then what do I do in regards of the phone (needs to be cut off) money, other matters he's incapable of doing himself which he would do if we were to do it together but otherwise he wouldn't?
I know ow is doing everything in her power to get him back and will jump at the least opportunity to get him, once she gets him she'll never let go and that will be the end for all.
Be not afraid...I will repay you for the years the locusts have eaten Joel2
30something 2kids survivor of S, MLC, A, D I have peace in my heart, at last.
How do you know that would be the "end for all", cat? Do you have no faith whatsoever in the man you married being able to snap out of this self-destruction?
You are expending so much energy trying to keep control of a grown man and sometimes the very best way to make an adult start acting like an adult is to leave them sitting in their crap for a while so it becomes clear to them what the real problem is. THEM!
cat, I haven't read what others have said to this, and I bet they gave great advice, but I've got to chime in here.
I was like your H when I was younger. I kept a relationship going because I felt responsible. I took the girl to a C to get her help. The C called me in the room and told me "you aren't Jesus Christ, you can't save everybody". I needed to hear that. I repeat that to myself when I find myself getting involved with psychotic people and trying to help them. You're H needs to hear it too.
But, and I think this is really important, it's HIS crisis, his decision,his pain. He needs to figure out that he has to fix this or go down with the ship. If he stays with the OW, his life will be hell, but it'll be his choice and he'll deserve it. Even if you want to save him from that, you can't. You're not Jesus Christ either. He has to figure it out and find the strength, for himself.
You have to cut loose (not give up on the M, but detach). Do what you need to do for you. Separate, stop talking to him, separate finances, divide the house, whatever. No maliciousness, no hatered, just taking care of yourself, and the kids. He isn't. You have to. Divorce? If he wants to. It won't destroy you, and you'll be out of the hellish mess he's made of his life. If he gets his act together, finds the strength to do what he knows he has to do, or should know, and you want to be with him, great. But cut loose now. Cut him out. don't be co-dependant. Dont' be an enabler.
You do what is right. Stop helping him. He has to fix this. You can't. Take care of yourself. Be an examle for your kids. Your H isn't a bad man. He is hurting. He wants to please and save and help everyone. He can't. He has to figure this out himself. He has to own his mistakes and learn to move on, find the strength to help the OW the only way he can, by cutting off all contact with her.
For him, he's being blackmailed. There is only one way to deal with blackmail. Come clean and face the consequences. It could be terrible. He could lose his job. Many people have lost their jobs. There are other jobs. Either way, he can't keep going with the OW holding this over his head. And YOU cant' be party to this, helping him drown slowly instead of swimming to shore. You have to detach. Don't enable him to continue, by your actions, his destructive behavior.
I've been in his shoes, in a way. The girl in question claimed to be pregnant. She threatened, and did, tell my friends stories about us. I tried to help her, she tried to manipulate me and use me. I found the strength to cut off all contact with her. It was hard. I felt like an awful person, but it was best for me and for her. Your H has to do this, but can only do it on his own.
Cat, be strong. Just like your H has to find the strength to fix his life, you have to find the strength to detach from him. It's the only way to help you and help yourself and your kids.
cat, I'm praying for you. Find the strength. I'm not saying Divorce. I am saying do what you have to, for both of you, for all of you.
M45, W45,S15, D10, Bomb 10/3/06, Moved back in 11/6/06, finally ILY 9/07 last thread
Cat, I just read everyone elses posts.We seem to all agree. Time for the 2x4s over the head. Detach. Let go. We've been telling you this for a while, now it's become critical. Detach.
Kids. If you have to, explain to the kids that mom and dad are having grown up problems, it has nothing to do with them, they didn't cause it, and they are loved and will always be loved. Dad is sick in a way. It may take him a long time to get better. He is still Dad, still loves them, and is still a good person, just sick and needs to get better. How's that sound.
Whenever I brought up the kids to our MC, he would ignore the question, keeping me,and us focused on us. I bought books on divorce and kids and used them for guidance. Basically, I made myself available for their questions, but didn't share or burden them. I watched for signs of problems, like grades,acting out, that kind of thing, and asked their teachers to watch too. Be an example. Take care of yourself and them. Don't bad mouth dad to them. Don't treat them like friends and tell them your pain, worries etc. But you probably already know all this.
Detach, let go, listen to your friends here.
M45, W45,S15, D10, Bomb 10/3/06, Moved back in 11/6/06, finally ILY 9/07 last thread
Hey sweet girl. I'm going to be brutally honest here and I am so sorry that I feel the need to say this, but I think you are being more destructive to yourself and your children by *allowing* your H to stick around. He is NOT going to help himself and he is NOT going to get through this until HE ENDS UP HAVING TO HELP HIMSELF. Right now, you are being an enabler. You are actually HELPING him to keep up this mess of a life he is living.
I truly know that, deep in your heart, you know that you are kind of making excuses as to why to allow him to stay around.
I really think you need to flat out kick him out and tell him not to come back until he is good and ready to stand up, be the man, husband and father he can be, but until then to keep his mess away from you & the kids.
I hate it that it has come to this, girl, but you have stood & stood by him and he's just allowing you to *help* him to continue to keep doing what he's been doing. He has absolutely NO REASON to change anything right now. I think he needs to hit bottom BY HIMSELF (or w/ OW if need be) and see what he has done to himself & his family and what he has become before he is going to wake up. I honestly don't think he can do this while still in the house and while still having a loving wife "taking care of" him.
Now, all of this is easy for me to say. I am just looking in and I don't have to do the hard work of kicking my H to the curb, but I honestly think you need to do some long, hard thinking. You have been in this mess for a long time; sometimes drama keeps life interesting, but this drama has got to stop. You need to focus on you and the children and making a good life for you guys and that is not going to happen when H continues to behave the way he is.
