jarhead, I love your analogy. So very true. And you are right, who is the biggest fool here? And yes, my H is screaming for attention/validation/something, just like your W.
Choc,
Quote:
"if you end our marriage this way, I will never be your best friend anymore. I don't say that to be mean, but I just can't do that.
I said this and also added that it would be inappropriate when I am in a new relationship to have such a close tie and connection to him. He constantly says 'This will be your choice, you will always have my heart, you can be as close to me as you choose. I won't be with a woman that won't accept that you come first (???). If you choose to be distant, I will have to accept it no matter how hard.'
hey edie, we do have a family trip planned in the end of February. I am totally waffling about this now.
sara and sue, thank you for stopping by.....it means a lot.
saffie, my friend. Help me out here. Are you telling me that I need to tell him (yet again) that I don't want this divorce, that I want him and only him, and give him a ton of attention? I cried last night for the first time in front of him (in a long time) and he lost it. I told him I felt I was losing so much more than him because we are in different places right now.
I fully believe he told that woman he is getting divorced, and I believe they kissed. I am thinking they might have done more, because SallyM is right, it was not warm on Saturday night. He kept the truth about OW from me for one week (between me asking him once, him lying, me asking again, and him spilling) because he said he couldn't hurt me. I am wondering if this is the same. There are plenty of women out there happy to have a one night stand.
thanks yoyo, jak, tired, anyone I missed.
I have really needed this board today. Helps me see I am not alone. I can do this, I can be a divorced woman, but I don't want it. I don't want it for my girls. I just don't know what to do. Proceed with filing paperwork, or leave it be for awhile. I could do the 'patience' thing when I knew OW was waffling out of the picture (she is gone for good now), but with this new kiss....don't know. I know he wants to try separation before divorce, but I don't have it in me to separate and watch him date. I could separate to work on us, but not to watch this anymore. I might be hitting my point of what I can take.....
lwb, you will be okay. you will not only survive, you will thrive, if you do indeed end up divorced. spend some time on the "surviving the big d" board. seriosly, those folks inspire me. they give me hope that things will not only be okay, but they will be GOOD again.
no, this is not what you want. none of this is. this is not what you deserve. but the one thing I know is you will be okay. you will.
and lwb, if you separate, you will not be watching him date. the silver lining is that will be behind you, because honey, you already have. you know the pain of watching him actually go out and meet ow. that will NOT be on your plate any more, if he is gone. at the same time, it doesn't mean you have to file right away. do it if it feels right to you, you are ready for it, but don't do it in haste. hell, make him step up and do it, this is his ball game after all.
take control of lwb. release your inner fabulousness. because honey, he has trampled it for too long. I will NOT sit back and watch you doubt yourself at all, because you are one of the most caring, loving, wonderful, strong, able bodied women I have ever had the luck to know, even if its only thru cyberspace.
M-41 H-38 M-10 years, T-14 years Bomb-PA 3/19/07 Separated-6/7/07 Piecing/h back home 5/08 S-6 S-4 D-4
"Courage doesn't always roar. Sometimes courage is that little voice at the end of the day that says, 'I'll try again tomorrow.'"
lwb - Please don't take my analogy the wrong way. Of course they are the bigger ass, but after so long it makes you wonder.
SallyM hit it right on the head.. you've put up with so much, a separation (physically) could be a world of difference for you both.
That's a bummer you won't be heading to Ohio soon.. could've had Mark and I take care of some trash!
Seriously.. line up some good "girl" time while they are gone. Talk about making a man wonder! (H that is.. OK.. all males will be picturing PJ pillow fights!)
As for him still making the "I can't stand to see you with anyone else" that's a whole other ball of wax. My W still freaks when she thinks I'm seeing someone, yet she has no interest in talking to me (other than to gripe about her life) or working things out. Not sure why they do this... Oh well.. their loss.
I am still trying to figure out why he is still there if he wants a separation. I feel that if he truly wanted it or should I say knew he wanted it he would be working on it.
You do have to make some decisions about how much more you are willing to take before you decide to file for D or kick his ass to the curb for a while. But maybe being a little more patient but seeting some more personal boundries are in order for the time being.
You could tell him that if he wants these things that he will have to do them on his own but that you will not stand in his way but, that you would rather try to work through them as long as it is just the two of you working on it. If he can't do that then you will make your own life without him and be happy, you would just rather it be with him.
BUT, maybe you have already said this a million times and i have missed it in your posts.
You see im an optimist and I would rather think positive until there is concrete proof otherwise but i still look at it from all angles most of the time, and yes it was cold Saturday nite I have thought of that angle also, Just trying to look at it more positive.
