One More Night

[Ohio_Mark]

mark, is this an IC therapist for you, or one you hope will be a mc/family therapist?

I am looking for an IC for the boys. I am carefully screening therapists, looking for one that is "marriage-focused."

did you get a good feel for her (yes, even though you had to miss a good chunk of the game)?

Yes. I found a winner. Whether the wife agrees that she is the one is subject to question. Most things that I do lately have been either untimely, inadequate, or inappropriate. I'm wrong an awful lot.... And I don't care about missing the game. My time was well spent.

as for your wife's response...well, who knows, really. how did she say she didn't believe you? I can see that 2 different ways...the first way is the straight out, I don't believe its a therapist on the phone. the other way is simply that she doesn't believe you actually have the nerve to think therapy is going to change anything.

She thought it was a girlfriend. This is what has me scratching my head. You would think that she would be happy. She's been wanting me to reach the point of "acceptance." Why isn't she rejoicing that I have arrived?

[Ohio_Mark]

Mark,

So I didn't pursue this any further. Tomorrow morning, I will ask her, "What was all that about last night? Didn't you get the email from your dad?"

I think you need to do this.

I read Rob's earlier post. It seems that not discussing the relationship is important in the LRT and in the early stages of the affair to help you detach and not put pressure on WAS. In your case, and perhaps mine, not discussing the relationship may be harmful. It's almost like we are being seen as aloof or in denial. It confirms their image us of as not wanting to deal with the lack of communication in the marriage.

--Theoden

This morning, I didn't bring the subject up. I sensed some lingering anger from her (still fuzzy about that one). When the time is right (when we are alone), I will ask her about it.

I am genuinely confused about why she would be so dismissive of my discussion with a therapist for the kids. Equally confused if she were correct and it was, in fact, my girlfriend...

[Rob1231]

Hi Mark, There you go again, looking for logic and reason from a crazy person! I know your wife has told you time and again that she's through, that she's outta there - but she's still at home isn't she? As my therapist once told me: Someone who is 100% sure they are moving on and there is no hope - will pull the trigger and move out.

All I can say is, I heard all of that too - but somewhere deep down, some part of my wife was still clinging to the possibility that things would work out between us. Now, I fully realize that this was more a 'cover your a$$' deal than having real hope - but you know what? It doesn't matter! As long as there's that tiny crack in the armor, you have the chance to worm your way in there and make it wider. In the meantime, disregard half of what she does and everything she says, and stick to the program.

BTW, I'm not a Buckeye fan either - went to Purdue. The wailing and gnashing of teeth today is going to be pretty entertaining.

[SallyM]

you say you are confused about her not willing to discuss the therapist for the kids. I guess I missed where you had the discussion about the therapist...sounds like she walked in and you were already on the phone with one, no discussion at all, just here she is, wanna meet her?

mark, here's a different way to look at it. maybe she is mad that you didn't talk to her about it first? I would think looking for an ic for the kids would be something you would do together, you know? seems to me you took the reins without talking to her about it. even if she didn't want to be part of the process and thinks therapy for them is a waste of time, I think it would have been a good thing to have given her that chance to say no first.

I guess what I would do is sit down and have a talk with her about that. about the woman you found...no accusations, just wanting to do the best thing for the kids. if you are going to meet with this ic in person before the boys do, invite her along.

just a thought.

[Heartbroken]

Mark,

I agree with Rob - as long as there is any sign of doubt you still have a chance. My H was adament about D yet he would not go file - he wanted to do that together WTH??? They are not 100% sure or they would just up and file and start the process. My H says he was never 100% gone just tried to act like it and if I would have given up on him we would be done vs. where we are at today. I doubt your W will be able to explain her own reasoning b/c she doesn't truly get herself either...they are in their own world of pain - something I would not wish on my own worst enemy.... Yes they chose this path to some extent but I do no believe they can see the way out or they think they have messed things up so bad it would be easier to just start over without their OP or their spouse....

