He's pretty safe. He's far from giving away all the secrets; he only gives away secrets that he thinks some people might possibly believe. And even that doesn't go particularly well.
True enough. I gave away every freakin' secret of the monkey temple (not really a temple-more like a pajama party) and pretty much nobody listens.
Quote:
He's also proving that fairly intelligent monkey girls may learn the secrets but they still behave pretty much like fairly intelligent monkey girls who don't know the secrets.
Hmmmm...Well I think we discussed how reflexive human psychology works even if you are self-aware. I know when and why I'm tossing the poo about these days but I still find it quite fun. Also, please recall that I am currently sexually interacting with a hippo. Here's how a hippo reacts to a monkey:
Hippo: (Barging through jungle with huge toothy grin and tough hide) "Hop on board little monkey."
Monkey: (Hops on board) "Where are we going?"
Hippo: "Wherever I want."
Monkey: (Starts throwing poo while clinging to back of hippo) "Slow down!"
Hippo: (Stops momentarily. Gets hurt expression on face.) "Ouch that hurt." (momentary pause) "Ha ha ha. Just kidding. I wish you could see the expression on your face. Like you could really hurt me with a little bit of poo." (Gasps for air from laughing so hard.) "Chortle" (Resumes barging through jungle at full speed.)
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
(Fearless) Exactly, you keep quoting back to us BRIAN's account of how he felt and what he went through. Unfortunately we have no way of knowing whether Mrs. Brian was aware of this. IF his MIL was recovering at home, she would have been all alone while Brian was back in a hospital setting with what Mrs. Brian MIGHT have assumed was a relapse of the EXACT same issue he had before.
If you've got a spouse in the hospital having surgery, it's your job to find out what's going on.
Call me crazy. I know you want to.
What it comes down to is this is a bigger issue to me than to everybody else*. That's fine. I also never said this was a make or break issue. I just think Mrs. Brian made a very stupid choice just like I think your elk hunter made a very stupid choice. Everybody else* thinks she didn't make a very stupid choice. Okay. We disagree.
I think Brian has every right to be incredibly upset with her. What Brian chooses to do with my opinion is up to him.
(*everybody else = everybody else except Cemar)
Stop WaitingFeel EverythingLove AchinglyGive ImpeccablyLet Go
So you like a guy with a noted lack of puppy, yet you say you want the puppy.
I'm not surprised.
Well, he does text me from work when he's having a bad day to request semi-erotic photos. So his puppy is just real low maintenance for me. He just likes having an intelligent sexual woman to talk to about his high tech/high stress job and then break him off. So we're a pretty good team. He already got a promotion since we've been interacting so pretty much I'm owed a trip to Mexico but obviously it's all win-win for me because he's a sexual dominant so it's effortless for me to put him in the pocket.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
If you've got a spouse in the hospital having surgery, it's your job to find out what's going on.
I can understand that POV. I think that most here would think that is a reasonable expectation especially under normal circumstances. The difference between everybody else* and what I think you are saying is that in your case you believe there is NO excuse for not following up with the hospital to find out what was going on with Brian and I, at least, believe there is some basis to extenuating circumstances. I am not arguing that her behavior was "okay" just that the circumstances were not easy and his wife may have been under added pressure.
Brian wrote initially - my W was my biggest champion and really stood out as a devoted member of the team. For example, she was by my side during every ER visit and hospital stay, and stayed up nights to comfort me while I was suffering in pain. Via process of elimination, my teams of doctors ruled out cardiac distress and concluded that I have a viral infection of the chest wall with the added bonus of heavy inflammation. After a few weeks of meds and rest, I started to improve. In fact, I went back to work and resumed partial activities.
The fact that Brian says that just a month earlier his wife had given him great care during a hospitalization gives the impression that his wife was dealing with some extra stress and issues during his second hospitalization because obviously she was able to be by his side and meet his needs just the month prior. And again it's not as if she was off on a vacation and not checking on him.
Call me crazy. I know you want to.
Nah. I don't think you're crazy at all. A bit sensitive maybe, but not crazy.
What it comes down to is this is a bigger issue to me than to everybody else*. That's fine. I also never said this was a make or break issue. I just think Mrs. Brian made a very stupid choice just like I think your elk hunter made a very stupid choice. Everybody else* thinks she didn't make a very stupid choice. Okay. We disagree.
I would phrase it more this way, my friend's brother absolutely made a very stupid choice given the circumstances I have been told and have shared here. Given Mrs. Brian's circumstances, I just don't think it's as easy as her making a stupid choice. What I can agree with is that she did not do a thorough job of following up on Brian's second hospital stay. I think it might be more accurate to say that she did not handle the situation well. I think what everybody else* thinks is that she was in a stressed situation in which the ball was dropped by not giving the extra effort. Being preoccupied with her mom's health and assuming that Brian would be okay is a bit less purposeful than going on a vacation with friends and not returning even if your spouse specifically asks you to. I think Brian has every right to be incredibly upset with her. What Brian chooses to do with my opinion is up to him.
I also absolutely agree that Brian has every right to feel whatever he feels. If his feelings are hurt, then they are hurt whether Mrs. Brian meant to hurt them or not.
