Amy, just recently you have responded to me and others about giving it up, all of the frustrations, all of the hopeless feelings that nothing is working, to Him. You said some beautiful things and some tough things. You have gone through trials that are hard and it could get a lot worse before things get really good. You are tired and hurt that you haven't received a warm response to the work that you are doing. Especially during the holidays it hurts. And your D doesnt know it or won't admit it but she needs at least one parent to prove that hope is not false. There is no such thing as false hope. It is simply hope.
Amy, you precious woman, how close could you be to the finish line and not even know it?
Edit - I have to add that I was rereading more and more posts that you are getting about the impact you have on others here on this board and it is incredible. How do you know that God is still not working on you or on Jeff and that you still have work to do? How many people are going to reconcile eventually because you inspired them? You are a blessing. Thank you for what you have done!
Last edited by missmyfriend; 12/14/0705:45 AM.
Me:56, W:51 D:26,S:24,S:22 Married:18 Bomb 9/27/06 Separated 11/27/06 Divorced 10/6/08 Leaving it up to God
There will always be a place for you here, whether you're standing, or not, or just being AmyC.
You posted to me once about "Filibuster" when I was truly in my hour of need. Your post could not have been more timely or to the exact point that I was contemplating, my doubts.
It brought me to my knees in tears, not because I was sad, afraid, or angry that I wasn't seeing what I wanted to happen soon enough, but because I was denying the truth. I was being called to stand, and I was fighting it out of resentment and anger. Thank you for being His instrument.
You've asked us not to try to change your mind. I will respect that, as much as I don't want to.
Because I know that you must be hurting right now, I'd like to share something with you that my aunt shared with me when I began this. I hope that it is timely.
For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,
That he would grant you according to the riches of his glory to be strengthened by his Spirit in the inner man;
That Christ may dwell in your heart by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
May be able to comprehend with all saints what IS the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
And to know the love of Christ, which surpasseth knowledge, that you might be filled with all the fullness of God.
Now unto him that is able to do exceedingly abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that worketh in us,
Unto him BE glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen
Ephesians 3, 14-21
Thank you for all you have done for me, and all of us here.
These are my friends now!
But someday baby... You ain't worry my life anymore
Take away, take away what I don't need, save the good part please. Fade away, fade away.
I can't say it as well as some of the others, and dufus homor isn't really called for, but there is no doubt that there will always be room for AmyC here. I can't think of anyone who has helped so many people, selflessly, and often with little thanks. I think of Emily, no one else connected with her like you did. I've no idea how that turned out (probably not as she wanted), but she was a better person for having known you. The woman who so badly wanted to have a fling with an old flame, was that crazedmom? And so many others, down to jab in just the last two weeks. No, AmyC, you belong here. Maybe you won't succeed with Jeff (though I still think it could happen, standing down might be just what you need to do), but even so, you are still an inspiration, and an example of the good things that can happen.
If you have to leave, I think everyone will understand, but leave knowing that there are a lot of people here that love you!
Your D12 is rebeling against you and wants nothing to do with you? Welcome to teenage girl interacting with her mom land.
Amen, my d16 does all kinds of things to try to create a confrontation between W and myself. I have to keep stopping myself from getting sucked into the 'drama'. It can be a challenge!
Quote:
You have always done your damnedest Amy, which is a damn sight more than most.
I agree with Frank, you should share this with Jeff.
The reason I agree with this (well, because it was my idea and you agree with me... )
is because you need to stop this 'game'. Amy hangs out with Jeff, we smooch, we tease, then we cool down.
What is that all about?
Look, here is the way I see it:
Jeff , like me, has a lot of hurt , anxiety, etc. So he chooses to medicate. Bad idea but he doesn't know what else to do. Really.
His W (AmyC) has basically not been supportive, and I don't mean 'Oh Jeff, your life is soooo hard.'