JAK
You don't get to choose how you're going to die. Or when, you can only decide how you're going to live now. ~Joan Baez
we do have a family trip planned in the end of February. I am totally waffling about this now
I meant you and the girls going away on your own without H. He keeps saying (by his actions) that what he wants is a D. His mouth says one thing, but his actions are so contrary. I used to waffle back and forth about this in my own sitch - h's action said one thing, words another. It ends up creating a power struggle in your marriage: you trying to fix things (because H *says* one thing) and H pulling away through his actions. I was thinking that if you left for awhile - even for a long weekend, it will give you some rest from the power struggle, and would provide distance between you and your H. He needs to be given what he is asking for (i'm not talking about filing for divorce, just providing him with tons of space, physcially, mentally, etc). I don't think he will be able to see the error of his ways until he gets a real taste of his new life.
I don't believe that your H truly wants a divorce. I believe, like Saffie, that he wants a restored marriage and this is a cry for help. He wants to love you. He wants to be with you. His actions of not leaving when he could very easily go live with his Dad speak to this. But I think he is in a no-win situation. If he stays and works through this stuff, he's got tons of work to do. If he goes, he loses his wife (who he wants to love and does love) and his kids. What choice is he to make? He created this mess, he knows that. He is wallowing in this mess because he can't find the path out of it. He can't listen to you direct him because you're angry and rightfully so and he probably doubts what you say (not because you've given him cause to, but because he f'd up majorly). He has no choice but to own this problem and fix it himself. I don't know if leaving for a weekend would provide him with some time or not to reflect and gather himself together, but it might. And it might provide you the same...
Me: 34 H: 39 M: 7 yrs H A 12/05-8/07
If what you say surprises me, I must have been assuming something else was true. - M. Wheatley
I don't believe that your H truly wants a divorce. I believe, like Saffie, that he wants a restored marriage and this is a cry for help. He wants to love you. He wants to be with you. His actions of not leaving when he could very easily go live with his Dad speak to this. But I think he is in a no-win situation. If he stays and works through this stuff, he's got tons of work to do. If he goes, he loses his wife (who he wants to love and does love) and his kids. What choice is he to make? He created this mess, he knows that. He is wallowing in this mess because he can't find the path out of it. He can't listen to you direct him because you're angry and rightfully so and he probably doubts what you say (not because you've given him cause to, but because he f'd up majorly). He has no choice but to own this problem and fix it himself. I don't know if leaving for a weekend would provide him with some time or not to reflect and gather himself together, but it might. And it might provide you the same...
I tend to agree with this. A truism of life, but most CERTAINLY true for those in (or recently over) affairs:
Judge them by their ACTIONS, not their WORDS.
Now, you may decide you don't want him ANYWAY, but base that on factors other than what he's SAYING, would be my advice.
I think he wants a route home but there is NO EASY way. I also think that he feels that if he were in your shoes he would be out for his pound of flesh and would make it uncomfortable for you for quite a while - I guess I am saying he is judging what he thinks your reactions will be by what he thinks his own would be if the shoe were on the other foot. However, as we all know, until it happens you are never sure how you are going to react.
I think he does want to see you break down and want him. However, I don't know if that is the right thing to do. If you are to have a future with this guy it's got to be healthier than the one you have had. It has to be an equal R. I do believe you may have to drive him away to get him back - I do think he will come back though - he knows which side his bread is buttered.
I agree that he may well have not slept in his car on a cold night; it may have been a ONS - which is horrid - but probably is because he is craving comfort; no strings attached physical comfort.He may talk D but he doesn't really act it - where are the papers?
His actions all scream out to me that if he could, he would put all that has happened behind him; he would turn back the clock. he has learnt that what he did, did not solve anything for him. I think YOU have to decide just how far you are willing to go to let him back. He knows you so well - he even listed the requirements he knew you would need him to meet - and you know what - I bet when he was saying them a voice inside him was calling out saying "lwb - just tell me you know I can do those things".
I think he felt, for some reason,emasculated ,and OW made his cave man come out for a while. Now he can see he has been played and at the same time hurt what is most dear and important to you and him. I don't think he is maybe quite yet in the place where he knows how to come back but I feel he is getting close to it.
I don't know what to say to you to do - I don't know your H - but if he was mine I would show him some softness - NOT WEAKNESS- but show him some compassion and tell him that he CAN do the things he listed that are needed to revive your M. That you believe he can, and that you want it to be him that you are closest to BUT if he can't man up and do those things you will, after D, look for someone that will love and respect you. For heavens sakes - it's the least you deserve.
Saffie me 46 H 46 M in 1986 D20,D18,S16,D13 H's A 01/05 to 07/06 H recommitted to M 07/06 renewed vows 09/06 Going from strength to strength
lwb, {{{{{HUGS}}}}} I don't know what to say but I am so sorry you have to put up with his crap. He is feeling extremely guilty. I agree with others. He feels that he really f'ed up and does not know how to fix it. The easiest way he knows now is to get a D. My H once told me that leaving me was easier than going with OW. He chose to stay but that's not after moving out first.
I think most of them really need to hit rock bottom first before they turn around. And that "rock bottom" depends on each individual. He does not want a D. He probably just feels that it is easier to start fresh than come back to face you. Too guilty.
Meanwhile, take care of yourself. You deserve a good husband. someone who will respect you and cherish you and will owe up to things. Unfortunately, your H is not at that stage now.
