Meredith - your 5 years..

[tpaschal]

H keeps telling me that I don't really love him, that I just want to hang onto the M because I'm scared of being on my own.

I pulled this out because yesterday, when I was talking to my H about my obsessive need to get every point possible in every class I take (too bad there is no nerd icon like in yahoo...), he stopped me and asked, in all seriousness..."Is this why you are trying so hard to save this marriage? Do you just want to be perfect at everything?" So, my job here is to let go of the idea of perfection and be ok with 'above average.' (I couldn't bring myself to type the word "average.")

I identify with this, maybe too much!

So, your job is to show your H that you are not afraid to be alone. This is NOT going to push him away in the way you think! I know you are thinking what most people here do, "If I act self sufficient he will think that I am fine and move on."

I'm not afraid of that---that me being self-sufficient would push him further away. I guess what I haven't wanted to face is giving up the life I had. The life of being a stay-at-home mom to my kids. It does p*ss me off that my oldest two will have had the benefit of being home with me for a long time, and the little one won't.

If he thinks you are in a marriage just out of neediness, that will send him away lots quicker.

I do know this, but it's awfully hard to watch him fall for a 21 yr. old ho who has "Daddy" issues and sees dollar signs. Why can't he see her neediness, her manipulation? Does he really think that she would have pursued him if he had been the married with 3 kids janitor that changed the office light bulbs? H*ll, no! But a doctor?! Whoo hoo! Suddenly the part about being married with 3 kids didn't seem to matter much, even though she was a supposed good little Christian girl.

THAT's what makes me so angry and hurts so much. I sacrificed for years to help him get to the point he is now, and he tosses me aside for a manipulative child, yet I am the needy one? Sheesh. I know, I know, I KNOW that I have to get past this, and I AM making progress, but it is one of the harder things to get past.

I used to do that "but I WAS happy" thing, too. I was pissed because I was home for my first 2 kids, but then had to work while the 3rd is still at home. But, what choice do I have? I had to do it regardless, so how I chose to handle it was a very important thing. I could have kept saying, "S #3 isn't having the life his brothers did," all the while still having to work, or I could suck it up, go to work, and do everything I could to have time with him in another way. The second way didn't add more guilt to my H, and it didn't push him farther away.

Hmm. I AM guilty of this. But on the other hand, I don't want to make it TOO easy for him to just walk away and wash his hands of us and his responsibility to his kids. Instead of him parroting the same inane comment of "the kids will be just fine," I think it's only fair that he occasionally stop and consider how much their lives are changing. Well, maybe talking about FAIR or NOT FAIR sounds juvenile on my part. But whether he and I ever reconcile or not, he will always be their father, and I don't think it's right that I be left to make all the decisions, to make all of the plans. I know he's not really interested in that right now, and probably doesn't have the emotional maturity to really consider those subjects right now, but does that mean I let him completely weasel out of all thought about it? I waffle on that.

I'm actually trying to treat that part of it as a business deal. Saying to him, "Okay, I will go back to work full time, so what does that mean for the children? That is going to affect them before school, after school, and their extracurricular activities. We need to have a plan." So far, his plan has been to fall back on his parents. My response to that has been (and his parents have backed me up on this), "Your parents are getting too old and their health is getting too precarious for us to be able to count on them as our child care service. What else do you propose?"

Is this wrong? I really don't know.

Look, everyone here can talk about what SOB's their spouses are. The truth of the matter is, it is far more common that WAS's actually really do care about their kids than don't. They may not seem like it, as they left the house. And, maybe they stay away from the kids longer than you think you could. But, they have lots of factors at play, too. And guilt does strange things to a person.

I could have fallen into the victim trap and decided that my H couldn't possibly love his kids if this is what he was doing to them. I didn't. (Ok, maybe there were moments of that, but I snapped out of it quickly.) I did everything I could to keep those relationships going. I didn't punish him by celebrating holidays or birthdays without him (believe me, many people told me to let him feel what it would be like without us). I had him here for EVERYTHING, even if at times it made me really uncomfortable. I am not saying that you are doing any of these things, I am just trying to illustrate that yeah, things can be difficult, but you'll be a lot better off if you just suck it up and keep moving forward.

I'm trying. I really am trying to keep him involved, to invite him to things, to facilitate him keeping up relationships with the kids, but he has the emotional maturity of a guppy. I swear, my hormonal 13 year old daughter who cries at the drop of a hat, or gets hysterical at the least critical comment, has it ALL over him in terms of maturity right now. He often balks at doing things together, and I just calmly say, "Whether you and I are together or not, I will always be their mom and you will always be their dad, so let's find a mature way to handle this and come together for THEIR sakes. Let's make this (whatever activity) all about (child's name). Let's make this a special day for (child.)" Sometimes he responds with a sigh and an agreement, sometimes he gets sarcastic and snarky and does the hurtful disappearing act.

For instance, he asked what our plans were for Christmas. I told him that we were all invited to his parents house for Christmas Eve, just as we had always done, and I knew that the kids and his parents were counting on him to be there. (I knew his mom had already invited him.) I went on to add that the kids were hoping he would be at the house for Christmas morning and that he was, of course, welcome to sleep over in the guest room so that he could be there first thing. His response was nasty sarcasm.

He did end up coming to Christmas Eve at his parent's house, got drunker than a skunk, showed crass, boorish, obnoxious behavior all evening that left his kids bewildered and his mom in tears, then had the gall to have OW come and pick him up because he was too drunk to drive. D13 saw the car, ran down driveway and banged on window screaming, "I hate you, I hope you die!" and when I ran after D13 to drag her back in the house, I did yell at H and OW, "How dare you?" H's response? Left me a lovely text message saying, "What the F*** was that?" Called to speak to the kids for 1 minute each on Christmas day, then did not call, see, or initiate contact with the kids in any way for 3 weeks.

So, sometimes it's awfully hard to believe that he still cares for them. Loves them? Maybe. Cares for them? No. I don't think he's capable of truly caring for anyone right now, not even OW. (Hope I'm not just fooling myself on that one.)

Did you ever let yourself entertain the thought that your NEW happiness might even be your new, IMPROVED happiness????

What if you're great at it? What if you LOVE it???
See, you won't know either way until you try.

And, if you hate it, well, then you will know to keep moving on to something new. This is about you and your happiness.

Sweetie, I need to tell you this...
regardless of your marriage working or not working, some day your kids will be out of the house. You need to have things for YOU and you alone, or you will be running into this same issue then. And God help us, we cannot be on here trying to keep you off of the pool boy because he 'fulfills' you.

LOL! (Is he a really hot pool boy?? Just kidding!)

You've given me a lot of good points to think about. It does seem like my path mirrors yours in many ways. It is good for me to hear that you were in a spot very similar to mine and found a way to make it better and happy and positive for you and your kids. I'm working on it. Practice makes perfect, right?