I mean when he was 'down' we all know that Amy, (and MY w) avoided the situation, or nagged on him, and eventually bailed and ran to OM. Then Amy and my W told us how we were 'so last week' and how OM was 'the soulmate'.
Yeah, that hurts. How do I trust my W after that. How does Jeff trust Amy? How does any of the LBS's trust the WAS?
Well, it's simple. We don't. We feel like we are all alone. In many cases WE are the ones who came to this website. WE are the ones who made the effort. It sucks. We feel like we've put out 'enough'. When will THEY do something?
Well, maybe we need to define what THEY can do. I think they can tell use we are not alone. Not by saying it, but by doing what needed to be done months / years ago. A year ago my wife said to me "I'm ready to be your wife again. I want to be 'mom' and lover and companion again. I'm sorry I hurt you so much, and I want to fix our broken life"
She held me, and I have to say at that BEFORE point I was ready to 'let her go'. I was. It surprised me, it made a difference.
Still, I didn't believe her. I was hurt and - to be truthful - this was something I didn't believe she could do.
But her SINCERITY, and her willingness to open her heart, to tell me that she was going to let the past go, to let the future be written now, well that made an impact on me. I listened, I trusted, and still, I 'sat on the sidelines' waiting for 'proof'. I 'waited' for her to 'show me'. I waited. And Waited.
After a month or so, well, she didn't. She was waiting for ME to prove I was 'the man'.
It took some counseling to figure out that we both had our own barriers.
We also sat down and made our 'list' of 'dont's'.
We talked about each one, like "don't drink when you are sad,' Don't yell at me because I don't understand computers', and others. Instead, come to me for hugs and love!"
After a YEAR I finally felt comfortable about this and told her recently that I NEED this : I said to her "Please pay attention to me. Give me 10 hugs per day, like we did when we didn't have children. Help me to feel like I am important to YOU."
It took me that long to 'get it'.
Perhaps the WAS is in the difficult position of being the one who has to put forth the strength to be vulnerable and healing. After all, in many cases, the LBS really didn't address their own issues, they were just TRYING TO SURVIVE. And the WAS was one of the sources of their pain. If the LBS (Jeff, me) already had a lot of trust and safety issues then the WAS who is returning is in a situation where they have to carry a lot of the burden of healing.
The LBS put their life on hold. Stopped dealing with their own issues, so they could deal with the bad situation they found themselves in.
I'm not saying that those of you, the WAS's, should 'appease' the LBS's who are still a mess. Especially if they are men. What I'm saying is this: Please start holding them up, calling them on their issues in a caring way, as in 'Man, I understand how you fell so overwhelmed each day and having a few drinks gives you that calm feeling.' and asking this question: 'What else could we do together to get out of that sh*tty place, where you drink, or are withdrawn or whatever, cause I know you really don't feel good the next day?' I know, let's .....
And DO it. Or, if you know (like my w has finally learned) that they are a 'prickly pear' then GRAB them LOVE them. Believe me, a withdrawn man or woman can't stop you when you tickle them.
Or if you go and, um.....
So hey, my life isn't perfect. However one thing I can say I know is true. Being completely honest, to the point where you feel that what you WANT may not be what THEY want, yet saying it out loud, is the best choice.
Why? Because if you STILL do not say what you mean, what you want, you are still 'fixing'.
Does that help or does it forestall the inevitable?
I don't know.
This is for Amy. My friend, I truly believe that Jeff loves you. I do. He doesn't love Jeff. He would prefer the bottle to facing why he doesn't love Jeff. Trust me, I know.
Yet, if you 'throw yourself' at him it will be uncomfortable. I know how that felt to me. If, however you are totally straight with him, and (if this is your truth) you say, "Jeff, whether or not I am never your wife again, and you are never my husband, I need you to know that I didn't support you when you needed me, and I hurt you in so many ways that I can't count them. I've learned my lesson, and I know what matters in my life, and it's you. If you want me, I'm ready to be your wife forever. I love you and I'll never stop"
If that's what you want, a wife who will love you and never, ever leave you alone again, then please let me be that woman.