Me: 38 H: 35 S4, S5, S10 Bomb 01/07 Wanted D - nothing would change his mind Numerous A's prior to D bomb; EA prior/during D bomb Piecing 04/07 Deployed for a year 05/07 Still Piecing 2010 M 11 yrs 05/10
ok ok, so, i detach by... stop telling him we can work it out and stop talking down when he breaks down.
By not reminding him over and over what ow's has done (I remember now how he cried that day before xmas about how awful/terrible she was and this am tells me she's changed)
By letting him seek help on his own, he has his new T who only knows the partial story and has told H "looks like you dont' want to be married", and decide if that is true.
He planned last week to go out for pool w/coworkers, I asked him this am not to go, he says he needs to take a break from all the thinking of this mess and wants to go. Fine.
All my boundaries were broken, I wont make any new until he faces his actions and puts new ones himself (he did say he would change his email, get rid of phone, etc,but..he's said this before.)
Damn it, I am worth more than this, he has shown very little care for me these past 48hrs, I will stop asking him to see who cares more for him, me or ow, his mind is swiss cheese and only sees ow, well, then let that be.
He has asked me what should he do, what do i want him to do but when I tell him he doesn't, he wants to break it off completly but finding it very hard to do so. I have asked him to get her on the phone while i'm listening and tell her there is no D and no S from me. That will be the only thing I'm going to ask from him, he will have to find the strenght to fight for us.
Why was I so blind? well, my little 4yr old and my 9yr old, but you all are right, i'm an enabler and not letting H man up. Thank you all for lifting my head off the fog, I've been closing my eyes tight wishing this away, and it wont happen like this, this is H's fight.
Be not afraid...I will repay you for the years the locusts have eaten Joel2
30something 2kids survivor of S, MLC, A, D I have peace in my heart, at last.
Cat, I know it hurts. You'll be surprised how fast it feels better. The pain changes from and unhealthy wound oozing puss and desease to a clean cut that still hurts but feels OK, like you're going to be strong again.
How do you detach. It's really tricky. You don't have to ask for divorce, or tell him he can have a D if he wants. You don't have to stop loving him. Of course you care about him. Just remember that you can't control him, you can't help him and he can't help you. Maybe that's the key.
Say little, don't talk about R. Almost ignore him. Don't talk about OW. Don't give him advice. Listen to him if you want, but you sure don't have to. If he decides he doesn't want to be married, oh well.
Don't worry about phones, emails, where he goes, who he goes with. It's out of your control. Leave it in God's hands if it helps. Don't ask, don't worry. Spend the time you were worrying doing things for you and the kids.
((((cat)))) The man you knew is gone for now. How would you detach if her were dead? You'd remember the good. You'd have pain but deal with it. You'd take care of your pain, deal with it, process it, and heal. Same thing now.
If the man you knew comes back (and he might) you might not care. That's a risk he is taking. But it doesnt concern you now. You could care less right now about IF he comes back. Move on.
M45, W45,S15, D10, Bomb 10/3/06, Moved back in 11/6/06, finally ILY 9/07 last thread
ok ok, so, i detach by... stop telling him we can work it out and stop talking down when he breaks down.
By not reminding him over and over what ow's has done (I remember now how he cried that day before xmas about how awful/terrible she was and this am tells me she's changed)
By letting him seek help on his own, he has his new T who only knows the partial story and has told H "looks like you dont' want to be married", and decide if that is true.
He planned last week to go out for pool w/coworkers, I asked him this am not to go, he says he needs to take a break from all the thinking of this mess and wants to go. Fine.
All my boundaries were broken, I wont make any new until he faces his actions and puts new ones himself (he did say he would change his email, get rid of phone, etc,but..he's said this before.)
Damn it, I am worth more than this, he has shown very little care for me these past 48hrs, I will stop asking him to see who cares more for him, me or ow, his mind is swiss cheese and only sees ow, well, then let that be.
He has asked me what should he do, what do i want him to do but when I tell him he doesn't, he wants to break it off completly but finding it very hard to do so. I have asked him to get her on the phone while i'm listening and tell her there is no D and no S from me. That will be the only thing I'm going to ask from him, he will have to find the strenght to fight for us.
Why was I so blind? well, my little 4yr old and my 9yr old, but you all are right, i'm an enabler and not letting H man up. Thank you all for lifting my head off the fog, I've been closing my eyes tight wishing this away, and it wont happen like this, this is H's fight.
Cat, I've been following your threads for some time now, and I want to tell you how much I admire you. How generous you have been to others even when you're 'in extremis' yourself, how strong you are in your faith and in your person, how well you look after your family -- your children and your husband. Someone not as strong as you are would have folded a long time ago.
So here are my thoughts on your sitch, FWIW. I'm thinking 'shock & awe'. I'm thinking that if you have a family living out of state, or at least out of the city, this is the time to take your children and go there. This is what families are for, and what 'home' is for. Home is the place that when you need to go there, they need to take you in.
I'm thinking 'legal separation', with/for distribution of the assets of the marriage. Not divorce, because you don't want divorce. You can download the legal separation forms from many online sources, do a google. You can do a legal separation related to financial matters (but not to children) without a lawyer, this keeps alienation between the marriage partners to a minimum, in fact you can demonstrate great generosity and sensitivity towards your spouse if you do the legal separation agreement yourself.
It will be a lot of work to re-establish yourself and your children, but this seems to me like a better use of your considerable energies than what you are doing now. Cutting H loose to look after his own affairs seems to me like the fastest way for this sorry script to end. After he gets himself clean he can come and start to court you all over again. Hopefully for H, you will still be available.
