karen et al., I copied this post from member Julie a few years ago. It's full of good analysis and information. This looks like a good place to insert it into the convo: (Julie was LD-er than her H)
QUOTE:
Julie's thread
One of my first ‘experiments’ was to analyze my own sex drive. I did this by following my own thought processes leading up to a moment when I felt like initiating sex with H. (I must thank Corri for first making this suggestion to me). It wasn’t easy being brutally honest with myself, but I knew I had to do it. I found that I would initiate sex for various reasons: 1. I was horny. 2. I was feeling good about myself/us and wanted to share that with him and make a connection. 3. I was feeling shaky about us and wanted to restore the connection, and feel better by having him ML to me. 4. I was feeling needy and I wanted to see if I could get him interested, for the challenge of it, and for an ego boost. 5. I was feeling like I needed to measure up. The whole world is having sex, I need to do it too.
Doing this exercise helped me in many ways. First off, I could see that one of the reasons H initiated sex a lot less than me was because, in his book, reason 1 is the only good reason to initiate sex. I also found that I am actually physically horny about once a month (a lot LESS than him). Reason 2 is a good enough reason to initiate sex, but there are better ways (from his viewpoint) of making the connection. Reasons 3-5 are crappy reasons to initiate sex. Once I sorted through the physical and emotional aspects of my sex drive, I was able to tone down my anxiety, self-soothe better and communicate better. As a result of this, my sex drive seems to actually be lower because I no longer initiate under situations 3-5. I now work through those feelings in other ways. I think that #3 can justifiably be a good reason, but I have decided that it is not the case in our situation, that I need to self-soothe through those feelings and restore the connection in other ways before I look for the sexual connection.
Okay, now I’m starting to repeat myself, so I’ll move on.
One thing that always confused me was the fact that when asked, H would say that he would like to have sex once or twice a week, but he could and would go for months without. When I pressed him further (there are details in my very first thread, I think), he would say that he didn’t enjoy the emotional shenanigans associated with sex. H is a very giving person by nature, and has always been a skilled and considerate lover. He didn’t know how to selfishly take or ask for what he wanted. For the longest time, I just didn’t get this.
When it finally hit me, I decided to try an experiment where I tried to experience sex as a purely physical experience myself. It turned out that I enjoy it too – but not if it is the only kind of sex we are having. The obvious solution is to mix it up and that is what we do now. We have some quickies, we have some emotionally connected sessions and we have some raunchy ones. It depends on both our moods, and he is very considerate of my feelings on this. It seems rather obvious now, but H and I were both sexually immature and inexperienced, so it took a lot of work for us to get to this point. If I am actually horny, I make it a point to let him know because he waits rather eagerly for that “Allrighty, lets go, baby”.
What else? Another major issue for me was self-esteem. I am a successful professional, and have always been a bit of an over-achiever. But when it came to my appearance, I’ve never been too confident. I was a chubby kid growing up. Not fat, and certainly not obese, but never slender. Call it unfair social expectations, or what have you, but I grew up feeling slightly invisible physically. When I met H and fell head over heels in love with him, and realized that he worshipped my body, it was a sort of relief. Who cared if the world didn’t think I was beautiful? He certainly does. So when the sex started becoming scarce and he started to reject me, there was a little girl inside who was crushed.
I’ve had to let her grow up, and hold myself accountable for how I look and feel. I still have some weight to lose, but I don’t let that affect my sexual confidence or how I feel about myself.
There are other things that were at play, relationship-wise, and I had to work on those aspects as well. However, I think working on my sexuality has been very helpful. H has remarked more than once that ‘that book’ (I don’t he realizes that I’ve read more than one!) has helped me discover my own sexuality.
I wish erections were the issue. It is the man they are or aren't attached to that is the problem. He has had some mild issues but does not seem to suffer from primary erectile dysfunction & could always get it up and keep it up when it came to making the babies that he had wanted for so long EVEN when he was tired, stressed or not that into it. I have never demanded a certain type of sex - that would be him. None or woman on top or a nice bj - thats it.
RJ,
Vacation was a bust. It was because the babies got so sick - upper respiratory, pink eye, ear infection. H indicated that he had been expecting to get lucky but then again I couldn't really tell because it isn't as if he was rubbing up on me in the kitchen or passing out lingering kisses along the way. He merely said something in response to someone's question like - Well, I'm ok with not having any more (kids) but not with not having ANY more. The kids were up all night, in our bed etc...
I only have sanity and priority because there has been so much tragedy around me lately. This year I have had so many friends and work associates become critically ill, die etc... Two of them were in their late 30's, never married, no kids. They never had a chance for half the blessings that I have enjoyed. Who am I to b!tch?