And leave it at that. If he says nothing, then 'act as if' you are that woman. If he says 'no', then you have your answer.
Let him know he is not alone. Tell him that I know how he feels. He can call me any time if he needs to talk to another man.
Your D12 is rebeling against you and wants nothing to do with you? Welcome to teenage girl interacting with her mom land.
Amen, my d16 does all kinds of things to try to create a confrontation between W and myself. I have to keep stopping myself from getting sucked into the 'drama'. It can be a challenge!
Quote:
You have always done your damnedest Amy, which is a damn sight more than most.
I agree with Frank, you should share this with Jeff.
The reason I agree with this (well, because it was my idea and you agree with me... )
is because you need to stop this 'game'. Amy hangs out with Jeff, we smooch, we tease, then we cool down.
What is that all about?
Look, here is the way I see it:
Jeff , like me, has a lot of hurt , anxiety, etc. So he chooses to medicate. Bad idea but he doesn't know what else to do. Really.
His W (AmyC) has basically not been supportive, and I don't mean 'Oh Jeff, your life is soooo hard.'
I mean when he was 'down' we all know that Amy, (and MY w) avoided the situation, or nagged on him, and eventually bailed and ran to OM. Then Amy and my W told us how we were 'so last week' and how OM was 'the soulmate'.
Yeah, that hurts. How do I trust my W after that. How does Jeff trust Amy? How does any of the LBS's trust the WAS?
Well, it's simple. We don't. We feel like we are all alone. In many cases WE are the ones who came to this website. WE are the ones who made the effort. It sucks. We feel like we've put out 'enough'. When will THEY do something?
Well, maybe we need to define what THEY can do. I think they can tell use we are not alone. Not by saying it, but by doing what needed to be done months / years ago. A year ago my wife said to me "I'm ready to be your wife again. I want to be 'mom' and lover and companion again. I'm sorry I hurt you so much, and I want to fix our broken life"
She held me, and I have to say at that BEFORE point I was ready to 'let her go'. I was. It surprised me, it made a difference.
Still, I didn't believe her. I was hurt and - to be truthful - this was something I didn't believe she could do.
But her SINCERITY, and her willingness to open her heart, to tell me that she was going to let the past go, to let the future be written now, well that made an impact on me. I listened, I trusted, and still, I 'sat on the sidelines' waiting for 'proof'. I 'waited' for her to 'show me'. I waited. And Waited.
After a month or so, well, she didn't. She was waiting for ME to prove I was 'the man'.
It took some counseling to figure out that we both had our own barriers.
We also sat down and made our 'list' of 'dont's'.
We talked about each one, like "don't drink when you are sad,' Don't yell at me because I don't understand computers', and others. Instead, come to me for hugs and love!"
After a YEAR I finally felt comfortable about this and told her recently that I NEED this : I said to her "Please pay attention to me. Give me 10 hugs per day, like we did when we didn't have children. Help me to feel like I am important to YOU."
It took me that long to 'get it'.
Perhaps the WAS is in the difficult position of being the one who has to put forth the strength to be vulnerable and healing. After all, in many cases, the LBS really didn't address their own issues, they were just TRYING TO SURVIVE. And the WAS was one of the sources of their pain. If the LBS (Jeff, me) already had a lot of trust and safety issues then the WAS who is returning is in a situation where they have to carry a lot of the burden of healing.
The LBS put their life on hold. Stopped dealing with their own issues, so they could deal with the bad situation they found themselves in.
I'm not saying that those of you, the WAS's, should 'appease' the LBS's who are still a mess. Especially if they are men. What I'm saying is this: Please start holding them up, calling them on their issues in a caring way, as in 'Man, I understand how you fell so overwhelmed each day and having a few drinks gives you that calm feeling.' and asking this question: 'What else could we do together to get out of that sh*tty place, where you drink, or are withdrawn or whatever, cause I know you really don't feel good the next day?' I know, let's .....
