Just bought a 1 way non-refundable ticket to Dtown

[Yoyowife]

It's amazing how they can make us a bundle of nerves, isn't it?

[ntl]

Yeah, you could be right.

W told me that they never fight though, they just dont love each other. He is scheduled to move out of her house and either back to Vegas or Texas on the 15th.

She told me she wishes him the best and that she doesnt plan on contacting him ever again.

So far, no contact from W today, usually she will have sent me an IM by now.

Getting nervous.

Don't get nervous! It's a trick your brain is playing on you to drive you crazy.

I am pulling for you and hope that this relationship with OM is over for good. Hopefully she's starting to realize that there is no perfect relationship and that even when you're not fighting doesn't mean you're loving.

You sound like a great guy who's willing to do a lot to save his marriage. That takes courage, fortitude, and a deep, deep love.

ntl

[Hurtin4certain]

Its been a while since I posted, Im kind of sitting back and seeing how my sitch materializes.

Today W came over to my house and made dinner for D and I. Very nice!

OM is still living with her but it seems like they are doing their own seperate things. Its weird, because now when I see my W, I dont know if I want her. She seems "tarnished" to me now.

Dont get me wrong, I love her with all my heart, but after what she's done, I dont know how much respect I have for her. I am cordial to her and show her affection but sometimes I wonder if it would just be easier to start over with someone new and have that sacred aspect to a relationship.

W is still initiating almost all contact so I think she's genuine, but I know I cant really try to reconcile until OM is gone for good. I would feel like a sucker if I pursued W while she is living with OM.

On another note, I start my new job on Thursday. Yet another change in my life! Getting nervous!

H4C

[NoCodeBlues]

H4C,

I know just what you mean about their being "tarnished". I have been asking myself a lot of questions about whether I can get past the well-earned distrust I have for my W. Yes, I do still love her -- but is that love strong enough?

The flip side of that is that I ask myself, even if I do love my W enough to get past the hurt and distrust, should I? I mean, would I be a fool to try to reconcile with my W given that she is capable of this treachery -- am I opening myself up to another fall?

My head and my heart are still trying to sort this out.

[LL44]

Good luck at your new job!!! Hopefully January 08 will end on lots of good notes.

I agree, sometimes I also think "Do I want this person back? This person that is capable of so much hurt?" My answer right now is yes, but its hard.

[ntl]

Good luck at your new job!!! Hopefully January 08 will end on lots of good notes.

I agree, sometimes I also think "Do I want this person back? This person that is capable of so much hurt?" My answer right now is yes, but its hard.

I'm right there with all of you on whether I should even take H back after all the treachery, lies, deceit, and sliminess. I sometimes wonder if I have a spine or not.

It's a low, low feeling.

Regards,

ntl

[SirPrizeMe]

People more than anything need redemption, rebuilding, rehabilitation. No person is "untarnished", everyone has flaws. No relationship is "perfect" and untarnished either. if you think you have an untarnished relationship, it hasn't been tested yet.

H4C, it sounds like your wife is starting to realize the value of family, of commitments she's already made.

This is a test for you. Are you up to the test? Now is not the time to go weak-kneed. Now is the time to stand for marriage.

That does not mean, "take her back at any cost" and it does not mean "allow that person to come back, no questions asked." Surely there are conditions you must place here. there are discussions you need to have. At the same time there are no guarantees. Vows can be broken, even renewed vows.

You have to figure out what you need to believe that she is a changed person, that she will honor and protect your feelings and trust. What sign from her, or from your R, would bring you to that point?

What things did she do, or not do, before, that you can look back on, and identify as a red flag? Did she shy away at intimate moments? Hide her cellphone bills? Snap at you for no reason? and so on. Was she unwilling to go to MC with you? etc. what changes would you have to see, in order to believe?

I really like the DR book on this topic - it advises us to set out really small concrete goals, and watch progress step-by-step. Maybe re-read the relevant sections.

You have to be willing to gamble with your feelings again. and it's a long road back as you can see from stories in the "piecing" forum. Trust does not grow back instantaneously. But it just might be worth it.

[ntl]

People more than anything need redemption, rebuilding, rehabilitation. No person is "untarnished", everyone has flaws. No relationship is "perfect" and untarnished either. if you think you have an untarnished relationship, it hasn't been tested yet.

Great points, here. I think this is what keeps me going.

Regards,

ntl

[SirPrizeMe]

Let me just add.... I had the same feelings about a "tarnished relationship" in the beginning, when I first found out about the betrayal. But I have since changed my thinking on that.

