Plank removed from eye, too late for WAW? 9

[Heimlich]

Limbo/Atlas,
Thanks. I'm not exactly sure, why, all of a sudden, W feels compelled to share her feelings about me with me again. Maybe she does sense me moving on and is trying to pull me back. I don't know. I'm just tired of trying to interpret her actions and conversations. As OT once said, until she says "I'd like to talk about our R" we don't have a R. She was angry two weeks ago when I didn't answer when I was out and she wanted me to watch the girls (this after I has asked her 4 hours earlier if she wanted me to watch them for her and she had said no).

And, really, I've gotten nothing from her since I moved out. Some kindnesses, which I've reciprocated, but no real friendship or conversation other than very rarely.

Before saying what I'm about to say, I would prefer that we reconcile. The door is open if she wants to look inside. However.

I just can't live my life on the assumption that we will, which includes missing opportunities to meet other people -- including women, without becoming bitter should we ever reconcile.

I think the point might be that since W isn't in a place yet to recognize what she did to contribute to the demise of the R, that you have to put all your stuff on hold, in DB world. I know you're looking for her to see her part, and to see how you've changed.

Yes, that would be nice, but I know it's not going to come -- per the standard WAW contract of blaming all on the H The thing is, I believe you or others have pointed this out, I've pretty much identified at least the major areas of my role in this. So I know even without her saying it.

The way I figure it is if she never comes around, never wants to give the R another chance (and "never" is something only you can define---could be by next week), then you're free to tell her all this stuff without worrying that it'll push her away. But in the meantime you button it and hope to entice her back with the new you.

Today, I find myself ambivalent, given the person she's been to me -- someone she has to talk to as the father of her children. Part of me wants to do this, part of me says it just doesn't matter.

I know W ambushed you with her talk, but it would've been interesting to see how she'd responded (maybe not immediately) if you had only listened and not thrown your own stuff in.

Me too.

Though part of me thinks she's just so wrapped up in her own anger, which I think she's using as a shield against the pain of all of this or as justification (who knows). If she admists that I've become a better, not perfect, but better person, what does that make her? So, I'm the bad guy. Fine.

Have you had any more thoughts about revisiting that night when you lost it?

I think about this now and again. Not to trivialize, but I think it boils down to just that -- I just lost it. She piled pain and pain and pain on top of each other with each revelation and I literally snapped. I think we all have some line beyond which we're pushed, we don't know what we'll do. I reached mine that night, and crossed it for a few minutes, that night. I'll regret that until the day I die.


ST,

that's why I say they are emotionally sick. I really feel your w is not herself yet. someday she's going to look back at have a different view of everything.

In many ways, she is herself. But she is holding onto the anger and resentment very hard. It seems to be close to the surface. Maybe she will one day look back and see the good in our R (and there was a lot of good in our R, more good than bad). As of now, she interprets the most harmless thought or behavior on my part in the most negative way. Sick of it. For me, I need to remove myself from that.

I understand your point, and I can't force my views on anyone. And because I look at it at a christian viewpoint, my whole belief is that if you have faith in God, he will restore your M.

I don't want you to think that I thought (whew) you were forcing your opinions on me. It's a viewpoint that I understand, but don't have. I forgave her A. I've forgiven the pain she's caused me. I've done my best since last Oct to be better than I was (not always successfully and with a number of backslides)). I'm still open to beginning another R with my W. However, as of now, she's STXW.

I kept my ring on for over half a year and I didn't feel stupid at all.

That's awesome. I'm 8 months into this (actually about 10 if you cound when my W says she realized how she felt but kept allowing me to think things were getting better). Funny thing, a couple of weeks ago, I went through some emails my W and I had exchanged both before she began her A in July of 06 and then again in early 07 to see if I missed anything. Nothing. Some where flirty. Some were practical. Some were from her, some from me. Lots of ILY, from both of us, in there. Both times she did this, I thought our R was improving after having been through some tough times. Show's what I know.

and I don't doubt that your a good man.

Thank you.

you definitely need to move on as yourself....-not move on to another R- as I mentioned before, and allow the door to be open.

I'm not looking to move to another R, but I'm not avoiding it either. Looking for a date, not a R, if that makes any sense. As I've mentioned, the door is, and will be open, for a while longer. I've known for a while that one day I would wake up and that door would be shut. I'm not there yet, but that day is getting closer. The reality of my life is that I'm a single dad headed towards D because my W doesn't think she can ever fall in love with me again, partially, I'm almost positive, because she is seeing or is considering seeing OM again. I'm just going to be the best me that I can be. Maybe she'll come back, maybe she won't. Maybe I'll meet, date, and fall in love with someone else before then. Maybe not. I don't know. That's what tomorrow is for. We'll find those things out.

PUddle,

Sounds like you're reaching that point, Heim, at least regarding feeling like you've done what you can. You could have a fantastic life for years and years, without any outside romantic interest in the picture, and still be open to W's return. Or you might decide one day you're open to someone else and test the waters (the date).

I agree. However, maybe I'm niave, but I don't see how going on a date, or series of dates, with one or more folks means that the door is shut on reconciliation. I've thought about this, but can't a date just be that, a date? Not an interview for a future spouse? Just a plain ol' good time with someone?

ST

Obviously she still has a lot of resentment from how she was hurt in the past. She still is trying to put blame on you and can't see her own faults. or perhaps, the more she tries to put the blame on you and find blame on you, the less she needs to look at her own faults.

like puddle said, duck's back. But maybe it might be time to do something different. ? would it be a 180 to give her constructive criticism? or to stand up for yourself?

just wondering. I know DBing it to let things go most of the time, but for some, doing a 180 might mean doing the exact opposite of DBing

As I alluded to earlier, there's a lot of truth, I think, in your first point. As far as talking to her, offering constructive criticism, she doesn't want to hear it from me. Thing is, I think most of our problems are communication problems. She doesn't agree.

All I can do is be as kind and sympathetic and helpful to her as we co-parent our children. I offer to be there if she needs help with anything, but she doesn't want it (van needed to have brakes fixed, offered to drive her to work, she said already done). She knows I'll help her, all she has to do is ask. For now, it's not worth pushing.

I think there might be a time next year, when I sit down and just think about talking to her one final time, but I just don't think she'll hear it. We'll see.

W brought over teacher gifts for the girls to bring to school today. She also brought over a Christmas present for me, from the girls (which I didn't expect, got nothing for my bday). She had a look on her face like, "bet you didn't get anything for me and you'll be scrambling tomorrow". She had that sort of look about her.) I think she'll be surprised when I drop off the wrapped presents from the girls for her (printed off 20 or so photos of the girls and they each did a collage and put them in a frame).

Anyway, back to work. Had to get this out of my head.

BD