Of course it is Brian's choice but I would hope he is able to express himself to his wife in a way that honestly communicates his feelings versus trying to "make her feel badly." Using what he wrote in his first post I would say or write something like this "Mrs. Brian when I went into the hospital the second time there was a real possibility that I would not live and I spent some evenings touch and go. Not having you by my side was very hard for me. I did not feel like it was my place to ask you to leave your mother and come home to me. Now I am feeling angry wondering how much I could mean to you knowing that I could have died without you by my side."
To me that expresses what he wrote initially. It does not presume what his wife's feelings were because we really do not know. It also does not dance around the fact that Brian does feel angry and hurt that his wife was not at his side.
(*everybody else = everybody else except Cemar)
Burg,
I don't think we completely disagree on this issue. We just don't completely agree either.
Brian,
I hope things are okay with you, your wife and your MIL.
Fearless
But what is happiness except the simple harmony between a man and the life he leads? ~Albert Camus
Showing a woman your vulnerability if you have no intention of developing a deep relationship is not a good idea. I would also say that showing your puppy to test a woman is not a good idea either.
Life is full of tests. If you have a puppy, its going to get shown in a LTR. It unavoidable. If she fails the marital test and leaves/cheats/fails to control her attraction, thats not the Mans fault. Still attraction is not a choice. Its a response. If you want her attraction, DONT be a puppy.
The thing I like most about Mojo's thread was the title.
In Support of Strong Puppy. That pretty much sums up what a man needs to know out of that thread. otherwise that thread was full of mazes with no cheese. You wont see a thread entitled , In support of weak/vulnerable/sick Puppy.
To me the "only" reasons a man would let a woman see his puppy is to demonstrate trust and strength and to deepen the relationship. To that end if a woman would "kick" the puppy, not only should he take the puppy back but I would think that would end the relationship. I do not think that showing your puppy (sounds dirty!) should be a game to be played to test a woman or relationship.
I find this more then a little bit emotionally dictatorial.
F:[with newspaper in hand -- whacks puppy] Show the puppy. M: [weak/tired/truly vulnerable--wimpers and wags tail] F: :[with newspaper in hand whacks puppy again] NOT LIKE THAT!!
I can imagine that would deepen the R. LOL. You ladies crack me up.
Life is full of tests. If you have a puppy, its going to get shown in a LTR. It unavoidable. If she fails the marital test and leaves/cheats/fails to control her attraction, thats not the Mans fault.
?? I don't think I placed the blame on the man, did I? And of course life is full of tests. My specific comment was about Burgbud's statement that a man only shows his puppy side in order to see the women kick the puppy ("and kick it she will"). I just disagreed that specifically testing a woman to see her fail is the "right way" to go about it. of course if you show your puppy, you are vulnerable and it is possible the woman may not respond "correctly" and then of course that is her issue.
Still attraction is not a choice. Its a response. If you want her attraction, DONT be a puppy.
So is the attraction of women the bottom-line for what part of the menagerie you show? I would have thought that the attraction of women is secondary to a man being his own man.
Being puppy worked plenty well for my XH as far as attracting women and even with keeping them (as far as I was concerned and with his OW). I still wouldn't recommend it for Long Term success as a complete male. Meaning - I could accept my XH for whom he was but he was the one who was/is struggling with himself. Having women attracted to him did NOT solve his core issues as a man.
Fearless - To me the "only" reasons a man would let a woman see his puppy is to demonstrate trust and strength and to deepen the relationship. To that end if a woman would "kick" the puppy, not only should he take the puppy back but I would think that would end the relationship.
Blackfoot - I find this more then a little bit emotionally dictatorial.
F:[with newspaper in hand -- whacks puppy] Show the puppy. M: [weak/tired/truly vulnerable--wimpers and wags tail] F: :[with newspaper in hand whacks puppy again] NOT LIKE THAT!!
I don't think that's what I wrote at all. I don't think I said anything about the woman being able to dictate or demand when emotions are shown. I don't believe that any more than I believe the man should be dictating the woman's emotions.
Maybe I should be more clear about my marital issues along these lines. My XH would be upset if I was too vulnerable at times. For example, if I asked for help, he would be angry that I wouldn't take care of something by myself. In fact I was struggling with work issues and he just didn't want to hear anything about it. He also said that when he met OW one thing he noticed and liked was that she was always smiling and seemed happy all the time. (Of course he later saw the full picture.) And no I don't feel that it was my fault that he cheated in some part because of my vulnerability and the way it made him uncomfortable. (at the same time I don't think it is accurate to think of me as a weak woman needing help all the time because I did make almost the same income as XH and I was the one responsible for our health care benefits. I was responsible for much of the house and farm also.)
In the end, I don't think it really had much to do with me but more had to do with his own personal insecurities. He didn't like who he was inside and no one but he can change that.
ETA: Raven and Fearless, belated congratulations. You both got goodun's.
Thanks!! We think so!
Last edited by fearless; 02/11/0802:33 PM.
But what is happiness except the simple harmony between a man and the life he leads? ~Albert Camus
