You are sounding stronger and stronger. That's awesome. I think AG gave you some really good advice. You decide when it's over and nobody else can do that but you. You'll know when you've reached the breaking point. It might be after you get back, it might be never. You never know.
But I will tell you this. Our spouses do not respect us if we do not respect ourselves. Even if you do end up getting D'd - you must show yourself some respect. I believe you're doing that now. So you're on your way.
It was good to hear that you were able to watch the Superbowl. What a good game that was. The best I've seen in a long, long time. Technology. How awesome it is today.
One of the things that people don't pay enough attention to when going through a D is the children. They think they do, but they are really concerned with themselves. I was as guilty as anyone at first. FL, my boys were a week shy of 13 when X left and they'll be 18 in a few days. These last 5 years have been a real strange chapter in their lives and it could have gone either way. They're not perfect by any means, but they're good boys who love both their mom and their dad.
I believe one thing. My X knows that they do so because of what I ended up doing during the D process and he's grateful to me for that. Regardless of what happens between a husband and wife, we owe our kids some semblance of normalcy. Even if they don't seem to deserve it, they do. If the crazed spouse can't do that, then we have to step up and do it ourselves. We only have one chance to be parents of teens. Once the teen crazies are gone we have the most perfect humans in our lives.
It's so worth it to let them know what's important - them.
Well, the trans-Atlantic cut must be fixed because more sites are now enabled.
Thanks for ALL of your continued input. I called home last week and D15 told me about her report card. 4.4 average...Honors course count for more than an A=4.0! She's a terrific kid, student and athlete. Maybe my Title IX child! I sent her a gold charm from Iraq for Valentines Day and my D17 some earrings, S9 a wool hat that has Operation Iraqi Freedom on it. He hasn't taken it off since it arrived!
Two days after the call, W. sends me the report card along with a description of her parent retreat with D17. She told me how she could practically run these therapy sessions now. I hope so, because there was no need for father-D17 therapy. More correspondence than in three months. Two weeks ago she sent another one "Hi. How are you?"
(WHAT???? REALLY?.....I've been in Iraq for 7 months, she wouldn't even say "be careful, take care of yourself" when I left, as my two youngest kids were surgically attached to me as I headed here at the peak of the surge. HOW AM I???)
I realize about her "not wanting to open up and give me hope" Got it, but there's a difference between opening up and being a miserable human being, no?
I responded after about 3 days and told her I had the report card hanging next to my desk and sent a picture of it posted on my board. I never respond automatically as I once did. For what? It got me nothing.
AG: I'm pretty much at peace with my contributions to where I am, and what I tried to do to fix it. I still believe that the things that are "wrong" are pretty fixable: "my love tanks are empty, and can't be filled" and I never take the "initiative" for stuff... a nebulous issue that she cannot really explain to me, although I asked and was told, "I don't want to have to tell you". W has told others that if she gives me a list of things, I always do each and everyone of them, but she doesn't want to have to give me a list. (WHAT?)When I took initiative, I always got a 15 point list of things to do better next time. Nevr a thank you at face value.
We went to MC in 2003. I put into effect every action that the MC recommended. One of her big issues was me not staying home with the kids when they were sick, and she always did. After MC I stated "I have a lot to make up for" Every day that they were sick since 2003 I stayed home, much to the annoyance of my supervisor, at times, Every time they were sick, I left to get them at school. Not once did I ask her do it. Actions speak louded than words, right?
Other issues were pretty much the same. I acknowledged all of them and did some very marked "180"s. She did not respond to one of my issues or needs like "I never know when or where she will blow up and for what reason" I described her as an "Improvised Spouse Device", much like the "Improvised Explosive Devices" on the roads here in Iraq.
You never know where they are, what will set them off or how big the explosion will be. Just when you figure out the placement, they change it! She on the other hand, made NO improvements. If I drove to an event too slow (<75mph!) she would get aggravated beyond belief, and stayed angry for hours.
I would often not stack plastic containers the "correct" way when I unloaded the dishwasher, and was met with anger "It's my kitchen, and it needs to go where I want it". I f the kids would laugh too hard at the table, she would grab her plate, toss it into the sink, and take a glass of wine to our bedroom upstairs, leaving us in the WTF? mode
Christmas Eve, 2006, we have guests. We have been separated for about 3 months, but I attend Christmas Eve to make it seem "normal". We're all in the kitchen, including friends of ours for over 20 years. W explodes screaming: "Where's the micro grater?" My D15 and I look at each other:"What the fu*k is a micro grater?" Never heard the term before. W. proceeds to begin slamming utensils as she rips through the cabinets. We were afraid to ask what it was. Ends up it was a cheese grater that I put into the cabinet after I unpacked the dishwasher. It was behind a dish. Ugh.......
On Christms afternoon, S9 and D17 went to visit friends. D15 was watching TV. W. fell asleep on the couch. I went to the other couch and fell asleep. This is one of my favorites..the God-honest truth: I woke up and W. had already awoken. Her response to me: "You came here to visit with the kids, not to sleep"..
One time, my son when he was three had a fit in the car when we were driving and threw a shoe. I didn't immediately whip around and unleash hell on him. She threw the car into park, got out and walked home. About 2 miles. She did the same thing when she and my daughters were alone. They began arguing and would not stop. She parked the car about two miles from home, took the keys and walked home.
One day, I made dinner. It was ready when she arrived home. It was unusual for me to do. Part of taking initiative. Here response: "I certainly hope you used the chicken in the refrigerator, and didn't buy any new chicken".
I'm not without faults, but, c'mon. I guess I went through this cathatic process to see if this behavior has happened to any of you. I never hav had an issue geting along with anyone, except my W. OK ...rant over. Good to be back up on the net!
