well, all hell broke loose, it is over and done

[cat03]

The man you knew is gone for now. How would you detach if her were dead?
=====================
ironically, I had to go a wake yesterday amid the chaos, my neighbor's H died, she took care of him and wore herself out to the bone, looked haggard and tired and sad. I was expecting to see a worse woman, but alas! she looked nice, new hair cut, taking with people, not crying, so glad I came to see her. They had been married 47 yrs, and there she was, in one piece. And I said to myself "if she can do it...."

You can do a legal separation
================
H asked for this twice yesterday, the first time telling me gently that he needed to find out if he could be healthy alone or with me, to fix himself, the second time in a stern way--after I asked him why he said "so i stop hurting you and everybody around me, i'm hopeless. We talked some more and he didnt' bring it up again.
If he wants that next time I shouldn't fight him and let it happen.

I prayed this morning for God to show me the way, and He has used you all to direct me in the right path, thank you so so much)))))))))) I'm not anxious anymore (or at least for the time being )

[RedHeadWife]

I understand you have held on your childrens' sake, however, they know a lot more than we think they do. They have got to have picked up on this entire sitch and it cannot be healthy for them at all.

I think if you let him go and deal w/ whatever it is he needs to deal w/, once you mourn, you will be in a much better place than you are now. You probably do not even realize how stressed out you are right now.

As for your neighbor, it sounds like she was taking care of her H b/c of physical illness, not mental illness.

I really think you need to stop fighting your H on this. You NEED to let him go. I really think if you don't, you are going to end up going around & around in the circles you have been in since 2005!!!!

He needs to figure things out for himself. You need to move on for yourself and your children. Your M is NOT healthy right now for you or your children. They have got to be seeing & hearing a lot more than you may think they are.

If he chooses to come back, please, please, make sure he is truly healed once & for all this time. I really think he needs A LOT of time out of the house & away from you & the kids.

[LoginName]

Yay Cat!

I'm not anxious anymore (or at least for the time being )

I'm glad.

Legal separation is different from state to state. In CO, the paper work is the same as a D and after 6 months becomes a D. Check it out where you life.

I recommend the book "Controlled Separation" I think that's the name. You can separate without paperwork too. It's up to you. You can separate in the same home, but it's harder.

H asked for this twice yesterday, the first time telling me gently that he needed to find out if he could be healthy alone or with me, to fix himself,

My wife has told me that she needed the time away from me, to prove to herself that she could do it, to get her head together, to find out what she really wanted. She has thanked me a few times for giving her that opportunity. She decided she wants me. :-) Just when I was getting to enjoy being on my own :oP I suggest letting him go if he feels that strongly about it.

[LoginName]

Hey Cat, I just thought of a way to describe detaching. It's like how I feel toward you. I care for you. I want to help you. I feel bad when things go wrong for you.

But, I'm detached from you. I can still sleep at night (sorry, I can), I can still have a good time with my kids.

Can you feel that way toward your H? Still care but not let it affect you too much?

Yes, if you start working on an R, you will need to become more attached, over time, but that can come later. Or never. Or with someone else.

[sgctxok]

checking in...wishing you every good thing, cat...take care of yourself...

[cat03]

I've done a lot of thinking, and in retrospect I have to come to the same conclusion I came to when he left in 05, that I'd be alright if he never came back. I'm still holding on the old image of my H, that sweet caring man I had years ago who would've never done what he has done to me now. This is a new person, who doesn't regard my feelings nor his children, who rather than come clean with me did what ow told him to knowing how strongly I felt about his R with her (and choosing to ignore it).
If I were in his shoes I wouldn't let a lover come between me and my children and what could possible be a great M, but I'm not him, my H does not think this way and as much as I want him to he is so removed from reality he is no good to me right now.
I shouldn't be the one talking him into wanting me, us, our family, I want that real good man I had to surface and fight for me, right now it is not possible.