I had placed all my trust in my wife, and while I recognized she was only human, and I accepted her "faults" in my heart - they were not really faults at all in my mind, just part of who she was, just part of the package that was her - anyway while I accepted that she was human and also that I myself was human and had faults, I held our relationship up high. I believed in love, in our relationship, in commitment. I believed in all those things and knew in my heart that those good things were what life was worth living for, those things were true and constant and would always be with me. Those things would make the good times better - vacations, cooking in the kitchen, ballgames with the kids - and they'd make the tough times which were sure to come, bearable - a car accident, an untimely death in the family, disease, the loss of a business, one of our kids getting pregnant, or whatever life was going to throw at us. I knew, deep down knew, that we'd be together, our commitment was unshakable.

But then the betrayal, and the realization that our relationship was in crisis, and ... oh, that was tough.

Whoops! Where was I?? oh yeah, my point was that seeing my grief over the loss of the "perfect relationship", was very hard on my wife. I talked to her a lot about it. About my pain. In retrospect, it was very hard on her. Honesty is good, but in the right way, in the right time. All that honesty was too much for her, at that time, I think. Seeing what it did to me, ... it launched her into a depression I think, that she is not yet out of, maybe not yet even admitting.

I wish now, that I had been stronger then. I wish now that I had protected her feelings more, at that time. I wish now that I had thought less about myself - how hurt I was, how betrayed I felt - and more about us together. If I had been more gentle on our relationship, more careful. If I had thought about *her* a little more, in those early days, maybe I would have been able to be stronger for her, less obviously hurt, more stable for her. The irony is, she was hurt too, and she needed me to be strong for her, even if I was hurt. But I was a wailing baby.

I don't feel guilty about it, it's just that.. in retrospect, my hurt got magnified in her. On the other hand, for some couples, it's the honest realization of the hurt that the WAS caused, that brings them back in. There are no "right" answers.

But the way I look at it: in the end, redemption of another human soul, is maybe the dest d4mn thing I could do with my time on this earth. Relationships are important, and the tarnish is just a sign of their value over time.

[ntl]

Let me just add.... I had the same feelings about a "tarnished relationship" in the beginning, when I first found out about the betrayal. But I have since changed my thinking on that.

I had placed all my trust in my wife, and while I recognized she was only human, and I accepted her "faults" in my heart - they were not really faults at all in my mind, just part of who she was, just part of the package that was her - anyway while I accepted that she was human and also that I myself was human and had faults, I held our relationship up high. I believed in love, in our relationship, in commitment. I believed in all those things and knew in my heart that those good things were what life was worth living for, those things were true and constant and would always be with me. Those things would make the good times better - vacations, cooking in the kitchen, ballgames with the kids - and they'd make the tough times which were sure to come, bearable - a car accident, an untimely death in the family, disease, the loss of a business, one of our kids getting pregnant, or whatever life was going to throw at us. I knew, deep down knew, that we'd be together, our commitment was unshakable.

But then the betrayal, and the realization that our relationship was in crisis, and ... oh, that was tough.

Whoops! Where was I?? oh yeah, my point was that seeing my grief over the loss of the "perfect relationship", was very hard on my wife. I talked to her a lot about it. About my pain. In retrospect, it was very hard on her. Honesty is good, but in the right way, in the right time. All that honesty was too much for her, at that time, I think. Seeing what it did to me, ... it launched her into a depression I think, that she is not yet out of, maybe not yet even admitting.

I wish now, that I had been stronger then. I wish now that I had protected her feelings more, at that time. I wish now that I had thought less about myself - how hurt I was, how betrayed I felt - and more about us together. If I had been more gentle on our relationship, more careful. If I had thought about *her* a little more, in those early days, maybe I would have been able to be stronger for her, less obviously hurt, more stable for her. The irony is, she was hurt too, and she needed me to be strong for her, even if I was hurt. But I was a wailing baby.

I don't feel guilty about it, it's just that.. in retrospect, my hurt got magnified in her. On the other hand, for some couples, it's the honest realization of the hurt that the WAS caused, that brings them back in. There are no "right" answers.

But the way I look at it: in the end, redemption of another human soul, is maybe the dest d4mn thing I could do with my time on this earth. Relationships are important, and the tarnish is just a sign of their value over time.

Woooaaahhhh. That was beautiful. And it totally resonates with me and what I am going through. I often wonder if the affair my H had was a lousy attempt at him calling and crying out for help with his deeply shameful addiction.

He needed love and hope and shared vision and all I could give him was anger, despair, and that look of deep, deep hurt.

Thank you for your post. It is so poignant. Your wife is a lucky woman and you are a lucky man.

Regards,

ntl