They rationalise because it makes them feel better about the choices they are making. Nobody could deal with the amount of pain they are inflicting on their children without some kind of "rational" reason why everything would be better afterwards.
I feel the only conflict they have is with the consequences, not with wanting to stay or go. Both choices, to them, are full of pain and "hard issues", leave and take the huge hit to finances and stability or stay and keep feeling that they are trapped...
In my sitch I, like everyone here, wish my W would wake up and see that there are other choices, but she is so determined to leave that she will accept a dramatic chance in living standards and the damage it will do to our children to get out.
Accept that they are not rational, but rationalise everything they do. To them we are the ones who are being irrational because its obvious to them that their choices are right, why can't we see?
Stay strong Frank.
Brad
Me: 35 W: 34 S8 & S5 M: 11 IDLY: 08/2007
"Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose" - Janis Joplin, Me and Bobby McGee
"Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it is about dancing in the rain!"
I think my questions are aimed at trying to find 'hope'. Bad idea.
The reality is that love is a choice and my W has chosen not to 'love' me any more. The rationalizations are only to comfort herself so she can feel better about her choice to not love. Since she DID make a commitment to stay with me while I was going through my stuff, she has to rationalize why it is ok to no longer keep that commitment, but not why she has no longer chosen to love me.
We talk about how W rationalizes all the reasons to get a divorce but we do it from our perspective of honoring your vows and loving your spouse unconditionally.
From her perspective she HAS done the best she can, and it hurts too much to continue. So leaving is the 'best choice' for her to get away from the unhappiness and pain she has been living in.
So, the fact that she has to 'rationalize' her reasons for leaving doesn't mean anything other than she has to give herself reasons to support her decision because "I don't love Frank" isn't one of them. "I'm not happy in this marriage with Frank" is. So 'rationalizing' is really just dealing with the guilt of being a quitter, not of convincing herself that she doesn't love me or doesn't want to be with me.
On another note, this morning she was apologizing as she was goin gout the door to go to her work because she would be gone all day every day this week and I would have to pick up the kids from school, and make dinner every day. "No problem" I said "It's going to be like this when you move out anyway".
She says "Well yeah...." pause, then "But I'm not going to ..." and doesn't finish either thought. She says goodbye and goes out the door.
My first thought is to call her cell and ask her what she means but I decided not to. Then I'm thinking that she's "Not going to... move right away" or "Not going to... be far away so she can pick up the kids".
Too many thoughts.
One of my friends said this to me today "She isn't going to ever be able to come back to a relationship with you until she feels like she's free of you".
In my sitch I, like everyone here, wish my W would wake up and see that there are other choices, but she is so determined to leave that she will accept a dramatic chance in living standards and the damage it will do to our children to get out.
What she thinks is that kids are resilient. She thinks that it will be better for them to see her happy outside the home than to see her unhappy IN it.
Both thoughts are amiss but what I'd like to know is just when you intend to stop thinking you know it all, Frank? You think you have this all sewed up. That you know what you think and feel and why you think and feel it. You think you know what she thinks and feels - or doesn't feel - and why she thinks and feels it - or doesn't feel it. If I get that impression of you from the board, how much more must she feel it living under the same roof?
Do you know what would absolutely set your sitch on it's ear?
Instead of moping around about the marriage you had that actually did leave a whole lot to be desired by the both of you - which you have forgotten...why don't you do an about face? Instead of the sadness punctuated by the snarky remarks the you are occasionally dropping, which will only alienate her further, why don't you think about doing the unexpected and SUPPORT her decision to leave.
Yep, it's absolutely a radical idea, I admit but one that is being impressed on me more and more each day.
Die to self.
It's not condoning or excusing.
It's loving "in spite of".
Lift your wife up and let her fly.
Otherwise your thread, and the pictures you paint, are going to be the example for any potential WAW to run like hell straight out their front door rather than endure the stuff your wife must be enduring.
I admit it, Frank. It took me a while to turn my concern away from you and put myself in your wife's shoes. I guess that's because I once wore similar ones...but be that as it may, I have some idea of how she must feel.
In DB terms I guess you'd call what I'm telling you to do a "180" but I don't want you strategizing.
I want you to do something that is going to benefit your soul.
Love her unconditionally.
Support her decision to leave and find her own way.
In my sitch I, like everyone here, wish my W would wake up and see that there are other choices, but she is so determined to leave that she will accept a dramatic chance in living standards and the damage it will do to our children to get out.
What she thinks is that kids are resilient. She thinks that it will be better for them to see her happy outside the home than to see her unhappy IN it.
You were quoting BradNL, I didn't say this.
Quote:
Both thoughts are amiss but what I'd like to know is just when you intend to stop thinking you know it all, Frank? You think you have this all sewed up. That you know what you think and feel and why you think and feel it. You think you know what she thinks and feels - or doesn't feel - and why she thinks and feels it - or doesn't feel it. If I get that impression of you from the board, how much more must she feel it living under the same roof?
I actually don't know what she thinks or feels any more. I've kind of given up on it today.
Quote:
Do you know what would absolutely set your sitch on it's ear?
Instead of moping around about the marriage you had that actually did leave a whole lot to be desired by the both of you - which you have forgotten...why don't you do an about face? Instead of the sadness punctuated by the snarky remarks the you are occasionally dropping, which will only alienate her further, why don't you think about doing the unexpected and SUPPORT her decision to leave.
I haven't been dropping any remarks to her at all. This morning I said 'this is the way it'll be when you move out anyway' in a 'matter of fact' way, nothing else.
Quote:
Yep, it's absolutely a radical idea, I admit but one that is being impressed on me more and more each day.
Die to self.
It's not condoning or excusing.
It's loving "in spite of".
Lift your wife up and let her fly.
ok, what does that 'look like'? I don't really interact with her much, I'm trying to grieve the loss on my own and being around her makes that difficult.
I talk to her, but mostly I don't say much unless she starts a conversation with me.
Quote:
I want you to do something that is going to benefit your soul.
Love her unconditionally.
Support her decision to leave and find her own way.
I think I am working towards this. I don't like it but I'm not resisting it like I used to be. What ideas do you propose?
No problem. I would say that other than being quiet, and maybe 'moping' a little I don't talk to her much now. I smile when I see her and that's about it. She called a few minutes ago to tell me she'd be home a little later because she got another massage scheduled.
I was nice and pleasant but I didn't do anything to continue the conversations. She cut it off on her own with a 'well, bye'.
I bet you say more than you realize and you say it with your eyes. Some of what she may "receive" is from her own guilty conscience but you're putting off cues as well and I have read of at least two snide remarks. They're understandable. Hell, she deserves more if you ask me but you can't be that way. Not and promote healing. The answer to this is in your spirit. Do you love her enough to let her go? Then pray for the ability to do it with love.
Love is the answer.
We can love them if they are with us or not.
That has been steadily impressed on me in the last several days.
Love.
Change your perception and you will change the direction.
Don't ask me to explain it. It just came to me a second ago.
I thought this reply was perfect. Her flustered response is just typical of what happens when the LBS DROPS THE ROPE.