I'm trying to keep the emotional side of me on the side, the one who'll miss intimacy and loving gestures from a man (not that I got any of that for the past 6mths) and try to use my head and realize I can't have a man who did tell me lots of his decisions have been made just so he would'nt be alone (he admits that is not good). That I don't want to go on the merry go round of the past years. He needs to fix himself HIMSELF.

I know it will be hard and it will hurt, but if it comes to a separation (temporary/?) perhaps it is for the best, if that what it takes for him to wake up, and if it goes the other way, then, it will be a good thing I won't be lied to and hurt like I have been throughout all this time.

He did go out last night, called me to "check in" at night 2x and this morning "I know you don't trust me" he says. Nope, not an inch, I don't believe he broke it off with ow the other day, I won't buy anything, and will be careful what he says during his "lucid" moments, because a few days later his mind takes a 180 and everything goes downhill again.

Thank you again each one of you for your wisdom and for helping me see what I was too afraid to see, that for me to be happy in the long long run there I must let go.

[LoginName]

and this doesn't mean it's over. It's a strange contradiction that once you don't care if it is over or not, then things can get better.

I guess the goal is to be healthy. That attracts other good things to you.

I'm thinking of you Cat, and wishing the best (not always what you want, eh? but what's best for you - not my will but thine).

I feel sorry for your H, but I won't lose any sleep over it.

[ACJ]

Cat,
I'm feeling your pain. My H did something similar. We had a brief split during 2004 during which he had an affair (I since found out he had already cheated on me prior to that but that is a different story). He had been home about 16 months when this latest episode kicked off (Nov 2005). Like your H has asked you mine wanted to know what I wanted him to do. I made it clear that I made my decision when he came home previously and was standing by it (ie I wanted him with me). He however chose to leave and from what I can tell has not looked back since. So it is a gamble but at least I know deep in my heart that we are apart b/c of a decision he made and not me. I think he would have left either way he just wanted me to make it easy for him. In English law he can only D me at the moment if I agree to it or if he can prove unreasonable behaviour on my part (which he is looking to do b/c I won't consent to a D). That too is a gamble but again if it ends in a D it will be due to his actions and not mine. Don't get me wrong I am not being sanctimonious about this but I am a firm believer that people can only regret thier own actions and not those of another.

So in essence I am agreeing with all the other posters here but just pointing out that it doesn't always work out the way you might envision it (at least not yet)

[DiDi]

((((((Cat)))))))))

There is nothing I can say that you don't already know or that hasn't been said by those wiser than myself. I'm just compelled to reach out with hugs and support though.

Right now, as you wrote, I don't think he sees that his choices jeopardize his family and a great M. You have *walked through fire* for this marriage and your family. He believes you always will. While that is what we strive for in a healthy R, he seems to be comfortable enough in that knowledge that he avoids making the changes he needs to make.

We know he's lucky ... you love him. Maybe he'll be lucky enough to find that you still do when he is strong enough to look at himself and face what he sees instead of running from it.

He has been hiding from/avoiding pain instead of going through it.

Growing is hard. Fixing mistakes is hard. Change is hard. In order to change, sometimes the pain of remaining the same must be greater than the pain of changing.

Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same.

He chose not to make a choice. You choose to protect the hearts of you and your children. If the man you love-- the man you need him to be--- is in there somewhere, he will fight to find himself, then fight to find his family, then fight to find you. I know you are afraid, mostly for him, that he won't be strong enough to fight. That's what makes you so very brave.

[cat03]

Thanks ACJ, I've also to think of all scenarios: if we end up D, if he ends up realizing he doesn't want me while S, in which case I would've been spared the facade he's put up for so long (plus the lies). I thought to myself "could I begin again piecing with all my heart after all these mess knowing he was talked/convinced into trying again?" No, something needs to happen, and that has to come from him without my insistence.

If after is said and done my H is just not going to be happy with me and just can't love me and can't devote himself as I've devoted myself to him, then perhaps a permanent separation is what needs to happen. Thank you again, I know you want to spare me from a fantasy dream that he will put himself together and come back to me, I realize that that may or may not happen.

people can only regret thier own actions and not those of another

I need to remember that, he has a choice.