Disclaimer: This is in NO way to be construed as an "excuse" for your asinine choice in April.
IC, until you are able to accept that you are HUMAN -- and are able to be (to a reasonable degree) both accepting and forgiving of your own f*ckups (sexual or otherwise) AND put in place sensible safeguards to lessen the possibility of them occuring in the first place per SG's advice -- you will not be a good partner.
Remorse, regret, desire to amend ... all good. But the perpetual and extravagant welding of a hairshirt to your carcass is not. It's no more balanced or fun to live with that than a guy who would do the opposite: blow something like this off completely and/or blame his wife.
Don't you dare put Miss IC in the position of trying to stuff her anger and feel *sorry* for you because you've melted down into a little puddle of guilt. It's ultimately a selfish emotion.
You are not Superman. You never were. Trying to be superhuman is a fool's game and always will be.
((((Miss IC)))) -- this sucks.
Saffie has it right ... there are no guarantees, and also I agree with SG: it could happen to anyone, given the right circumstances. Again, totally not excusing it .... but IC is no more uniquely flawed than he is uniquely unflawed.
You are the only one who can decide what you can live with. My only advice is to do nothing in haste.
My best to you both.
"Show me a completely smooth operation and I'll show you someone who's covering mistakes. Real boats rock." -- Frank Herbert
Ok, fair assumption and I'm not going to dispute you...I can't. My intentions where not to relieve my anxieties and contrary to what my actions define...I have a tremendous love for my wife and to stop from seeing her being eaten alive by her anxiety, IMO, I had to reveal the root cause of it. Yes it hurt her, yes I was wrong, yes I did this and that blah, blah blah... The truth remains the same....I did it and I can't change that. Am I remorseful? Yes, and not the old line "remorseful that it was discovered" I knew it was wrong beforehand, I knew it was wrong as it was occuring, remorseful enough to leave right in the middle of it....it doesn't change a thing! I did it and I'm to blame. And whatever Miss IC decides, I'll have to live and respect that decision. LFL, what is it you want to hear from me? I'm not upset....I'm lost!
I don't want to hear anything in particular from you. You asked a question so I answered it. Look, I'm no better than you. I'm lost myself. Maybe you just need to spend more time examining why you are so lost to begin with? It didn't happen because of the A, it most likely led to the A. Until you figure that out, your W has no reason to trust you. Sorry.
Remorse, regret, desire to amend ... all good. But the perpetual and extravagant welding of a hairshirt to your carcass is not. It's no more balanced or fun to live with that than a guy who would do the opposite: blow something like this off completely and/or blame his wife.
Don't you dare put Miss IC in the position of trying to stuff her anger and feel *sorry* for you because you've melted down into a little puddle of guilt. It's ultimately a selfish emotion.
Kett, I can only talk a minute. I'm sorry if my post came across as me trying to put Miss IC in a position to stuff her anger and feel sorry for me. Am I guilty?...tough one there : But am I trying to play the guilt and sorrow card? I hope not, not my intentions and I'll watch how I word things. Thanks.
Please clarify on this... I'm not defending IC, but these attraction killers?...other than this latest of course. Yes I made the analogy of the little girl in the wagon...but no, I'm not a child and I don't feel that way.
Women have a hard enough time staying focused on themself and working on their own half of the equation allready, so No, I wont be clarifying here.
For ex, as soon as I said to SG that I agreed about something in LFL's sitch she and others (not all) immediately went back to ...How do we fix Mr. LFL. Its amazing. There is a school in switzerland that teaches men sex. Its run by women of course, so I know its possible for a woman to be able to step past her own insecurities and deal with a sexually repressed/suppressed/immature man. Assuming he wants to be dominated based on zero info, is just a silly as assuming he wants to engage in rape fantasies. I think a good first step would be just talking about fantasy's. LFL could easily start that by talking about hers. (to him, not on here.)Scary stuff.
I would be happy to talk to IC by email, at some point. Its in my profile. Im honestly not real worried that he wont be able to address it, as soon as he sees it. While the flirting is mentionable, Its not about the flirting. It takes two to flirt. any woman on here could have easily have said to IC, 'what you are doing makes me uncomfortable. Please stop.' and implemented their own boundary.
It works quite well. Ive done it more then once here, to clearly draw the lines in the sand, becasue untill IC got here I was probably the biggest flirt.
with the exception of the odd troll, everyone here is quite respectful, and understanding. I dont recollect seeing anyone do that with IC, who now claims to be bothered by it. Interesting that it comes up now.