And DO it. Or, if you know (like my w has finally learned) that they are a 'prickly pear' then GRAB them LOVE them. Believe me, a withdrawn man or woman can't stop you when you tickle them.
Or if you go and, um.....
So hey, my life isn't perfect. However one thing I can say I know is true. Being completely honest, to the point where you feel that what you WANT may not be what THEY want, yet saying it out loud, is the best choice.
Why? Because if you STILL do not say what you mean, what you want, you are still 'fixing'.
Does that help or does it forestall the inevitable?
I don't know.
This is for Amy. My friend, I truly believe that Jeff loves you. I do. He doesn't love Jeff. He would prefer the bottle to facing why he doesn't love Jeff. Trust me, I know.
Yet, if you 'throw yourself' at him it will be uncomfortable. I know how that felt to me. If, however you are totally straight with him, and (if this is your truth) you say, "Jeff, whether or not I am never your wife again, and you are never my husband, I need you to know that I didn't support you when you needed me, and I hurt you in so many ways that I can't count them. I've learned my lesson, and I know what matters in my life, and it's you. If you want me, I'm ready to be your wife forever. I love you and I'll never stop"
If that's what you want, a wife who will love you and never, ever leave you alone again, then please let me be that woman.
And leave it at that. If he says nothing, then 'act as if' you are that woman. If he says 'no', then you have your answer.
Let him know he is not alone. Tell him that I know how he feels. He can call me any time if he needs to talk to another man.
Your friend, frank
Frank, thank you for the time and care that you put into that post. I read it the following day but I have had to chew on it for a while. I am still chewing. I can't really respond or anything else right now but I want you to know I read it and I appreciate it. You are a good friend.
I will not be making anymore posts regarding my situation for the time being.
I will also not be making any far reaching decisions.
That said, I am also not playing this tap-dancing one minute-pussy-footing the next bullsh*t anymore. I am not treating that man with kid gloves for another minute. I know the man that he is - he's the one that stood for more than 2-years while I had lost my damn mind. It's high time for him to find that man again and if to get that accomplished I have to walk all the way away, so be it. I can't stand to see him like this anymore. It fosters the spirit of guilt in me and I can't take it anymore. I have done MORE than enough to right the wrongs. From now on it's back to basics and I don't mean the basics of divorce busting. I mean survival of the fittest.
That said, I am also not playing this tap-dancing one minute-pussy-footing the next bullsh*t anymore. I am not treating that man with kid gloves for another minute. I know the man that he is - he's the one that stood for more than 2-years while I had lost my damn mind. It's high time for him to find that man again and if to get that accomplished I have to walk all the way away, so be it. I can't stand to see him like this anymore. It fosters the spirit of guilt in me and I can't take it anymore. I have done MORE than enough to right the wrongs. From now on it's back to basics and I don't mean the basics of divorce busting. I mean survival of the fittest.
Yes. If you continue to treat him with 'kid gloves' then you're not treating him like a man, are you?
However, I know that you know that taking 'off' the 'kid gloves' doesn't mean putting on the boxing gloves.
It just means treating him with respect, and holding him to his word. supporting while also being the 'cheerleader' when crappy things happen, and the the general friend who knows when to back off, and when to speak.
Like I said, if he needs another man to talk at who has been where he's been he can call me.
If you continue to treat him with 'kid gloves' then you're not treating him like a man, are you?
However, I know that you know that taking 'off' the 'kid gloves' doesn't mean putting on the boxing gloves.
It just means treating him with respect, and holding him to his word. supporting while also being the 'cheerleader' when crappy things happen, and the the general friend who knows when to back off, and when to speak
Yep. I know that Frank.
It means being a helpmate. But no longer an enabler.
)