Just my .02

HB

[saffie]

Mark,

You said in an earlier post that communication between yourself and W had been poor for a while.

You talked to FIL about some things when you were with him.

IL's send email about counselling to you and W.

W upset you have a C on the phone.

You know, I can sort of see why your W would be upset and take what was probably just a cheap shot about an OW at you. You talked to her relations about the situation and she KNOWS that because they, in trying to be fair and above board, email you both, and then WITHOUT DISCUSSING it she finds a C on the phone to you when she didn't expect it and doesn't know who they are.

Your W presumably doesn't know exactly what was discussed with the IL's and that you are just trying to keep them informed but not bias them. She probably feels you are invading her support network and starting to do things behind her back.

Several people on these boards have commented on the LACK of communication between you and your W and that effective communication is very important. Perhaps at the moment your children would benefit more from you and your W spending money on how to communicate effectively rather than on therapists for them. Seems to me you will be paying someone to clear up the mess created by your W's and your lack of communication skills, but at the same time are not learning how to stop creating more mess. I know the children will in all probability need some help coping with this but isn't it better to try and PREVENT future damage or at least try to limit it, (by working on your W and yourself with someone), rather than wait for it to happen and then clear it up?

I say this not as a criticism but just as an observation. Nobody is a mind reader and effective communication is critical in minimising damge - even if it is communication that leads to D. The better the communication the easier it will be for ALL concerned.

[Ohio_Mark]

you say you are confused about her not willing to discuss the therapist for the kids. I guess I missed where you had the discussion about the therapist...sounds like she walked in and you were already on the phone with one, no discussion at all, just here she is, wanna meet her?

mark, here's a different way to look at it. maybe she is mad that you didn't talk to her about it first? I would think looking for an ic for the kids would be something you would do together, you know? seems to me you took the reins without talking to her about it. even if she didn't want to be part of the process and thinks therapy for them is a waste of time, I think it would have been a good thing to have given her that chance to say no first.

I guess what I would do is sit down and have a talk with her about that. about the woman you found...no accusations, just wanting to do the best thing for the kids. if you are going to meet with this ic in person before the boys do, invite her along.

just a thought.

Well, Sally gets the gold star. This is exactly why she was mad. She told me so this morning. Now, on the one hand, I had one initial discussion with one therapist. Nothing more, and I see nothing at all wrong with that. On the other hand, I should have discussed it with her first. I can see how both ways are OK. Regardless, I told her I was sorry that I spoke to the therapist, and I will talk to her first the next time. She seemed OK with this (though frustrated that it happened).

Oh, and the therapist told me that she can't do anything until after we tell the boys we are getting a divorce. If we take them, they will stare at her and ask, "Uh... why am I here?" So we can't move on it now anyway.

[Ohio_Mark]

You know, I can sort of see why your W would be upset and take what was probably just a cheap shot about an OW at you.

It was not a cheap shot. She thinks I am cheating on her. She even had dates and locations for my vacation with my girlfriend (Shrek's wife).

She probably feels you are invading her support network and starting to do things behind her back.

The word "probably" is not needed. It's absolutely the case.

Several people on these boards have commented on the LACK of communication between you and your W and that effective communication is very important. Perhaps at the moment your children would benefit more from you and your W spending money on how to communicate effectively rather than on therapists for them. Seems to me you will be paying someone to clear up the mess created by your W's and your lack of communication skills, but at the same time are not learning how to stop creating more mess.

I completely agree. I am looking for a counselor for all four of us.

I say this not as a criticism but just as an observation. Nobody is a mind reader and effective communication is critical in minimising damge - even if it is communication that leads to D. The better the communication the easier it will be for ALL concerned.

Saffie, I agree with you. And I appreciate you taking the time to help me.

[saffie]

((((((HUGS))))))) Mark.

I just wish your W would meet you half way.

[SallyM]

is there any chance this therapist would be willing to meet with you and your w first mark? work on some communication issues you guys have, then if/when d does happen, she can shift to the boys? or is that a conflict?