Hang in there IC. when it rains it pours. Put on your gear, and get ready to get wet.
Don't you dare put Miss IC in the position of trying to stuff her anger and feel *sorry* for you because you've melted down into a little puddle of guilt. It's ultimately a selfish emotion.
This sounds familiar to me, i.e. "oh no, I've been caught, I need to be MORE MERCILESS to myself than she can be, so that instead of being angry with me, she'll be so distracted at the beating I'm giving myself, that she'll end up comforting me." I don't know if IC is doing this, but the possibility that he is doing it, well, it makes me a little uncomfortable inside my own skin while reading this thread. IC, answer all questions, take the consequences of your actions like a man, and get ready (if MrsIC allows you) to rebuild trust one brick at a time.
And, by the way, this:
Quote:
I knew it was wrong beforehand, I knew it was wrong as it was occuring, remorseful enough to leave right in the middle of it
rings my BS bell, big time. Sorry dude, but I'm feeling especially cynical right now about everything, not just you.
Hang in there IC. when it rains it pours. Put on your gear, and get ready to get wet.
Whether you curl up in a puddle and feel miserable, or climb in the crows nest and scream at the hurricane like Captain Dan, or just continue doing your job unperturbed, is not going to affect the storm.
Women have a hard enough time staying focused on themself and working on their own half of the equation allready, so No, I wont be clarifying here.
For ex, as soon as I said to SG that I agreed about something in LFL's sitch she and others (not all) immediately went back to ...How do we fix Mr. LFL. Its amazing.
Yeah blackfoot, gotta be careful not to overextend our feeble little minds. I really do appreciate the concern. *friendly smile*
But indulge my feebleness for just a minute and tell me where I tried to "fix" MrLFL? I don't happen to think he needs fixing. I recall asking about where he directed his sexual impulses. How's that "fixing" anyone?
I know, I know ... so tedious for the superior and all-encompassing male mind... but I'm sure you can find it in your wide heart to stoop to our level and humor me if you search long enough.
Sorry Southern Girl, this will never be looked back upon by me as a small incident. What I did goes against everything that I believe in. I've shattered Miss IC's trust in me and I've pretty much shattered a trust in myself. I lived with a deep pain from my dad for 20+ years....and I did nothing wrong! I didn't cause that pain. Now look at the pain....and I AM the cause - this will NEVER be small for me and it will NEVER go away.
Cut the melodrama down a bit, dear. I'm hearing from MissIC that you're there for her, and answering her questions as she needs. That's means you're doing the best you can do. That's really all you can do. Beating yourself up takes the focus off her, and for once it is all about her.
"oh no, I've been caught, I need to be MORE MERCILESS to myself than she can be, so that instead of being angry with me, she'll be so distracted at the beating I'm giving myself, that she'll end up comforting me."
To clarify, I wasn't necessarily accusing IC of doing this *deliberately*. It can be done subconsciously. Also, my perception of IC is that he is of the 'gotta be a man', bulletproof perfectionist persuasion, his self-deprecating humor notwithstanding. Any kind of perfectionist will be inclined to have truly spectacular guilt meltdowns when faced with their frailties. I speak from experience.
The Guilt Meltdown is certainly ickier when deliberate, but just as irritating to one's partner regardless, and I just wanted him to be aware of that. Right now, it's just not about *his* emotions, even if the predominant emotion is guilt.
And wallowing in anything just takes away mental and emotional energy from any positive steps toward rebuilding.
The sooner he stuffs that suit of armor in the recycle bin and reinvests in some nice barbed wire to build a fence around himself AND Miss IC, the less likely a repeat offense will become. Honestly, if I was in Miss IC's position .... I *imagine* that I would still be just about as pissed about the cancer diagnosis withholding as by the ONS. Different sides of the same coin.
"Show me a completely smooth operation and I'll show you someone who's covering mistakes. Real boats rock." -- Frank Herbert
To clarify, I wasn't necessarily accusing IC of doing this *deliberately*.
Oh, I know that, Kett. I'm not accusing him of this, either...just aware that it is possible. And, to clarify further, I have done the "Guilt Meltdown" and, until it was pointed out to me, wasn't even aware of the effect it had. Now that I do know it, I try hard to stay away from that bad habit.
But am I trying to play the guilt and sorrow card? I hope not, not my intentions and I'll watch how I word things. Thanks.