I've always had a strange theory about the multiply married. By multiple I don't mean just twice. People who marry, divorce or lose their spouse and remarry are kinda the norm. People who marry three, four and more times fascinate me. First, I figure they must really have it going on that Mr/Mrs number four thinks that it will work out. Second, it is kinda unfair for one person to make their way through so many people (tying up the potential dating pool). Maybe the truth is that it isn't that I have such an even keel. Maybe I'm just afraid to be in the boat of getting married a third or fourth time if I were to dump H. I like to think I would just date and not get remarried but I am a monogamous girl. Sure, Mr. Big Guns was entertaining looking and we might have had a nice time together but if I can't demonstrate restraint to my children who can???
I wish erections were the issue. It is the man they are or aren't attached to that is the problem. He has had some mild issues but does not seem to suffer from primary erectile dysfunction & could always get it up and keep it up when it came to making the babies that he had wanted for so long EVEN when he was tired, stressed or not that into it. I have never demanded a certain type of sex - that would be him. None or woman on top or a nice bj - thats it.
RJ,
Vacation was a bust. It was because the babies got so sick - upper respiratory, pink eye, ear infection. H indicated that he had been expecting to get lucky but then again I couldn't really tell because it isn't as if he was rubbing up on me in the kitchen or passing out lingering kisses along the way. He merely said something in response to someone's question like - Well, I'm ok with not having any more (kids) but not with not having ANY more. The kids were up all night, in our bed etc...
I only have sanity and priority because there has been so much tragedy around me lately. This year I have had so many friends and work associates become critically ill, die etc... Two of them were in their late 30's, never married, no kids. They never had a chance for half the blessings that I have enjoyed. Who am I to b!tch?
I've always had a strange theory about the multiply married. By multiple I don't mean just twice. People who marry, divorce or lose their spouse and remarry are kinda the norm. People who marry three, four and more times fascinate me. First, I figure they must really have it going on that Mr/Mrs number four thinks that it will work out. Second, it is kinda unfair for one person to make their way through so many people (tying up the potential dating pool). Maybe the truth is that it isn't that I have such an even keel. Maybe I'm just afraid to be in the boat of getting married a third or fourth time if I were to dump H. I like to think I would just date and not get remarried but I am a monogamous girl. Sure, Mr. Big Guns was entertaining looking and we might have had a nice time together but if I can't demonstrate restraint to my children who can???
Where did we get the idea that being monogamous with one person for many years is a better thing than having several partners over the course of a life? I don't mean this facetiously. Why does staying with one partner in spite of everything demonstrate "restraint"?
Why does staying with one partner in spite of everything demonstrate "restraint"?
Err... if "restraint" == "self control", then I would say that would be a textbook example of "self control". ie: "your body's hormones are telling you 'go screw everything in sight cause you havent gotten any in a year, but you choose to 'control yourself' and not do what your body is urging you to do."
As for your other question, of it being "better":
I'd say there are multiple reasons why it COULD be better, to be monogamous. but it's not automatically better. To keep this post short and skip over the individual reasons... I'd say it's better at a 10,000ft view, when you are in a monogamous relationship where both people care about each other more than they do anyone else, and they also see to each others needs over anyone else's.
If, on the other hand, you are in a "monogamous" relationship, where one or both partners put others before their partner, or cheat... then I dont think it is better.
My current status: june 2006. Wife ran out and filed D. Finalized Jan 11, 2010, after 12.5 years M. 3 wonderful sons caught in the middle
Aren't you getting your stories mixed up? I thought MrsNop tossed a plate. It was Linda Blair in "The Exorcist" who tossed pea soup.
Technically, Hairdog, you are right, it was a plate...but there were peas on the plate.
from the archives: Quote MrsNOP: The infamous foodfilled plate-throwing incident occurred well after we had started on the path to recovery and would still be considered relatively recent history.
Yup, I did a search of MrsNOP, peas and plate. Nothing like some nostalgic food throwing to get you in the mood for the holidays!
BTW, I clearly remember the split pea soup incident when I was a little girl. I remember thinking it was such a self defeating thing to do, because in the end, my mother cleaned it up. But the message got through: it was my father's favorite kind of soup, and he obviously didn't get it that nite. Every now and then, he'd get it in a restaurant( I don't remember her making it at home again), and he'd joke to her, " You want to toss this one too?" Ah, the good old days.
Where did we get the idea that being monogamous with one person for many years is a better thing than having several partners over the course of a life?
Dom, this was my question. I agree that monogamy is best while you're with someone (i.e., I'm not in favor of affairs or open marriage). My serious question was why is it better to have one partner over the course of several decades than to have three or four partners over the course of several decades (while being monogamous in each relationship while you're in it)?
When marriage was for having children only to help with the farm or the business, and life spans were shorter than today, having one partner in a lifetime made more sense. My grandmother had 10 children over a 40 year period. Her youngest, my aunt, is only three years older than I am.
Why is this categorically better than marrying at age 25, raising three children for 20 years, and then changing partners at age 45-50?