Nothing wrong with venting - we all need to do that sometimes to get it all out of our system.
It is interesting, after my D, I decided to stay in my very married suburbia b/c while there is no life for single person, it is a really great place to raise kids.
I am a perfectionist so I immersed myself in my neighborhood b/c I wanted to figure out what "normal" M's were like. I am good listener so people tend to open up to me - I felt like I was collecting data! Much to my surprise, I found there were a lot of similarities between M people when they talk about their spouse and D people in surviving when they talk about this WAS.
And for some reason, many of the W's in the neighborhood act like very demanding and micromanaging bosses - where you feel like you can never quite get it right. And I also noticed that the H's don't really complain - they just get quieter. I often wonder if these are "normal" or are they ticking bombs just waiting to explode.
I guess what I am trying to say is that yes, W has some anger and/or rage issues. And your reaction is completely justified. In fact, if I were in your shoes and considering saving my M, I would make her addressing those issues a must before I would consider reconcilliation.
But please make sure you don't leave the M b/c you think there are other women that may be better out there. Other women you interact with will seem like a soothing balm on your ego compared to W b/c well it is always nice in the beginning phases of an R. There may be other more compatible women out there - or it may be that M by definition can be a royal pain in the you know what b/c it is stressful sharing territory with another individual - especially when there has been anger building up over time. I think all M's need to have their plumbing flushed out every few years to clear out the gunk before it builds up to where it clogs the drain.
All that being said, I understand if you are at the point where you are done. And I will support you decision if that is what you decide.
I wanted to add that I too have gone to other MC, Michele operates very logically - almost like a flowchart. I am an engineer/attorney so her very logical approach appealed to me - I felt like I was trying different things to test human reactions in a laboratory! LOL! My M ended as it should have - The X was an abusive personality. However, the skills I learned with her are really great when it comes to managing difficult work R's in my life.
Good to hear from you. I'm glad she was at least pleasant. Keep venting here but remember, they're only memories. I have had to learn how to deal with my own frustrations that way. Yesterday doesn't really count, it's only today and the planning for tomorrow.
Each day is one day further from when you were mistreated. You won't be going back to that place so just mark it and say "Yepp, that sucked." and move on. I have a personal opinion that you're wife needs someone strong in her life and you, like me, tried to be the "good guy" and that by doing things you created a covert contract that she would treat you right. Doesn't work that way. Do what you feel like doing without harbouring hope of getting anything out of it, whether it's the financial changes or getting your own place. You focus on you and be that guiding light. She'll see someone strong and will either come back to sanity or you'll be able to pick some sweet honey that DOES appreciate what you have to offer. My 2 cents. Have a good weekend pushing iron. What's your lift now?
Thanks, all. Where do I start? OK, here goes. The insanity continues. D17 graduated from high school, but still remains in the therapeutic portion of the school. She is on a home visit until Sunday, when she returns. She has applied to colleges, has remained sober and hopes to become a teacher. All good stuff. 9K a month, but she needed to be removed or she would die, W. would kill her or she would kill W.
D17 is going to Thailand in two weeks. I got it. I knew about it. Then she springs it on me: “I may be going to Vietnam as part of a service organization. It will cost about 5K”. I didn’t know about that. I love my D, but does W. really have to spend 5K more to send her to Vietnam? WTH? Over. What is she thinking will happen when she deploys the chute here? I have no issue putting away money at this point. Perhaps even upping it. What’s next, a Lexus?
NH: You’re right. I gave W. huge leeway. She took good care of me and the kids and the house and bills, but then the anger took over. I call it “Undifferentiated anger”. It was directed at everything AND nothing. She was a very giving person, and I was not as emotive as she needed. Also, I did take her on head-to-head a number of times. I always lost and with each time, her grudge grew, being an “injustice collector”. Do you know that in 22 years, she never said “I’m sorry” once….not one time. I’ve often heard about how great “makeup sex” was from my friends. “What’s that?” Although she claimed to be very emotive, it was often bad emotion. I built up resentment too. I just think how great it would have been for her to say ONE TIME: “This is stupid. What are we arguing about? I’m really sorry” That would have melted me. I am incapable of holding grudges. 800 pound leg presses for reps. not bad for a 52 year old guy. Hit the treadmill today, and ran like my life depended on it. Exercise is such a great thing!
Imperfections that other spouses find endearing, she just found aggravating beyond belief. Nothing big either.
AG: I’ve got to ask: An attorney and an engineer? What happened? I love smart women, but I guess relationships are often very difficult, no matter how smart one is. Thanks for your input. I’m not a quitter. On anything. Never have been. I’m a big believer in commitment. Think of where we’d be if the rest of my military officer brethren, “Supported and defended the Constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic IF I HAPPEN TO BE EMOTIONALLY FULFILLED BY THE JOB OR IF I AGREE WITH THE CONFLICT” I was so confused when we visited the last MC who said to me: “Maybe you just don’t get each other” What? I never wanted to leave, and I still don’t. I may not get to vote in this election, however. Here’s a question: WHY DO MOST (not all, but most) GUYS MOVE OUT OF THE HOUSE THAT THEY PAID FOR, WHEN THEIR W. WANTS OUT, AND THEY DON’T? Just a generalization, but a true one. Jeez do I have Attention Deficit disorder this evening? The "Ritalin Ranger!"
I’ve never wanted to look at “greener grass”, but I may have to find a new lawn, because it may be out of my control. I don't beleive any relatioship is easy, but I may not have a choice.
Hill: Waterproof iPod! Get out your “Run to Cadence with the Navy Seals” CD! I hate to run, but I put on that “Run to Cadence with the Rangers” CD, and I can go all day!
