I totally agree with you and my decision was going to be to NOT bring up any 'relationship' counseling. The only thing I need to be working on is me. Not our 'relationship', me.
No time tonight. Have my kids. Cannot say tonight Frank.
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Amy, I totally agree with you and my decision was going to be to NOT bring up any 'relationship' counseling. The only thing I need to be working on is me. Not our 'relationship', me.
No time tonight. Have my kids. Cannot say tonight Frank.
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Amy, I totally agree with you and my decision was going to be to NOT bring up any 'relationship' counseling. The only thing I need to be working on is me. Not our 'relationship', me.
Sorry folks, but no dice here. I do not agree.
More tomorrow.
Why did you post if you have nothing to say?
Here is more of MY thoughts. By working on 'me' I am working also on how we will communicate, how we interact. That will improve our 'relationship' as a side effect. It's also doing something 'different' than I have ever done before. Not trying to fix it. Not taking care of other peoples needs before my own.
By saying "let's go to Retrovaille" that's pulling her to do what she has stated she does NOT want to do - be a 'wife', save the marriage. And, as another friend pointed out, if we DID go I'd most likely go back to FIXING and nothing would be accomplished.
No, the best course right NOW is for me to just stay out of her way while she 'flys'. Be nice, friendly, coordial, caring but STAY OUT of her world. It will do nothing but hurt me, draw me in to 'fixing' and 'hope' when right now my energy needs to be on fixing all the other damage to my life, financial and spiritual, so I can create a safe environment again, for me, my kids, and even my wife.
I am already spending too much time thinking and talking about her. Not healthy or productive.
Most of the women I have talked to who I trust, have said the same thing: Save yourself FIRST, be decent, coordial, friendly when you feel like it. Do not DB. Unplug from the emotional connection.
I went a little too far with the 'detaching' last week because it was more like 'dark' and it was a STRATEGY. I need to just go with the flow, trust in God and deal with my own feelings and fears.
She is 'shut off' from me. Trust me, I feel it. Whether or not it's 'permanent' is unknown. If we look at the past, she has pursued her 'new life' but as she hits roadblocks, she falls down and eventually crashes.
Maybe she will, maybe not. Either way, as reality creeps into her life she has to face hard decisions - alone. Just like I have had to. But remember, she said "I DO NOT WANT TO BE A WIFE ANY MORE".
Until SHE changes her mind, if ever, asking her to go to relationship counseling is against DB principles.
Loving her unconditionally is not. That I can do - at a distance for now. I need to love me and get myself disconnected from her before it pulls me down.
And just to add, W is out to 'dinner' with her recently single friend who had a bad breakup. She's also 40-ish and was one of the people who thought W was crazy when she had the affair. She likes me but I don't think she knows the situation. It's after 9pm now and they aren't home.
Am I stressing? Very little. Why? Because it is showing me her 'true colors'. Right now it's all about her. And if her friend doesn't have the courage to let her know that her marriage is more important than anything else, having a man like me is a blessing then she is as weak as I think she is, and the words she said to me 2 years ago about that very topic are meaningless.
Which reaffirms to me the moral vacancy in all of them.
Still detaching. My kids are home now and we're going to play some games.
When she comes home I'm not going to say anything. Just going to be neutral. Going with the flow... Let God handle it.
I have confidence that you are the best judge of how to deal with your own wife. However, I do not like for there to be misconceptions of what Retrouvaille is. It is not counseling, and should not be thought of as counseling. It is leadership by example.
Couples who have been through the misery stage of marriage and who have healed themselves lead by telling their stories. Their open, honest, heart-felt confessions of what they did and how they felt during their awful times speak to you in a way that nothing else can. Then they ask each person to write in a journal the answers to questions about themselves and their lives. It is 2 days of introspection and meditation. After answering each question in the journal, you exchange journals with your spouse and discuss what you have written. This process leads to greater understanding between the spouses. And from this better communication grows. Both spouses are reminded of some simple rules of writing to keep everything fair. You write only about yourself, not the other person, and a few other rules that keep the journals from being antagonistic.
There is no speaking in public about your problems and there is no third party listening in on your talks. You are alone with your spouse talking about your lives.
I can tell you from my experience at Retrouvaille. If you are looking for God, he is there, helping those who are helping themselves.
You make a good point. Perhaps your wife will be more open to this later on, when she has tried and failed to trap another man into being her breadwinner. Right now OM might just be enjoying the ego boost of being wanted by a 2nd woman. When he finds out that she is trying to unseat his wife and insert herself in her place, he may have to let your wife down gently. And at that time she may realize that even a broken husband is better than no husband. Especially if he is making strides to not be broken anymore.
So store the idea away. Maybe this is something that could be helpful to you later. I went to a Retrouvaille gathering of volunteers last night, and was touched by the loving interaction between the partners. These were all couples who were on the verge of divorce and then healed their marriages, and now they are volunteering to pass the gift of healing along by helping with the local Retrouvaille program. My husband and I were proud to be in that room.
I can tell you from my experience at Retrouvaille. If you are looking for God, he is there, helping those who are helping themselves.
I wasn't putting it down, I think it's a good thing and would love it if we could go.
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You make a good point. Perhaps your wife will be more open to this later on, when she has tried and failed to trap another man into being her breadwinner. Right now OM might just be enjoying the ego boost of being wanted by a 2nd woman. When he finds out that she is trying to unseat his wife and insert herself in her place, he may have to let your wife down gently. And at that time she may realize that even a broken husband is better than no husband. Especially if he is making strides to not be broken anymore.
Yes, thank you for that observation.
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So store the idea away. Maybe this is something that could be helpful to you later. I went to a Retrouvaille gathering of volunteers last night, and was touched by the loving interaction between the partners. These were all couples who were on the verge of divorce and then healed their marriages, and now they are volunteering to pass the gift of healing along by helping with the local Retrouvaille program. My husband and I were proud to be in that room.
I posted b/c you asked a question and it would have been rude not to say that I read the question but could not answer it just then.
Your post cleared it up for me. You said in earlier posts that you were only focusing on YOU and NOT the R. That you were not going to DB any longer. You implied DB = 'fixing'.
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The only thing I need to be working on is me. Not our 'relationship', me.
Now you say R improvement is a "side effect" and that your "detaching" went a little too far. And you say "unconditional love".
But...
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Most of the women I have talked to who I trust, have said the same thing: Save yourself FIRST, be decent, coordial, friendly when you feel like it. Do not DB. Unplug from the emotional connection.
I don't agree with all of that but overall what you just posted is an okay course of action until you figure it out. I will not confuse things further right now.
W came home around 10pm. Her and her friend went to a Greek restaurant where her friend was a 'regular' for years. Had fun, ate, danced a little. But, here friend said the place wasn't 'like it used to be'. She came home happy and had to tell me all about it in detail. Seemed like just a 'fun' girls night out.
D17's boyfriend decided to break up with her last night. Took about 2 hours, till midnight or so. As he was leaving he started talking to me about his reasons, his confusion in life as to what he wants and how he needs to feel like his life and his relationships are meaningful. We ended up talking for about 1/2 hour and I think he just needed to know that he wasn't a bad person for feeling the way he does. He cares for D17 but is, well, 17.
Having that talk really made me feel good. I like the kid and a couple months ago I think he was afraid of me or at the least thought I was crazy. Now he's able to respect me, and reach out to me. That was cool.
