Why Men Cheat The most frequently cited reasons for infidelity among men include
more sex (the desire for a more active sex life) sexual variety (a desire for different kinds of sex) opportunistic sex ( taking advantage of an opportunity to have sex without the fear of getting caught) to satisfy sexual curiosity (about a specific female) a feeling of entitlement (the belief that it’s a man’s prerogative to cheat) the “thrill of the chase” the desire to feel important or special sexual addiction
Why Women Cheat The reasons most frequently cited for female infidelity include
a desire for emotional closeness and intimacy (someone caring to confide in and bond with on an emotional level) a desire for attention (wanting be the center of a man’s attention again) to reaffirm her desirability (To feel validated as a woman) to re-experience feelings of romance a desire to feel “special” boredom loneliness sexual excitement
To me these sound an awful like people getting their need met elsewhere.
MM - has she read the SSM? That was a real eye opener for me.
Yep. Although I bought a copy years ago and recommended it, she did not read it until things came to a head during last year. Not sure that it made much of an impression.
One of the things she came back with was, in so many words, "so, how many times per week/month will we have to have sex so that you'll be happy?" Now, just for a moment, consider that response. A. The message I got, in her query for what a satisfactory "quota" would be, was that her agreeing to have sex with me was some sort of concession on her part; IOW, an open acknowledgement that she'd be the one "giving" sex, while I'd be "receiving" her favors. Do you see anything insulting about that? B. For me, quantity (although our encounters were rare) was never the main issue; the problem was that she had no desire to be sexual with me. If pressed, she would willingly engage in intercourse, but it was disspirited and she wanted the act to be over with as quickly as possible. I found this to be worse than no sex at all.
You said "Not having sex causes suffering. So does decreasing your standard of living as well as the standard of living of your wife and children". You can actually do something about the second item, whereas you are SOL on the first if you are married to a person who is stuck in LD mode. A critical difference IMO.
This is true. I know it probably vibes different for you guys than me but I have found that even with kids at the late teen stage you can go a long way substituting creativity and attention for cash.
That "vibes different" can be a very big difference. Especially when it comes to dating and attracting members of the opposite sex, generally speaking, being broke is a much more negative deal for men than it is for women. Having been both rather affluent and broke during my adult life, I can tell you the difference is huge, and goes beyond simply how a man feels about himself when rich or poor.
I read a list somewhere about the top reasons for couples to divorce.
An "expert" with which I consulted expressed that the four biggest underlying categories are, in no particular order: - Money - Family - Religion - Sex
"One of the things she came back with was, in so many words, "so, how many times per week/month will we have to have sex so that you'll be happy?" Now, just for a moment, consider that response."
MM - (sorry- I haven't learned how to do the quote thing yet) - that is a harsh response IMO. Is there anything that she enjoys? Showers together? Conversation and wine? What I'm trying to get to is, if you can explain (and make sure the timing is right - timing is very important) how being sexual isn't just about meeting your needs but a special gift that you can give to her. That you're sorry she doesn't enjoy it because you would like to make her feel good. That maybe you could take baby steps to work towards at least "wanting" to be together (as opposed to desire). I don't know - just tossing out ideas. Massage maybe?
I can tell you it is depressing to feel like a failure. My H has told me that in all other respects he's happy with our M. This doesn't make me feel like less of a failure. I don't want to feel turned off by the idea of sex, but sometimes that happens. It's almost like I have to choose to make a decision not to be.
I read a book recently that was for ME. Not for my H. Not for the M. It was interesting. It is called "Good Sex: A Woman's Guide to Losing Inhibition." It made me realize how I was deserving of and entitled to a good sex life. That is part of the reason I started posting here seeking ways to rebuild the passion and connection. I'm not expecting much help from my husband on this front, but I'm still willing to hang in there and give it anoter go.
Is there anything that she enjoys? Showers together? Conversation and wine? What I'm trying to get to is, if you can explain (and make sure the timing is right - timing is very important) how being sexual isn't just about meeting your needs but a special gift that you can give to her. That you're sorry she doesn't enjoy it because you would like to make her feel good. That maybe you could take baby steps to work towards at least "wanting" to be together (as opposed to desire). I don't know - just tossing out ideas. Massage maybe?
See post #1340936 from page one of this thread.
As to "make her feel good" - giving, and satisfying a woman was always integral to my enjoyment of sexual relations (well, back in the day, anyhow). Her response to this was to point out that my desire to provide satisfaction to her was just another form of my own selfishness. Oh well!
MM - I'm not trying to be hard on you here, but she probably feels like I do when my H brings up anything about the topic. I think "here we go again" or "not again" or "doesn't anything else matter?"
My advice? (not that you asked for it) Find out what she likes. Start outside of sex and then several weeks later try a bath together or a massage. Stop there.
I say this because...there are nights I yearn to be touched...to be held. I don't always tell my H because I'm afraid of starting something I can't finish. I wish I was wired so I could just do something for him, but I'm not. I need to feel that bond.
If you are still together, there is something holding you together. Everyone has problems of some nature. No relationship is perfect. If she wants to keep the M and you, she'll respond to the attention. If she doesn't, then that says something to you and only you can decide if you can live that way.
I told my H what I could and could not tolerate in his behavior. He told me as much regarding sex. My situation is far from resolved, but we are still trying. I have to believe if you are here posting, you still want things to work.
"I'm afraid of starting something I can't finish." is representative of what drives me (and many other HDs) nuts. Can't and Won't are not the same thing. While every R has different issues that may drive the HD/LD issue, one common denominator is that one spouse won't allow sex. It is not just a matter of not equally embracing it or equally initiating it, it is, at its core, one spouse is "blocking the goal" and the other has a series of really sucky alternatives at that point. You might WANT your husband to treat you in a certain way or jump through various hoops to get some, but at the end of the day, since you are the LD spouse, at the end of the day you have 100%, or close to it, control over whether you have sex or not. That level of control and powerlessness drives many HD spouses to frustration, which manifests itself in a lot of ways, most of them not pretty. And the viscious cyle begins...
Sorry to be hard on you, but I want you to understand the HD side and I'm not sure you really do.
PF
Me; 42, W; 43 M; 16 yrs S12, D9
3/13 - "I want to move to XYZ City (four hours away) and it might be without you, not sure" 5/13 - "Not sure I meant that"
