

All the above is what I have learnt, its what I've come to realize. I've realized that I have sacrifised my family for work. There is no work life balance at xxx -its all work

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We talked quite a bit at xmas via txt message, but we never apportioned blame or talked about Divorce.

I figured we are both on a jonoury of self discovery and i have always lived with the hope that one day we would get back together. H has never given me false hope. He lived a lie for the past 4 years by never admitting anything was wrong, I should have known it was more serious when i found his hidden viagra 2 years ago. He has only since the separation opened up A LITTLE.

X Eve

[Jen_Jam]

Hmmmmm.... for a man who feels he didn't spend enough time with his family how is moving out helping him do that? Seems he's moving even further away from his goal. Or he's beating himself up about the past.

So many WAS's do ... ARGH!! Us LBS's who pick up the DR book get the benefit of a whole toolset of skills to use to make life better. The WAS doesn't, they seem to thrash about, clueless. They won't read the DR book either - even my H hasn't!!! I've told him countless times it can make LIFE better, that its principles can be applied in numerous situations, but still he prefers to thrash about clueless (not about our M, I mean things like work)

But back to you ... what is your H going to change? Has he made any positive changes so far? Or has he just sat about in his wet nappy? (sorry to sound negative, one of my pet heates is the person who cries "poor me" then does nothing to change their situation). What is HE going to do to get HIMSELF out of this situation? (and of course, you will help him if you can, but most of the work has to come from him)

[Evie]

Good question Jen - I hear a lot of positive stuff that he says to the kids or about the kids, especially the girls who are older, things like; how extremely proud he is of them and how much he loves them, he never really said that before.

As far as he is concerned the only changes i see that he has made is too emerse himself further into work. More private lessons to pay for the extra rent money. Organising himself on courses at work and looking at courses to further himself in the future.

He goes to the gym more, because he can and he hates his current flat and has little else to do or friends to do it with.

I have no idea if he is happy with his decision, I think he is but you can never be sure. He won't be pushed into anything, everything will be done when he is ready. I think if i iniate a conversation about where we are now, where I am, where he is, what I want, what does he want, it would get me no where or I would get a huge rejection, which right now i don't want too face.

I have been the one for the last 4 years who has tried to iniate a R conversation when I knew in my gut that something was wrong with us and he wouldn't/couldn't talk, i've been the one that has iniated ML and felt as if he was going through the motions.

My plan has been to allow him space and time. To begin again as friends and build on the R from there, but we seem to be just plodding on and getting more comfortable with the sitch as time goes on.

So I guess he is sitting in his wet nappy. What would we expect him to be doing to help himself? People advice it can take time, given the amount of time we were together and how long our M has had problems.

H is on good terms with all of his x girlfriends, but he MARRIED me, I shouldn't be treated like an x girlfriend that he can say he's bored with and walk away b/c it has got tough.

Thankyou for reading and for your insight, advice and suggestions.

x Eve

[Evie]

Forgot to mention above, that H does see a lot more of the boys now and makes more of an effort with them. I get the impression sometimes that i'm an end to a means for looking after them. I don't think he'd be too bothered if I wasn't in the picture at all.

H has just come to collect boys for the night, he stayed for half an hour, had a cup of tea and chatted. He was very tired (arn't we all?). Anyway S2 was behaving really well and sitting quietly with his dad and I commented on how well behaved he was being. H replied it was b/c he (h)was there and s2 was getting undivided attention (got me cross a bit, i do the best I can considering i'm chasing my tail most of the time), so i said well you'll have to spend more time here then.... h replied 'no' not in a blunt sort of way, but in a drawn out way that means no, I don't want to.

So i guess i've had a lttle knock back tonight.